TCB

[nycsurfer530]

TJ, i'm 5'10" 160lbs. I typically wear 38 for most things. Barns T-shirt i wear a large but most american brand t-shirts i wear either small or medium depending on the fit of the t-shirt .

[heavydoom]

i want to ask this again, so here it goes :  will tcb webshop sell the tcb50 jacket in the duck version sans the leather patch?   i sure hope so.    

[mrman]

Ok, an update. Things started to move forward once I reported an issue with the transaction with PayPal this morning. Inoue did refund very fast, but my losses are still considerable: I paid 205€/230$ for the jacket including shipping, 79€/89$ customs fees, 25€/28$ for shipping the jacket back and 13€/15$ PayPal fees for receiving the refund from Inoue. All in all the net amount I received after deducting the different fees from the jacket price Inoue refunded was 88€/99$ (205-(79+25+13)). So I received only 42% of the jacket price back, the rest I paid from my own pocket with nothing to show for myself. And all this because Inoue's sizing info did not correspond with the actual product, so the base problem was not on my part.

 

I had first thought about a custom order but asked Inoue to provide the normal lineup measurements for sizes 44 and 46. After receiving them I got the impression that a custom order was not necessary, that size 44 would be the ticket. I never got to know if the measurements themselves were incorrect or if the jacket that I received was made too small. But the measurements I have provided in this thread should be taken with a grain of salt.

 

Another strange thing is that we had initially agreed that he would replace the jacket with a correct sized one. After a while he sent me pictures, a video in fact, where he showed that the finished product had correct measurements by measuring it with a measuring tape. After that started the stalling, he would send it next week, he was out of town and send it the following week and then finally radio silence. Today when he refunded he stated that the jacket did not have correct measurements and that's why he could not send it. What happened to the jacket in the video where I could see with my own eyes that the measurements were correct? Did he send it by accident or on purpose to another customer? Well, that I will never know, but really strange nonetheless. It seems that he is overwhelmed with the current amount of work, he is expanding his business too hard and should get help to handle the correspondence and shipping. Otherwise there will be more and more unhappy customers like myself.

 

All in all, this was a very costly lesson for me and something I will most likely not repeat. His products maybe beautiful but working with him is too much hit-and-miss to go there again. As I said there are happy (old?) customers, but still I can only give this advice: think twice, no three times, before ordering from him.

Edited September 15, 2016 by mrman

[Iron Horse]

That sucks; I'm a newer customer (got the Ranchman and asked Inoue to make seamen's shorts for me) and my experience was fine, so I don't think it's just the regulars that got good service.

[mondo]

Getting the size right has to be a priority if you're making clothes..  I was all set to get some TCB 60s, so visited the only two shops in Australia (as far as I know) to try some on — a rarity for me, as I usually buy denim online from people who have noped out of their purchase for whatever reason.  I'm a 33 in just about everything.. Sugar Cane, Samurai, Momotaro; I have a couple of Flat Heads in 34.

 

So.. at the store selling the one-wash 60s, they had a 33 but were out of 34s.  I could fit into the 33 fairly well, but the cut was not that flattering — tight across hips and crotch, loose everywhere else.  I decided to see what raw options were available at the other store.

 

There, they had raw 33 and 34.. so, I was in luck.  Both of these would have to be roomier than a one-wash 33, yes?  Nope, the 34 was tighter across the crotch and thigh area than the one-wash 33, which should have started off an inch smaller and then shrunk by another inch or two in the wash process.  There wasn't a 36 for me to try.  But I shouldn't have to try to shoehorn myself into pants that ought to be the same general dimensions as a dozen other pairs I've worn, anyway.  The store owner's opinion: "Yeah, nah, the way those fit you now.. uh..  you're not going to be able to wash those.."

 

Now, I don't mind if a cut is just not for me — but there seems to be a fundamental inconsistency in the measurements of TCB clothing.  I don't know if each store gets its own limited batch, and each of those varies depending on who-knows-what...

 

Ah, well.  I wanted to like them, especially after following these threads for so long.  The fabric and details are nice, but that's the case with all my jeans, most of which look pretty good on.  I ended up busting out some Momotaro 0901s I had stashed away; they'll do me.

[volvo240thebest]

Getting the size right has to be a priority if you're making clothes..  I was all set to get some TCB 60s, so visited the only two shops in Australia (as far as I know) to try some on — a rarity for me, as I usually buy denim online from people who have noped out of their purchase for whatever reason.  I'm a 33 in just about everything.. Sugar Cane, Samurai, Momotaro; I have a couple of Flat Heads in 34.

 

So.. at the store selling the one-wash 60s, they had a 33 but were out of 34s.  I could fit into the 33 fairly well, but the cut was not that flattering — tight across hips and crotch, loose everywhere else.  I decided to see what raw options were available at the other store.

 

There, they had raw 33 and 34.. so, I was in luck.  Both of these would have to be roomier than a one-wash 33, yes?  Nope, the 34 was tighter across the crotch and thigh area than the one-wash 33, which should have started off an inch smaller and then shrunk by another inch or two in the wash process.  There wasn't a 36 for me to try.  But I shouldn't have to try to shoehorn myself into pants that ought to be the same general dimensions as a dozen other pairs I've worn, anyway.  The store owner's opinion: "Yeah, nah, the way those fit you now.. uh..  you're not going to be able to wash those.."

 

Now, I don't mind if a cut is just not for me — but there seems to be a fundamental inconsistency in the measurements of TCB clothing.  I don't know if each store gets its own limited batch, and each of those varies depending on who-knows-what...

 

Ah, well.  I wanted to like them, especially after following these threads for so long.  The fabric and details are nice, but that's the case with all my jeans, most of which look pretty good on.  I ended up busting out some Momotaro 0901s I had stashed away; they'll do me.

 

there must be a bit of hit and mess, but honestly speaking my direct experience with TCB and measurements has always been fine. I have two pairs of 60's in the same size, first one bought shortly after the band was born (2012?), second one received in april or may 2016 as part of the TCB contest prize. after wash and wear they are identical and they measure exactly what Hajime states in his website, even if I accidentally threw the first pair in a 90 degrees C boil wash. I must be lucky.

[mondo]

I still haven't written TCB off, as there's plenty of evidence of great, worn-in garments.. but something's amiss, at least here in Sydney.  Neither store has seen much movement on their TCB stock, and it's discounted in both — so it seems unlikely they'll be ordering again.  I'd say now would be a great time to order from overseas (with the $AUD at US 75c or so), but the tagged size seems only tangentially related to the actual dimensions.  I'm sure either place would be happy to measure up an individual pair, though, if you know exactly what works for you in TCB-land!

[mrman]

I shot SoaS an e-mail and asked their measurements for 50s jacket in size 44. They only carry raw and for size 44:

sleeve length 70.5cm

shoulder width 47cm

chest 55cm

length 71,5cm

 

They are even smaller than the measurements than the jacket I received, especially widthwise, also in raw:

sleeve length 68cm

shoulder width 50cm

chest 56 cm

length 70cm

 

But the washed jacket has these measurements according to Inoue and TCB online shop:

sleeve length 66cm

shoulder width 50cm

chest 58cm

length 67cm

 

The one washed has bigger measurements than raw! And not just in one jacket but seems to be common. Just what mondo said above. I don't know what is the reason for this inconsistency but makes you wonder.

[beautiful_FrEaK]

Great! You guys making me insecure as hell now

[heavydoom]

i panicked also when i got my first pair of 60 jeans one wash.  it was very tight in the crotch area and the waist and i ordered a size 36 although i wear size 33/34.  the jeans have since stretched out.  listen, i always order my jeans bigger than usual.  does it sound and looks strange?  i really don't give a fuck what others think.  it's how i feel once i am wearing the jeans.  there are just some denim purists out there that think everything has to fit perfectly down to the nearest centimeters!!!

 

i got the tcb50 jacket a bit oversized.  did i get mad?  nah....i just shrunk the fuck out of the jacket and now it fits like a glove

[volvo240thebest]

first day of proper boots and jacket weather!

[Broark]

Envious, can't wait until I can wear my 50's jacket again!

[holio cornolio]

Ok, an update. Things started to move forward once I reported an issue with the transaction with PayPal this morning. Inoue did refund very fast, but my losses are still considerable: I paid 205€/230$ for the jacket including shipping, 79€/89$ customs fees, 25€/28$ for shipping the jacket back and 13€/15$ PayPal fees for receiving the refund from Inoue. All in all the net amount I received after deducting the different fees from the jacket price Inoue refunded was 88€/99$ (205-(79+25+13)). So I received only 42% of the jacket price back, the rest I paid from my own pocket with nothing to show for myself. And all this because Inoue's sizing info did not correspond with the actual product, so the base problem was not on my part.

 

I had first thought about a custom order but asked Inoue to provide the normal lineup measurements for sizes 44 and 46. After receiving them I got the impression that a custom order was not necessary, that size 44 would be the ticket. I never got to know if the measurements themselves were incorrect or if the jacket that I received was made too small. But the measurements I have provided in this thread should be taken with a grain of salt.

 

Another strange thing is that we had initially agreed that he would replace the jacket with a correct sized one. After a while he sent me pictures, a video in fact, where he showed that the finished product had correct measurements by measuring it with a measuring tape. After that started the stalling, he would send it next week, he was out of town and send it the following week and then finally radio silence. Today when he refunded he stated that the jacket did not have correct measurements and that's why he could not send it. What happened to the jacket in the video where I could see with my own eyes that the measurements were correct? Did he send it by accident or on purpose to another customer? Well, that I will never know, but really strange nonetheless. It seems that he is overwhelmed with the current amount of work, he is expanding his business too hard and should get help to handle the correspondence and shipping. Otherwise there will be more and more unhappy customers like myself.

 

All in all, this was a very costly lesson for me and something I will most likely not repeat. His products maybe beautiful but working with him is too much hit-and-miss to go there again. As I said there are happy (old?) customers, but still I can only give this advice: think twice, no three times, before ordering from him.

Depending on where you are, if you can demonstrate that you've returned the garment, customs fees should also be recoverable. It's a ballache, but I don't see that you can blame TCB for those costs. You decided to be the importer, so you took on the responsibility for the cost of importing. If you'd bought from a more local retailer (online or brick and mortar) then you wouldn't have that ballache to contend with. I'm sorry, that sounds like I'm criticising or chiding you and I'm not meaning to. It truly blows that you're down so heavily on a purchase that didn't work out. I totally understand that your pissed off about it, as I would be in your position, but it is one of the risks of buying online, albeit a well calculated one in your case. Talk to the company that delivered your jacket. There should be a process for recovering the duty and tax paid on returned items. Good luck.

Edited September 15, 2016 by holio cornolio

[itsbenhere]

I mean the number of people who fucked up the ranchman sizing should've been enough a lesson to anyone to be extremely careful when ordering.

 

And i know people are talking about their great experiences, but they are people who simply bought something and kept it, right... ? We're talking about people who had to return something. It's great to have the option in the first place, but what reasoning is there to just sit on a return for months? I mean i asked him about it before and he said I could return, i sent it (and printed out our email conversation saying i could return!), and only after volvo talked to him months later did i get a refund. It's not hard to reverse paypal, I'm sorry.

[mlwdp]

I mean the number of people who fucked up the ranchman sizing should've been enough a lesson to anyone to be extremely careful when ordering.

And i know people are talking about their great experiences, but they are people who simply bought something and kept it, right... ? We're talking about people who had to return something. It's great to have the option in the first place, but what reasoning is there to just sit on a return for months? I mean i asked him about it before and he said I could return, i sent it (and printed out our email conversation saying i could return!), and only after volvo talked to him months later did i get a refund. It's not hard to reverse paypal, I'm sorry.

First time I bought the Ranchman was a size 44 that didn't fit. It was from Denimio though.

[nycsurfer530]

I gotta agree with holio. When you're the importer you know the risks with customs and fees and it's not fair to place blame on the manufacturer over something he has no control over.

[kicks79]

I still haven't written TCB off, as there's plenty of evidence of great, worn-in garments.. but something's amiss, at least here in Sydney.  Neither store has seen much movement on their TCB stock, and it's discounted in both — so it seems unlikely they'll be ordering again.  I'd say now would be a great time to order from overseas (with the $AUD at US 75c or so), but the tagged size seems only tangentially related to the actual dimensions.  I'm sure either place would be happy to measure up an individual pair, though, if you know exactly what works for you in TCB-land!

 

 

Hey Mondo next time you are in the store, say hi and we can talk more about denim related topics. Im glad you came in and where able to try on the 33s. Im sorry that you decided that they where not for you.

TCB actually sells well for us. The Super Slim Orange Tab, 50s jacket and Choreman are all popular. The 60s which are currently on sale are not as popular but I would say that has more to do with the cut and Sydney being in love with slim tapered pants than any deficiency in sizing on TCB's part. 

 

Enjoy your day

 

Chris 

 

Big Trouble Store

Edited September 16, 2016 by kicks79

[mondo]

Hey Chris, yeah I had thought after posting that any implied criticism of TCB should apply only to the cut that I tried.. was sort of hoping the discussion would fade away after I'd said my piece, which I rarely do. But this is the internet, eh!

 

It's definitely the case that Sydney is big on slim jeans (witness just about every cut on CorLection's roster), and I know that not all the non-slim cuts will work for everybody.  And I definitely didn't want to be That Guy who tries things on then purchases from elsewhere.  It was more that there was some posting about sizing inaccuracy, and I thought "well, a 33 one-wash should definitely be smaller than a 34 raw made by the same people," and posted accordingly.  I'm glad that TCB is in Sydney to stay, as I appreciate their ethos and hope to find something that works for me when I'm a little more flush (being old with expensive kids who won't move out of home doesn't help!) ... I think that they need to iron out some expansion wrinkles, and if their clientele can be patient they'll get there.  Patience is a virtue in short supply in our society, unfortunately!

 

Be careful what you wish for, though, I can talk for Australia about denim given half a chance..

[mrman]

I gotta agree with holio. When you're the importer you know the risks with customs and fees and it's not fair to place blame on the manufacturer over something he has no control over.

My god! Of course I knew the risks that the package might be subject to customs, so I'm not blaming him per se, but I had to pay the costs only because he did give me erroneous information. If he had given me correct information, I would not have ordered in the first place. And if you cannot trust the information given by the manufacturer or retailer, what can you trust? This trust is the basis of all commerce.

 

Edit: It seems that many take the criticism aimed at Inoue quite personally, but I hope that you realize that not all share the same positive experiences you might have had with him. My aim is not start any flame wars here, I just wanted to report my quite bad experience. I've done that, let's move on.

Edited September 16, 2016 by mrman

[mikecch]

I think it's important that people share their opinions honestly, so many thanks for the folks who have shared positive and negative experiences.

It's interesting that the above issues highlight the usefulness of local retailers and trying on expensive clothes before we buy.

[holio cornolio]

Cross post from DWC thread. My 60s after 16/17 months and as many washes. Will take some full shots when the weather is better. What to say? These still haven't had or needed any repairs, but that day is probably not far away now. They measure as per tag immediately post wash and stretch about an inch with wear, but that stretch is pretty quick to happen now so I think that these will be washed more and more regularly from here on in. Also, because I've been running a lot lately, I have somewhat less leg and arse than I used to have so, fit can look a little relaxed after stretch...

 

Loooooooong overdue update on my TCB 60s. 17 months regular wear, probably washed every 4 weeks. No repairs although beginning to get a little threadbare in a few places. Could only take detail shots because it's pissing down outside and the light is all directional inside. So crappy lighting and too much contrast but I felt an update was necessary.

 

fave detail - frayed rear belt loop

 

Front pockets beginning to fray

 

rear pocket threads beginning to break

 

 

choo choo:

 

roping is actually really good, not that you'd know it from this:

Edited September 16, 2016 by holio cornolio

[unders]

Bravo Holio

[Bobbo]

Fantastic Holio! 

[HAZARDkid]

Might interest the shorter people but http://supertalk.superfuture.com/index.php/topic/160528-fs-denim-size-32-33-tcb-denime-ues-big/ trying to clear some stuff I don't have time to wear.

[aho]

GOD STATUS.

 

 

 

choo choo:

[oomslokop]

holio shit!

[MileHighEvertonian]

well, there's some inspiration for any and all looking needing it! Nice work, holio. I'm just 17 months behind you. 

[holio cornolio]

Too kind chaps, too kind

[volvo240thebest]

amazing pair holio, the frequent wash does wonders to the 60's denim. my old pair never had that great marbling, because I haven't washed enough, a mistake I won't make again with my new pair.

here it is three months circa, three washes

and a family pic

[edmond]

why hide the face volvs?

first day of proper boots and jacket weather!