Denim Blunders, Reflections and General Nonsense.

[cmboland]

Discussion topic:

 

What was your first pair of raw denim? When and where did you get them? Finally do you still have them?

[dwilson123]

Like oddly so many people my first pair of raw denim were a pair of Nudie Thin Finn Ecru Embros.  I still have them.  They didn't really fade too much probably because of the stretch fabric.  I can't recall exactly where I purchased them from but I think it was Tobi which appears to not even stock men's clothing anymore.  They were my only pair of non-selvage raw denim.

 

My first pair of selvage raw denim was a pair of Nudie Regular Ralfs.  I bought those from Asos.

 

My first pair of Japanese raw denim were a pair of Samurai S5000VX.  Purchased from BiG.

 

I have kept all my raw denim.  I recently purged out a bunch of my washed "premium" denim that I wore throughout college, though.  So really the only jeans I have now are worn raws.

Edited November 9, 2015 by dwilson123

[tigerstrom]

My first pair was Nudie Slim Jim dry. I got them 11-12 years ago and they totally ripped after 6 months. I sized down to much haha.

[Cucoo]

Unbranded UB301. They're pretty much retired, not just because the denim is pretty flat and boring but also because they're very tight in the top block and I just can't bring myself to stretch them out again after the last wash I'd get them again as a first pair but I'd size up one to combat the ball-crushingly low rise.

 

Got them two years ago, wore them a lot for almost a year until I got my first pair of unsanforized jeans (Warehouse Duckdiggers).

Edited November 10, 2015 by Cucoo

[barney_rumble]

My first pair was Unbranded 101. Figured I would go with the cheap option for my first pair as I didn't know a damn thing about raws. Got them from Blue Owl in August of 2014. Was pretty disappointed when I first got them. I thought they'd be a lot skinnier than they were and I wasn't digging the rise or the tight pockets. Went to get them hemmed and decided to have them tapered. Seamstress hemmed them too short and the taper was too extreme and it just looked so bad. Tried to rock them but it just looked silly. I chalk a lot of it up to not knowing what fit I wanted and how to size properly. Definitely a learning experience. I eventually made them into shorts and they looked bad so eventually i'm just going to use the scraps for some sort of project.

[itsbenhere]

Iron Heart Beatle Busters in 2011... Still have them, but way too tight and dislike Iron Heart now. Consolidation part of me wants to get rid of them but they were the first article of clothing where I was like holy shit...

 

Will probably never buy sanforized jawnz again.

[volvo240thebest]

my first three pairs of raw denim were all by Edwin.

Edwin Ed 67 in Quartz denim (loved them to bits, worn for about two years and a half, multiple repairs)

Edwin Ed 71 nice cut I thought back at the time, now I wouldn't wear them as they're too low rise and too tight in the top block. worn til a first crotch blowout and never cared to repair as the granite denim it's not very nice and doesn't fade beatifully.

Edwin Nashville - nice pair of jeans, I still wear these every once in a while.

all of these were bought second hand on eBay for cheap.

after these I bought. a pair of RC425H which were too tight and I recently ended up to exchange. and then TCB 60's.

I think Edwin is a great brand for someone getting first bro raw denim.

[ReverendGlasseye]

Iron Heart Beatle Busters in 2011... Still have them, but way too tight and dislike Iron Heart now. Consolidation part of me wants to get rid of them but they were the first article of clothing where I was like holy shit...

 

Why don't you like Iron Heart anymore?

[redragon]

First raw is also my biggest blunder...SC1966.

Wore it when I am still in the wear-for-6-months-then-wash mindset, but cannot stand it as I found the denim to be abit "boring" (huge mistake I later realized) then sold it off.

Moved next to PBJ 007, amazing fabric but after a year, just feel like I am fighting the fit. Gave the pair to charity.

Jumped on Ooe Yofukuten competition, 1.5++ year of wear, love it very much. can never go back to tight fit anymore.

Now rocking Kapital Century Kakishibu.

[nycsurfer530]

My first pair was samurai 710 lot 12 from BiG. Wore them for two years with multiple repairs going on. That was my only pair I ever got over 15 oz as I didn't want to deal with denim that heavy and slubby again.

[itsbenhere]

Why don't you like Iron Heart anymore?

 

I must've always subconsciously not liked it because I sold pretty much all my IH clothing before I realized I really just didn't like it. It's just all wrong for me... at first I was just selling the stuff because obviously, heavy stuff is hot and does not work well with living in Southern California.

 

I can just compare any IH thing and it's pretty much my least favorite. Super heavy tee shirts, yet no collar reinforcement. I have 5 dollar t shirts that have better collars than IH ones. I'm not asking for Flat Head level, just anything... Like Buzz Rickson, Toys McCoy, Real McCoy, Mister Freedom, etc.

 

Onto jeans, they've diversified so much and I just don't get the appeal... IF you want comfortable heavy stuff, then definitely look no further. But when they get into normal weight I don't see the appeal, if you're going with light/mid weight what appeal does Iron Heart have? I'm guessing that the failure of Triple Works as a brand means I'm not the only one who thinks that...

 

I think all of it stems that Iron Heart, at least at its inception, was a motorcycle brand. Flat Head, Sugar Cane, Strike Gold, Real McCoy's, these are all clothing brands... Iron Heart was a motorcycle brand. Except since Giles partnered with Haraki they're turned it into something more clothing/fashion oriented, and I don't like that since it goes against what made the brand cool and in my opinion it's not their strongpoint. My mind is blown when people are dropping 1k on all colorways of one flannel, and the pattern straight up looks like something from Macy's.

 

Talking about this:

 

 

Also, I do not get the sizing. This dude's fit is the problem I have. He needs a size up but that wouldn't work either because then the long/body would be huge on him. Iron Heart makes shirts with shoulders that end before the armpits... who does that fit ???

 

 

 

 

On the other hand, there's a few things that I'd love to own, like the Dark Rider flannel, but these things were made a long time ago and further makes me think that Iron Heart has changed... I'm sure I've changed as well though, and not knocking those who love IH, it's awesome to find a brand you really jive with.

[unorthodox]

My first pair of raw denim was a pair of Nudie Straight Sven I believe in 2005 or 2006. I tried a few other Nudie cuts to find the perfect one (Thin Finn Dry Black Coated, Slim Jim, Average Joe, etc) but was never truly happy with the fit. 

 

My pair of REAL denim was a pair of Pure Blue Japan XX-005 from Blue in Green in 2007. Being from Atlanta, I ordered them just from looking at photos on different forums and just thinking the leaf on the back pocket was a cool detail (I still do). My mind was blown when the jeans arrived as I had never felt or experienced denim with such character before. I tried them on pre-soak and was so excited that I contemplated not soaking and just wearing them. But I decided to give them a good soak and I was in such a hurry to get them in the tub that I forgot to take my cell phone out of the front pocket, so it got a soak too. I still have them and I still wear them from time to time. 

 

I enjoy Iron Heart and I think the way they have numbered the releases was a fantastic way to market towards the natural collector bug that a lot of people have. I do think they are starting to release too much product and the momentum will eventually slow down. But the ultra heavy flannels are fantastic. 

[Sugar Mountain]

Some thoughts on Iron Heart...

 

I used to be a bigger fan of the brand than I am now. I suppose part of this was trying out a few different styles of denim before arriving on what I have enjoyed for the past few years and partly because I also live in a hot and humid place where that heavyweight gear is completely unwearable. 

 

I still dig their 21oz flagship denim and think it looks great really faded and worn in but the other denims don't have much appeal at all. The finishing, with the goldenrod stitching especially, is just not my cup of tea. I can't understand the attraction of wearing jeans that remain uncomfortable for months on end as you break them in. These are clothes and not a ''project'' that should cause pain.

 

I do think that the brand can successful introduce lighter weight fabrics into its denim stable because people enjoy the signature cuts and the quality of construction. At present, the vast majority of what they offer is still the made from extremely overbuilt and heavy fabrics. The flannels I think are actually the brand's strongest offering and the colourways are often really nice. However, once I knew that Flat Head cuts worked on me, I never looked back. The IH messageboard culture and the ease of purchase through IH-UK definitely fuels that insane over-consumption where people are copping three versions of the same shirt and then posting giant lists of all the gear they own. 

 

Regarding the motorcycle branding: in Japan, this is still very much the case. Go into pretty much any shop of the other denim brands in Tokyo or Osaka and the staff will have no clue who IH are. It's still primarily sold to bikers from what I can see and advertised in Harley Davidson magazines and at bike shows. Giles has been on board since 2005 (only two years after incorporation), so IH International is not exactly a new thing. The designs are still all by Haraki and made with the same utility in mind as they always have been. However, they do churn out a ton of product and I'm surprised there is the consumer base for that volume. Hats off to them though, it's not an easy business and they have been very successful.

[itsbenhere]

You're totally right that in Japan it's pretty much still just biker stuff... that's another thing I don't like though, I don't like that there's essentially two brands, only the same in name. Overseas it's less about motorcycles and spoken in the same breath as Stevenson and Flat Head, yet in Japan it's clear that it is a motorcycle company first and foremost. Not a fan of the incongruity. Also, I wonder how many things Haraki would make if Giles were not spearheading it for the overseas market.

 

As you know, Flat Head has a bunch of brands for different vibes they want to give off - Palms Label, Black Mint, Glory Park. I don't even understand most of the vibes differentiating them (okay I do, and the differences are virtually nonexistent) but I like that they have such a clear idea of the brand image they want.

 

Case in point: 21 oz signature denim is sanforized, treated with a silicone (?) coating to retard fading, and Haraki didn't used to care about if it was selvedge or not... so opposite of the preferences of most who buy the clothing. To me, the 21 oz denim is what Iron Heart truly is at it's least diluted. And it's awesome, just not for me and in my opinion not for most people on this forum until they changed the identity of the brand.

Edited November 10, 2015 by itsbenhere

[Max Power]

Well, Ben, the same sizing problem you have with IH I have with FH. I really like their stuff, but the large shoulders, tiny chests and short arms don't work for me. And for many others I know. Having seen FH Tees in person now I understand your point, regarding the seams and collar but must also say that I find the fabric of the IH ones on par with FH.

 

What I always like about the brand, besides offering goods that last very long, is exactly the fact, that they are not as fashionable or crazy designed like pineapple hawaiian shirts. But that's just taste and can't be argued about. (I concur on the denims btw).

[Lukenstein]

Imperial duke.

 

Australian Brand that is very hard to find in Australia.

Sized perfect

wore them to death

gave them to rudy's jeans museum

[itsbenhere]

Max, I agree the fabric on the tees is nice with a great horizontal loopwheel texture, too heavy for me but beside the point.

 

I'd bet that the WR versions of the shirts would work well for you, like for me... 

 

Yeah I dig crazy patterns. Another thing I forgot to mention is I kind of feel like Iron Heart makes the same shirt over and over again, they all look really similar. Specifically talking about shackets, overdyed stuff, etc... any variant of hickory or wabash westerns...

[Max Power]

Yes, that's true. But as it is exactly what I personally am looking for, I'm most fine with that. Why I always end up with IH are three things:

 

- Good Quality. Might be equal to many other japanese brands (that I also own), but if I spend a lot of money on clothes, I want them to last and look good over a Long time. IH has never let me down. Some other brands did.

 

- The fit. As I said, IH fits me perfectly in L-XL. I tried to get some other brands, but sometimes a 42 is the largest size and is too small for me. Or, like FH, the cut simply doesn't work out. For tall western customers IH offers an almost unique range of sizes that actually fit.

 

- The style: I'm not looking into vintage workwear, don't want to look like a Cowboy, miner, traindriver or a gothic ninja. In fact, what influenced me were the grunge & second wave of Punkrock era in the early nineties. That's why I always end up with faded Jeans and flannels. There are a lot of brands that do great stuff, but that just doesn't fit my criteria (even if i look to broaden my range) and so far IH fit me best. I don't feel that dressy or like I'm wearing a costume. But that's personal taste, like I said earlier.

Edited November 10, 2015 by Max Power

[Blue Nemo]

personally (not as an employee) I favor the old TW or new lightweight pieces over the heavy weight stuff. Their natural indigo dyed 6 oz works chambray with indigo dyed buttons really is awesome!

It's a perfect classic for me.

And the UHFs actually are the heaviest and long lasting shirts I ever touched. They always hit our store like a rock star. But I prefer the Flat Heat Flannels hehe, for their beautiful fabric. And I can deal with the fit, western majority can't.

Their are a few pieces I don't get, like baby blue HBT A-2 or a black Tanker Jacket (though I love the wool blanket lining), but overall I still like the brand, especially for their 18 oz denim - it has a great slubby texture, Atari here and there but it's still subtle.

And for the breaking in time. I have the 666 UHR and the new 816DD, both are heavy and stubborn as fuck. But it take me less than a month to wear them both perfectly comfortable. Although the 666 cut just doesn't work for me, which is cool. Wide legs for me all the way!!

[tion4->]

First raws: Nudie Regular Ralph Dry Selvedge in 2004

They stunk and were filthy. I did silly stuff like put an eraser in the back pocket to create a hole. I loved them and still have them somewhere.

[newpatterns]

First pair: N&F Broken Twill Weird Guy

 

I loved them, wore the shit out of them and got some reasonable contrast on the back but not the front as they got very washed out. I wear them when I'm feeling scummy.

 

Re IH, I would feel dishonest if I wore it, to me it's a motorcycle brand and I'm neither a biker nor hard enough otherwise to feel like it's a good fit with everything else. 

[beautiful_FrEaK]

I will just “steal†this description of myself from Gav’s blog he ran in the past:

 

I started wearing dry denim in early 2007. My gateway drug was a pair of Nudie Jeans as it was for most guys back then. The alternative was APC. There wasn’t such a broad offer for “beginner rare denim jeans†like nowadays and also the availability left much to be desired…

In 2008 I took the big leap and ordered my first pair of Japanese jeans straight from Japan. A pair of DenimJunkie DJ-501XX directly from the source. This “brand†(it wasn’t a real brand but more a one-man project) is now long extinct but D/J’s eye for details is still among the best brands I handled.

 

From that point everything went quickly: my first contest in 2009 (Denime XX/66XX), my first world tour in 2010 (Ooe Yofukuten “The Traveling Pantsâ€), building of my Samurai jeans collection, my hunt for deadstock Japanese jeans and on and on…

 

 

[Raoul Duke]

First raws: Nudie Regular Ralph Dry Selvedge in 2007.  

 

They ended up looking pretty solid but were too short after the wash and I wasn't digging the fit anymore.  

 

Sold them on eBay back in 2010 or so for like $50. 

[Max Power]

^^^Strange, although I know about the motorcycle roots of IH I never thought about that. And, it doesn't bother me. Otherwise I would have to question everybody wearing engineer boots without being one as well. Super easy - it's your cash, spend it on what you want and wear what you want.

 

First pair of Raws: Nudie Slim Jim Dry Japan.

 

With so many People being led here by nudie I still can't understand many People talking Shit about them. They're a Gateway brand but can't do such a bad Job if we all ended up where we are now. (and like I wrote earlier - they even advertise a shorter washing period lately).

Edited November 11, 2015 by Max Power

[Blue Nemo]

Re IH, I would feel dishonest if I wore it, to me it's a motorcycle brand and I'm neither a biker nor hard enough otherwise to feel like it's a good fit with everything else. 

 

do you happen to be a gold digger, cowboy or moviestar like brando?

otherwise i don't see how you could honestly wear jeans....

[Maynard Friedman]

I bought a pair of selvedge Levi 501 stfs from a Nordstrom somewhere in the SF Bay Area in 1984 whilst on a school trip (yes, I'm that old!). I wore second-hand selvedge 501s during the mid-late 80s but during the 90s wore non-selvedge - Liberto, Chevignon, C17, Replay, Teddy Smith, Carhartt, etc. In 2002 I bought 2 pairs of selvedge Edwin Waynesvilles from Interstate in London. These were my gateway back to selvedge and into Japanese denim (the 'villes range was still made in Japan then). I no longer have them but I have another pair of Waynesvilles I bought in 2004 (from the 2003 production run).

[denihilist]

do you happen to be a gold digger, cowboy or moviestar like brando?

otherwise i don't see how you could honestly wear jeans....

Took me a second to parse gold digger into miner.  Thanks a lot Kanye.

[Maynard Friedman]

Junior gold digger = a minor miner!

[Iron Horse]

A true nugget of wisdom.

[unders]

Junior gold digger = a minor miner!

An insignificant junior gold digger = a minor minor miner

Sorry folks.