Denim Blunders, Reflections and General Nonsense.

[Sugar Mountain]

Based upon the interest that many Samurai or PBJ releases continue to garner on this board, I'd say the picture is not exactly clear cut.

 

One thing though is that Sufu has a number of regular posters that have been kicking around since at least 2010 or are a little older than RGT-types but not as old as the denim dads on DB. Heading towards my mid-30s, I can say that as the years pass I want increasingly for ''classic'' pieces in my wardrobe without gimmicky extras. However, the attraction is not really for ultra period correct models but rather for the perfect interpretation of blue jeans as an American icon. That's why I admire Full Count and Warehouse: they play loose with historical specifics but mesh them into something brilliant.

 

American Casual/Amekaji is a description I'm happy to pin to it. Pull together the best elements of workwear, athletic and military pieces and see what sticks. No sense in pursuing a really narrow ''look'' in my opinion.

[Cold Summer]

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Edited January 7, 2022 by Cold Summer
I was wrong

[nycsurfer530]

For me I just want to be comfortable (which includes regular washing) with beautiful denim. My very first raw pair was samurai 710s and I wore those hard for a solid 2-3 years to destruction. After that I really wanted to try something different so I picked up FC 1101s and fell completely in love and those got 2 solid years of wear. But I always want to try new things and different denims. I have seen wonders with warehouse so I picked up some 800s a couple years ago. Since then I bought FC x Signet 0105ph and then this past week TCB 50s. i have always been a guy who exclusively wore one pair but now I'm starting to rotate with my Signet FCs and my TCBs. Right now my thing is a looser cut and I attribute that to wearing slim jeans most of my life. I've found that regardless of the fabric, looser fits will always be more comfortable and I have no need to show the shapes of my thighs. Maybe that's just me... End pointless rant

Edited April 26, 2016 by nycsurfer530

[itsbenhere]

 I've found that regardless of the fabric, looser fits will always be more comfortable and I have no need to show the shapes of my thighs. Maybe that's just me... End pointless rant

 

 

For real... I'm always surprised that so many guys want to show off them legs! i think the best look for a guy is that I have no clue what shape your thighs/legs are.

Edited April 26, 2016 by itsbenhere

[garden gnomes in space]

Ima bit drunk so I hope I can make sense of this.  For me, I look for details that are not visible to others, but for me to be aware of when wearing.  This usually means jeans that fly under the radar visually, but excite me because of some geek factor.  Example, the denim on the OOE contest jeans.  Someone looks at them and see's a dark pair of jeans.  But I know that they are LHT, and only a small amount exist in the entire world and that my name is on the patch.  Or the feeling of putting my hands in the sashiko pocketbags of my SC Oki's.  

 

Fit-wise, I dont want to fuck around.  I want to wear jeans.  Im too old to battle the fit. I know the dimensions of my legs so I buy a cut accordinlgy.   

[garden gnomes in space]

oh I forgot.  I think Warehouse are my favorite jeans.  Its a combo of lots of small things that make a great feeling denim that is pleasant to wear.  

[Cold Summer]

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Edited January 7, 2022 by Cold Summer
I was wrong

[volvo240thebest]

^ I'd be curious to see how you look with a looser cut. i have a totally different body type compared to yours, so of course I have no experience, but from the fit pics you post I always get the impression that the type of jeans you wear make you look even slimmer than you probably are. Might be totally wrong, and no criticism (if you're happy with what you have we're all happy of course) but I'd be curious to see you wearing a regular or loose pair of jeans and see if really they don't work for you. I think you could pull off a loose fit well.

[nycsurfer530]

Yeah I'm a slim guy for sure, my waist is a 30, but I still love the look of a looser fit. It's all preference.

[Max Power]

You're lucky as most looser fits still look good on smaller sizes. Size 36 and above always make huge legs to get the waist right - but I feel like the Proportion gets lost. If the wiast increases 1" from 33 to 34 I don't need the hem to increase by 0,5". That's why I am looking for a bit of taper in my pairs - I Need waist 35-36 but not a hem of 9".

 

For example IH 634 or Samurai 5000 look great on small guys, but like 90s baggy Pants on me.

[dwilson123]

Yeah I have a pair of loose straight Samurais (actually my first Japanese denim I ever bought) that I think look really good on my frame.  I've been wanting to get a looser pair of jeans recently.  I feel since I have fairly wide shoulders and chest and then I taper down to a 30" waist I sometimes look a bit like a triangle in tapered jeans.  Just not another pair of Samurai since those pockets are so wide set it makes me look like I have birthing hips with the way they sit on me.

 

EG my PBJ 005 (straight) vs my BOM (tapered) -- not a perfect comparison due to the lighting and everything but I far prefer the 005 fit on me

 

Edited April 26, 2016 by dwilson123

[setterman]

Max, I think what you're encountering, and I think I've mentioned it before in this thread (sorry if I'm repeating myself!), is that the Japanese brands maybe don't have as much experience and knowledge when it comes to making sizes 36 and 38.  When you get to those sizes there's always something that's off.  Most often it's not enough rise, but as you mentioned, leg opening can be an issue (too wide), and rarely is the thigh optimal width.  Part of the reason I like Warehouse and Fullcount so much is that their core models (800, 1000, 1001, 1003, 1101, 0105) get most things right.  LVC does a fairly good job of it too with the '47, '55, and '66, but unfortunately the product you get from them today in no way matches the price they're asking.

 

As for jeans that are flattering to most male bodies, it's not that tough.  We've always looked our best in a regular cut.  Think of something resembling a pair of Levis 505s you could pick up in a department store today, but made of Japanese denim.  

[Cold Summer]

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Edited January 7, 2022 by Cold Summer
I was wrong

[dwilson123]

I've been squatting so much recently it feels like my thighs are going to explode my TFH3002's.  Which incidentally is making for some really nice train tracks.

[kiya]

I see a lot of old school Sufu style discussion within this thread, something i don't see much in other places.. thought this would be fun to watch for you all, or at least get involved in:

 

This Thursday, April 28th, i'm doing an AMA (Ask Me Anything) on reddit.  Please come and do exactly that, ask me anything.

 

Thursday, April 28th.

9am (Pacific), 12pm (Eastern), 4pm (London, GMT+1)

 

You will find the AMA at the top of the page here at the date/time above:

https://www.reddit.com/r/rawdenim/

[cmboland]

I see a lot of old school Sufu style discussion within this thread, something i don't see much in other places.. thought this would be fun to watch for you all, or at least get involved in:

This Thursday, April 28th, i'm doing an AMA (Ask Me Anything) on reddit. Please come and do exactly that, ask me anything.

Thursday, April 28th.

9am (Pacific), 12pm (Eastern), 4pm (London, GMT+1)

You will find the AMA at the top of the page here at the date/time above:

https://www.reddit.com/r/rawdenim/

I'll be there but I'm gonna ambush you with my question here too . Do you see a realistic market for Detroit as a future SE location? Detroit is being labeled as a "New Portland" and the aesthetic of the people is quite the same. The city is exploding with growth and as a consumer, could specifically see the lineage of Self Edge grow into the mid town area of Detroit.

[edmond]

Kiya how's Mexico I wanna transFer there too seriously looking for a house and lot in Leon

[karanimal]

I'll be there but I'm gonna ambush you with my question here too . Do you see a realistic market for Detroit as a future SE location? Detroit is being labeled as a "New Portland" and the aesthetic of the people is quite the same. The city is exploding with growth and as a consumer, could specifically see the lineage of Self Edge grow into the mid town area of Detroit.

 

Detroit would be a great place to have Canadian customers from the Toronto area drive down to check out the shop too. If the Canadian $ ever improves i could see that being a great opportunity 

[beautiful_FrEaK]

I am one of those guys who turned away from the flashier brands towards the more subtle and ‘authentic’ brands.

 

It might have something to do with me getting older but I can’t be certain because it’s not like I woke up one day and said “Damn, now I’m too old for Samurai jeans!†I still have a special place for Samurai jeans and I really like my S0500XX and bought the S710xDenimio collab jeans last December. But somehow I don’t get around wearing them. It has less to do with flashy details or loud arcs (in fact I love the old Samurai arcs the most) but more with the denim they use. Samurai’s denim is quite engineered (like PBJ, Oni, Strike Gold, etc.) and the outcome is heavily influenced by the way they are woven and less how you treat the jeans. The denim of Warehouse, FC, Denime or Resolute and the like are more influenceable by the wearer (in my eyes) and have a more authentic way they look and fade. And this has a stronger appeal to me.

 

Maybe this hasn’t to do with my age per se but more with the time I wear raw denim. My observation: When you freshly start with raw and Japanese denim you are way more attracted by crazy fabrics that are stiff as hell, slubby like a teenager’s acne face and also uber-heavy. Probably mainly because the step from your ‘normal’ jeans is bigger and more noticeable. See the interest in Oni or PBJ on a rather new denim forum like Reddit where are presumably more new-to-raw-denim users gather than here on Sufu or Denimbro (we already had this topic IIRC).
Later when you are more ‘experienced’ you might find the beauty in more subtle nuances the denim can offer.

 

My overall style hasn’t changed a lot though. Mainly t-shirts, sweats and sneakers…sometimes shirts or boots. And the obligatory pair of jeans.

[bod]

Maybe this hasn’t to do with my age per se but more with the time I wear raw denim. My observation: When you freshly start with raw and Japanese denim you are way more attracted by crazy fabrics that are stiff as hell, slubby like a teenager’s acne face and also uber-heavy. Probably mainly because the step from your ‘normal’ jeans is bigger and more noticeable.

 

 

Nowadays I find a lot of Jap denim too heavy / thick even in the 14oz mid-range, take my experiences with Denime XX which is more like 16oz after getting wet and Flat Head's 3XXX denim pushing it into 15oz territory. Resolute seem to hit the sweet spot though.

Edited April 28, 2016 by bod

[Cold Summer]

Hmm, the issue I've had with most of the more traditional brands that you describe b_F is that the denim, while it has a nice texture with traits like marbling, is too lightly-colored for me. Something like Fullcount or Warehouse's denim dyed as dark as that of Eternal or Flat Head would actually be really appealing. 

 

I never really got on the crazy denim hype train. My Samurai S710xx is about the wildest I've worn, and it's actually pretty modest-looking since I've washed them relatively often. My favorite fabrics will probably always be Flat Head's 14.5 oz denim, PBJ's left-hand twill denim from the XX-011, Eternal's denim, and 3Sixteen's Shadow Selvedge. All of these are very dark fabrics with strong vertical fading and contrast, but aren't slubby, heavyweight, or otherwise particularly wild. So I guess that places my preferences somewhere in the middle.

[cmboland]

Hmm, the issue I've had with most of the more traditional brands that you describe b_F is that the denim, while it has a nice texture with traits like marbling, is too lightly-colored for me. Something like Fullcount or Warehouse's denim dyed as dark as that of Eternal or Flat Head would actually be really appealing......

This is my biggest gripe as well. I love the 710xx cut from samurai but the jeans go white far too quickly for me. This is what initially drew me to 3sixteens shadow selvedge (A denim i feel everyone should own). I'm a frequent washer and having jeans that are more uniformly lighter just looks goofy on me.

[beautiful_FrEaK]

Fullcount’s XX denim is quite dark (if I remember correctly) and very slow fading. Also Warehouse 1000XX denim (as used on the 660, 700, 800 and 1000XX) is on the darker side. But yeah, not on the same level like Eternal or TFH. 

[setterman]

Funny how we all see things differently.  After a first wash or soak, Fullcount denim has always struck me as looking almost black.   

[Cold Summer]

Interesting. Fullcount's 1108 has always seemed like it'd be a good fit for me, so it's quite possible I'll give it a try in the future.

[chicote]

^I reckon it would be if you like the fit of Samurai's 710, it's almost identical to the 1108.

[itsbenhere]

Probably mainly because the step from your ‘normal’ jeans is bigger and more noticeable. See the interest in Oni or PBJ on a rather new denim forum like Reddit where are presumably more new-to-raw-denim users gather than here on Sufu or Denimbro (we already had this topic IIRC).

Later when you are more ‘experienced’ you might find the beauty in more subtle nuances the denim can offer.

 

 

My first pair of nice jeans were Iron Heart, specifically because the idea of something both heavy/substantial and comfortable was very appealing to me. When you're not used to identifying quality or don't have a lot of experience, it's easier to justify the quality and price difference of something when it's as obvious as "these jeans just feel good" (due to the weight.)

 

As time went on I began to appreciate subtler things and, like most of you, prefer non-gimmicky denim in the 14-15 oz range... i think that my experience is probably a common one.

[Sugar Mountain]

Yeah, when I was newer to this stuff the idea of 21oz denim was pretty intriguing and I picked up a pair of IH after I'd started on Flat Head. It's impressive in terms of what a company is doing to push the limits of fabric production and I still quite like the fades on IH's signature denim, but overall it lost its appeal quickly. 

 

With regards to the comments made above on the darkness of certain fabrics: as b_F says, Warehouse's 1000XX fabric actually starts off pretty dark and is also a lot rougher and more neppy than photos would indicate. Many WH owners will wash their jeans more often than your typical Eternal owner because they desire a vintage look, but you could quite easily achieve a dark, high-contrast look from the same jeans.

[dwilson123]

I've been wearing my 24oz PBJs this week and I'm not sure why I'm doing it.  My Flat Heads are so much more comfortable to wear because of the weight.

[Sugar Mountain]

Surely those jeans feel like they are made from office carpeting? I'm sweating just thinking about them.