Levi's Vintage Clothing

[Paul T]

I need to know is this a 1886 XX with a center patch and a watch pocket on the waist band? Does it have the two hoarse brand patch?

The Oldest Oldest? No, it has the patch on the right and the pre-2 horse patch (the original jean, that is). But I don't know about the watch pocket.

I've only seen the raised watch pocket on the Nevada workpant. Have you seen it on the XX?

I've re-read your early post, and it seems to reflect pretty much exactly what i thought was the case until the discovery of the jeans posted above, what they say are the ealriest XX, with the patch on the right.

Lynn could be wrong - one thing I would say is that she's very good at stating when she simply thinks something is the case, as opposed to knows it is the case.

Edit: Here's another photo of the Oldest Oldest, lifted from a book.

I have a feeling these jeans are in a recent Japanese book, does anyone have more photos?

[Paul T]

Ads showing Levi's being marketed as early as 1874 in the Tehama Independent:

And photos of an early Levi's competitor from the mid 1870s, the Greenbaum Brothers. (Are these the same or different pants, Mike? The wiast band at the back seems to be single stitched, but double-stitched at the front)

Just noticed Mike asked me not to post a later pant that has a leather reinforcement, rather like Warehouse Duck Diggers and, IIRC, early pants by the Neustadter prothers. Whose early shirts and pants, I learned recently, were simply branded as "standard".

[Sansome1877]

Airfrogs pants on 944 I think they are calling this a 1886 XX with a two hoarse brand patch. The stitch that holds the buckle is the same as my #2's. If this is a real pant in the archives then the double XX still has the

patch in the center and the watch pocket has not been put off the waist band. I have a big gap from about 1880 to 1886 or 87. I know that a center

patch levi with denim pocket bags was being made from 1873 to 1880 I think I have seen almost 50 pieces of pant like this in the 1870's. I have never seen a side patch pant in the 70's. I will send you pictures of a center patch levi from 1890 or 91, no later than that. This pant has a center patch, denim pocket bags and a watch pocket on the waist band.

[Paul T]

Airfrogs pants on 944 I think they are calling this a 1886 XX with a two hoarse brand patch. The stitch that holds the buckle is the same as my #2's. If this is a real pant in the archives then the double XX still has the

patch in the center and the watch pocket has not been put off the waist band. I have a big gap from about 1880 to 1886 or 87. I know that a center

patch levi with denim pocket bags was being made from 1873 to 1880 I think I have seen almost 50 pieces of pant like this in the 1870's. I have never seen a side patch pant in the 70's. I will send you pictures of a center patch levi from 1890 or 91, no later than that. This pant has a center patch, denim pocket bags and a watch pocket on the waist band.

But airfrog's pants can't be right if the earlier patch was used, on the right hand side, in 1879.

It's puzzling.

Were the denim pocket bags the same weight as the main fabric? And the photo you're sending me of the XX style? Can't wait...

[Sansome1877]

The one with the leather triangles that over lap the pocket corners is Greenebaum brothers. The pant up above predates the levi patent. Old style floppy pockets. You can see that the corners have been repaired. This pant has no back pocket or watch pocket. It's a split back. Could date to the late 1860's. This is a good example of what miners were complaining about, pocket corners rip.

Greenbaum Brothers were the first to take out a patent and compete with levi.

[Sansome1877]

But airfrog's pants can't be right if the earlier patch was used, on the right hand side, in 1879.

It's puzzling.

Were the denim pocket bags the same weight as the main fabric? And the photo you're sending me of the XX style? Can't wait...

Thickest denim I have ever held, wish I still had it so I could send a piece off to cone. The pocket bags were the same weight.

[Sansome1877]

Paul I have to get about 4 hours of sleep. I will find the disk with the pictures and send them in a few hours. Need to get to the bottom of airfrogs pants. What date were these modeled after. so so tired

[Sympathy-For-The-Denim]

nice denim to gaze on on the last pages...

and funny to see, triangle leather patches are still used to reinforce german

"zunftbekleidung" (carpenters garments) btw. the use really heavy manchester corduroys to taylor em...

[airfrogusmc]

Do these have denim pocket bags? Thanks the pants look great

No these didn't but the Knappaves do.

[Goominim]

Great stuff, Paul T.

[Sansome1877]

No these didn't but the Knappaves do.

What year did Lvc come out with these and did they have a Two hoarse brand patch?

[setterman]

Got a new camera, so I figured I'd try taking some pictures of my cultizm contest '55s and play with some of the different settings. They've had around four months of actual wear, and five trips through the wash. They're darker than they appear in the photos.

[Sansome1877]

Ads showing Levi's being marketed as early as 1874 in the Tehama Independent:

And photos of an early Levi's competitor from the mid 1870s, the Greenbaum Brothers. (Are these the same or different pants, Mike? The wiast band at the back seems to be single stitched, but double-stitched at the front)

Just noticed Mike asked me not to post a later pant that has a leather reinforcement, rather like Warehouse Duck Diggers and, IIRC, early pants by the Neustadter prothers. Whose early shirts and pants, I learned recently, were simply branded as "standard".

I have the evolution of the standard pant that uses David Neustadters 1875 patent. I have a pair that dates between 1875 to 1876, this pair has a two piece fly . In 1876 David Neustadter has another patent for the one piece fly and then all Neustadter pants for the next 17 years have a one piece fly.

[Dr_Heech]

Airfrogs pants on 944 I think they are calling this a 1886 XX with a two hoarse brand patch. The stitch that holds the buckle is the same as my #2's. If this is a real pant in the archives then the double XX still has the

patch in the center and the watch pocket has not been put off the waist band. I have a big gap from about 1880 to 1886 or 87. I know that a center

patch levi with denim pocket bags was being made from 1873 to 1880 I think I have seen almost 50 pieces of pant like this in the 1870's. I have never seen a side patch pant in the 70's. I will send you pictures of a center patch levi from 1890 or 91, no later than that. This pant has a center patch, denim pocket bags and a watch pocket on the waist band.

Wow, a centre patch after 1890? Is it a 2 horse patch or an earlier text version? If you need any more pix of the 1886, pm me. I have one or two pix of early patches, but nothing before 1890 (when supposedly the 2 horses appeared). Lovin these infos from you.

.

@Mr Black

Cheers for the info. I also havent been for many years, but will take a wander tomorrow.

[Sansome1877]

Glad you like the information, the center patch on the 1890's pant is gone so I don't know what it was. I suspect it was leather because if it was cloth it would still be on the pant. A question has to be asked to Levi archive, what year is the ad that they have showing the two hoarse brand? They are firm with the date of 1886. Levi must have a two hoarse ad from 1886, what month what day? I think I have enough information to form a time line from 1873 to 1892. I have to go out for about 6 hours. Can you pm me with your email address and I will send you some information.

[entertainment!]

I don't think it has been mentioned on this thread (though it has on a couple others), but there is a book coming out at the end of the month called Jeans of the Old West by Michael Harris from Schiffer Publishing. I have had a copy on pre-order for a while and have been really looking forward to seeing it.

Perhaps it is only a coincidence that Sansome1877's name is Mike.

[Sansome1877]

Very cool, Sears was using the leather triangles on jackets in the teens and twenties.

[Sansome1877]

I don't think it has been mentioned on this thread (though it has on a couple others), but there is a book coming out at the end of the month called Jeans of the Old West by Michael Harris from Schiffer Publishing. I have had a copy on pre-order for a while and have been really looking forward to seeing it.

Perhaps it is only a coincidence that Sansome1877's name is Mike.

I feel pretty foolish not looking on this site before, between work family and research, it just slipped past me. My book will be out at the end of the month. I just got my advanced copy last week. Amazon has it for sale at $23.09 . I should have been paying attention to LVC. years ago. The pant on page 1 named 1886xx. Is this a real pant from the archive. I think it has to be, this would suggest that all Levi pants had a center patch and a watch pocket on the waist band. This 1886xx has cotton pocket bags, this sounds correct. I have only seen about 4 levi's from 1880 to 85. All had center patches three had denim pocket bags and one had cotton. This isn't enough to draw any strong conclusions . Any body with any info on this pant would be a great help. Allot of research to do out in the libraries, historical societies and universities, any body can do this. The English didn't break the German code in World War two with just a few people. Does anybody have the 1880 work census. I want to see if Levi still used Chinese labor. In 1876 Levi employed 180 Chinese and 38 non-Chinese.

[aho]

^pre-ordered!

[Dr_Heech]

I don't think it has been mentioned on this thread (though it has on a couple others), but there is a book coming out at the end of the month called Jeans of the Old West by Michael Harris from Schiffer Publishing. I have had a copy on pre-order for a while and have been really looking forward to seeing it.

Perhaps it is only a coincidence that Sansome1877's name is Mike.

Had it on order ever since you gave me the heads-up some months ago. Due to be out 6th August (new Lvc stuff should be comin out around then too)

.

[Goominim]

Had it on order ever since you gave me the heads-up some months ago. Due to be out 6th August (new Lvc stuff should be comin out around then too)

.

What new LVC stuff? :eek:

[Dr_Heech]

What new LVC stuff? :eek:

The Lvc autumn/winter 2010 collection (sometimes called season two) usually comes out at the end of august, although I cant tell you what new items, if any, will be comin out. You'd have to hassle Paul on that one!

Mind you, it's 'XX' now, so even more reason to be excited!

.

[denimdestroyedmylife]

I feel pretty foolish not looking on this site before, between work family and research, it just slipped past me. My book will be out at the end of the month. I just got my advanced copy last week. Amazon has it for sale at $23.09 . I should have been paying attention to LVC. years ago.

pre-ordered

looking forward to this one

[Mr Black]

Book sounds great. Will have it on order very soon.

[Maynard Friedman]

The Lvc autumn/winter 2010 collection (sometimes called season two) usually comes out at the end of august, although I cant tell you what new items, if any, will be comin out. You'd have to hassle Paul on that one!

Mind you, it's 'XX' now, so even more reason to be excited!

.

I'd be more excited if the content was XXX!

[wgmds]

So here is the new lvc supposed to drop? Too bad I got a pair of 660wh. I hope they Fix the length this season

[dr.house]

I feel pretty foolish not looking on this site before, between work family and research, it just slipped past me. My book will be out at the end of the month. I just got my advanced copy last week. Amazon has it for sale at $23.09 . I should have been paying attention to LVC. years ago. The pant on page 1 named 1886xx. Is this a real pant from the archive. I think it has to be, this would suggest that all Levi pants had a center patch and a watch pocket on the waist band. This 1886xx has cotton pocket bags, this sounds correct. I have only seen about 4 levi's from 1880 to 85. All had center patches three had denim pocket bags and one had cotton. This isn't enough to draw any strong conclusions . Any body with any info on this pant would be a great help. Allot of research to do out in the libraries, historical societies and universities, any body can do this. The English didn't break the German code in World War two with just a few people. Does anybody have the 1880 work census. I want to see if Levi still used Chinese labor. In 1876 Levi employed 180 Chinese and 38 non-Chinese.

^ Preordered. Ha, and I can't wait for LVC season 2, sorry, XX

[dr.house]

Washed my filthy lil' 44's the 4th time today:

[silencejoe]

What year did Lvc come out with these and did they have a Two hoarse brand patch?

my 1880's KNAPPAVE

[mikedbt5]

I havent posted in ages and had scaled down to one pair of 1967 505 non selvage and a pair of 1947s . Washed (1947s were hot soaked) them a week or so ago and the results are as follows . Both been worn on and off over the last 8-10 months , mostly the 505s to my work . Photos arent great but theres a bloody gale blowing in Belfast today so pics arent easy to take !