Denim Blunders, Reflections and General Nonsense.

[FreeCharlesManson]

on point, and they are made in malaysia, right?

Macau is where they're made. apparently the factory is like anything you'd find in Canada or america

[unders]

Made in Macau. They served me fairly nicely for a time not so long back when I had the urge for some new raw denim but cash was tight (house move, baby, bust car,etc).

They'll just be dipped a few times less than most jeans, a bit like APC.

Edit: two people already called Macau.

Edited September 8, 2015 by unders

[Blue Nemo]

Macau is where they're made. apparently the factory is like anything you'd find in Canada or america

 

 

good for the people working there. still don't like the approach, but it is what it is, and i think its quiet a good product for what it aims for.

 

edit: one thing though, that 'unbranded' jeans are so cheap is because they use cheap materials and labor. not because they are 'unbranded' and the company does not throw vast amounts of cash out of the window for machiavellian (?) ads/propaganda. never bought that line.

Edited September 8, 2015 by Blue Nemo

[FreeCharlesManson]

good for the people working there. still don't like the approach, but it is what it is, and i think its quiet a good product for what it aims for.

 

edit: one thing though, that 'unbranded' jeans are so cheap is because they use cheap materials and labor. not because they are 'unbranded' and the company does not throw vast amounts of cash out of the window for machiavellian (?) ads/propaganda. never bought that line.

yeah i think in the AMA the unbranded guys did on reddit the mentioned how apparently Macau has pretty good human rights laws, but still has the cheep labour you would find in china. also because the jeans are unbranded they don't need custom leather patches, rivets etc.. and by not having to get custom they do keep cost down 

[Frost]

 

 

edit: one thing though, that 'unbranded' jeans are so cheap is because they use cheap materials and labor. not because they are 'unbranded' and the company does not throw vast amounts of cash out of the window for machiavellian (?) ads/propaganda. never bought that line.

 

Naming your brand Unbranded and declaring that no branding is what sets your brand apart from the rest is some genius post-modernist marketing though. Serious metafictional stuff, and it completely works because most people buy it at face value and don't see it as a marketing statement in itself (not realizing that saying you don't do marketing is a form of marketing)...

[dwilson123]

Every 21 oz. pair I see seems to look so similar.  Probably due to the hyper fast fading of the denim every loses pretty much the same amount of indigo.  Since they're generally an entry level pair the people wearing them follow the "Water will kill my jeans if it touches it before 8 months!" so you get stupidly comic book-esque contrasts.  Not my thing.  That isn't even adding that I think they fade to a really ugly color.

[newpatterns]

When people have asked me for 'starter pair' advice I've always preferred to suggest Japan Blue over UB, even if it means saving for a little longer.

 

This whole thing is about #details on your pants and UB has no #details for me to get hard over where as JB I can get in to. Really wanted to like that Cote d'Ivoire denim more than I did once I saw it in person as I dug the tricolour selvedge line...

Edited September 8, 2015 by newpatterns

[clt3]

When people usually look at starter pairs, all they're really after is a pair of jeans that will give them fades. It's not the same with the people who look at higher end brands because these Japanese brands are more of reproduction and Japanese interpretations of Levi's. That's probably the reason why Unbranded is so popular, even if the fabric isn't dyed as well as higher end pairs, because lightly dyed fabric is exactly what these people are looking for.

[Blue Nemo]

Naming your brand Unbranded and declaring that no branding is what sets your brand apart from the rest is some genius post-modernist marketing though. Serious metafictional stuff, and it completely works because most people buy it at face value and don't see it as a marketing statement in itself (not realizing that saying you don't do marketing is a form of marketing)...

You are using the term 'genius' way too liberately.

[cmboland]

When people have asked me for 'starter pair' advice I've always preferred to suggest Japan Blue over UB, even if it means saving for a little longer.

 

This whole thing is about #details on your pants and UB has no #details for me to get hard over where as JB I can get in to. Really wanted to like that Cote d'Ivoire denim more than I did once I saw it in person as I dug the tricolour selvedge line...

 

Consider most people who are new to raw denim though, they most likely want to try them on or have the option of  an easy exchange. Buying JB in the states is considerably more expensive than unbranded but buying them from japan they are about the same price. I usually recommend UB because theyre sold in quite a few American retailers and usually people wont have issues with exchanging if they size wrong.

[edmond]

Lets stop talking about unbranded pls.

[itsbenhere]

yeah i dont care if people from reddit come over here but lets keep this civilized

[Blue Nemo]

lol again

[Raoul Duke]

I don't understand the concept of a "starter" pair.  Just spend the loot and get something good that you'll actually want to wear for a few years. Discount versions of an artisanal product meant to be worn heavily over a number of years makes zero sense to me. The difference in cost per wear over their lifespan is ridiculously negligible.  

 

With the current YEN/USD conversion rates, I can't fathom why someone would ever buy a pair of Gustin or Unbranded anything. This is like the golden age for buying denim from Japan right now. Jeans cost 65% of what they used to cost me like 8 years ago. Adjust for inflation and they're practically giving them away! 

[itsbenhere]

I get the concept of a starter pair of you're really not sure if you are interested or not. My retort is just do research longer to get a better idea. I bought iron heart as my first jeans and I don't regret it at all, although I wish I bought a pair of flat heads instead (obviously.) Funny enough they were the first brand I wrote off because the fades were ugly.... In 2010/11 NO ONE from the west washed FH regularly or even sized them heads right.

It is the golden age, glad I bought my leather jacket a month or so ago

Edited September 9, 2015 by itsbenhere

[FeloniousMonk]

Speaking as someone who has a couple Gustin jeans, they use some oddball fabrics that would be too gimmicky for the top Japanese companies but are fun once-in-a-while pairs (for me, the grey silks and oxbloods). Plus their model makes it cheap enough to own jeans that you may only wear a few times a month.

 

Though for standard every-day indigo, definitely agree.

[dwilson123]

These days I agree the concept of starter pair is a bit lost on me.  But that is also coming from someone who has a good full time job and knows my measurements exactly.  So my opinion is probably extremely skewed.  When I first started getting into denim communities like this one and reddit were not there (or not quite as matured as now.)  I had to browse mynudies.com to look at any fades and I didn't have a concept of Japanese denim.  So some of those barriers are torn down where you don't need to go from entry level to "high end."  You can get fairly high end jeans from Japan dirt cheap these days.

 

I'd be interested to know how many people go from "starter" pairs to fully immerse themselves in denim.  I know for me I've always had an odd obsession with denim.  Whenever I had to wear khakis it felt wrong and off.  Obviously back then I was a broke kid so my fetish was satisfied by junk Levi's but my love for denim is not something spawned out of internet message boards.  It is in my DNA and raw denim was a pretty logical progression for me.  I wonder how many people force themselves into raw denim simply because it is trendy at the moment.

[DhaDha]

DhaDha you going to be at the pronto carnival this year?

 

hey i think so yes, wanna grab a pint?

 

starter pairs are a fallacy if you buy into unbranded. why would you do that? why would you pay for something that were designed to have shorter life to begin with when you could save a bit more and get more than twice the useful value (more indigo retention)? especially now that you can get a pair of unsanforized 22oz jawnz from indonesia for 160usd shipped? 

and please stop it with 'dyed lighter', wtf does that even mean you know? it means that make their material cheaper for cost/profit purpose and thats why they could afford to sell inferior product on the market for the price they're charging. if u in the game long enough to want to try heavy weight denim, then you should know your shit. if you don't, your loss, just stay with inherently inferior product, 

yawn. i dont always agree with ed, but he's right, can we stop talking about ubranded?

[DhaDha]

 

I'd be interested to know how many people go from "starter" pairs to fully immerse themselves in denim.  I know for me I've always had an odd obsession with denim.  Whenever I had to wear khakis it felt wrong and off.  Obviously back then I was a broke kid so my fetish was satisfied by junk Levi's but my love for denim is not something spawned out of internet message boards.  It is in my DNA and raw denim was a pretty logical progression for me.  I wonder how many people force themselves into raw denim simply because it is trendy at the moment.

it's a war of attrition man. i've loved raw denim before i could afford a pair, more than 10 years ago. see who sticks around in 10 years time. i bet reddit won't be there. 

[itsbenhere]

Is raw denim really that trendy though? I don't see it in person anywhere, really anywhere other than the Internet. Although I saw a pair of flat heads at my local mall and that blew my mind.

[dwilson123]

Is raw denim really that trendy though? I don't see it in person anywhere, really anywhere other than the Internet. Although I saw a pair of flat heads at my local mall and that blew my mind.

 

I just assumed so since brands like Arizona, GAP, American Eagle and the likes have raw denim offerings.  I think we're on the downward curve of the popularity graph I'm pretty sure it's peaked, though.

 

In terms of if high-end Japanese raw denim is any more or less trendy and popular I'd have to assume they at least so a decent bump in sales in the past 5 years or so.  But without any actual numbers I'm just talking out of my ass.

[edmond]

Pay to play bitch no money no honey grt some target jeans if you cant afford shit real talk.

[Raoul Duke]

Preach on, brotha! 

[DhaDha]

each time i walk around in bangkok there're always a bunch of people wearing selvedge, and i'm not talking about knock-off selvedge levi's they sell here for 10 buck, but japanese selvedge. we have take5, countless pronto branches, and countless other raw denim boutique. so yes, at least here in SEAsia raw denim is really in-trend. 

[Geeman]

hey i think so yes, wanna grab a pint?

 

I'll ping you a PM a day or so before!

[Cucoo]

Is raw denim really that trendy though? I don't see it in person anywhere, really anywhere other than the Internet. Although I saw a pair of flat heads at my local mall and that blew my mind.

 

In my hometown there's a small but vivid rockabilly / greaser community that goes the whole nine yards with regards to tattoos and amount of polka dots you can fit on one person. They all wear their jeans with big (and I mean, really 50s huge) cuffs, and not once have I seen a selvedge line. I don't really get that, if you obsess over the 50s hotrod aesthetic, why not buy a couple less bandanas and leather wrist cuffs and invest in one decent pair of jeans. It's all off the rack Levi's, sized up to look old-timey baggy. Telling them about 50s repros would probably blow their minds.

 

It's really strange, because denim is such a huge part of the whole 50s culture, how can you not get into repro brands when you're into that?

[Maynard Friedman]

Why don't you do the decent thing and introduce them to premium 50s repros? Make sure you're wearing a nylon boiler suit though, as blown minds are usually messy affairs.

[unders]

In my experience if you ain't hip rockabillies won't give you the time of day.

I say keep the knowledge & stick with your Western / Southern Rock pals - much cooler!

[newpatterns]

The Australian rockabilly scene wear a fair bit of selvedge, pretty much all LVC, although I don't think it's deliberate.

[Blue Nemo]

In my hometown there's a small but vivid rockabilly / greaser community that goes the whole nine yards with regards to tattoos and amount of polka dots you can fit on one person. They all wear their jeans with big (and I mean, really 50s huge) cuffs, and not once have I seen a selvedge line. I don't really get that, if you obsess over the 50s hotrod aesthetic, why not buy a couple less bandanas and leather wrist cuffs and invest in one decent pair of jeans. It's all off the rack Levi's, sized up to look old-timey baggy. Telling them about 50s repros would probably blow their minds.

 

It's really strange, because denim is such a huge part of the whole 50s culture, how can you not get into repro brands when you're into that?

Damn, don't get me started.

As much as I appreciate a certain style, in the end it is about the denim. That is what sets me, and I guess 'us', apart from the rest of the weirdos. Be that rockabillys or goldminers or whatever.