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Acronym.

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2 hours ago, 468262 said:

My man Errolson's slowly pricing out people who, in a very real sense, helped to make the brand what it is today.

I don't like the price hike either, but if the brand is slowly growing, so should the spending power of the people who helped make the brand what it is today? I mean, the only thing that seems to be going down in price nowadays is my investment in crypto..... 

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It would be nice if E made slightly more of each piece to hedge against raising prices this high. At this rate I can see the next gen J1A-GT at 2.2k at retail easily.

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1 hour ago, Muin said:

It would be nice if E made slightly more of each piece to hedge against raising prices this high. At this rate I can see the next gen J1A-GT at 2.2k at retail easily.

But strictly from a business perspective, if I could maximise profits and minimise my upfront capital, I definitely would. Especially if I run a small shop. 

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I haven't see the -COR up that close but I bet we all can see the XXs (=X-PAC). I compared the photo to the sampler from dymension-polyant and even when there is VX51 (Extreme X-PAC /w 500x1000 den cordura face) it looks more like the VX42 or VX21 (Terrain X-PAC /w 210 den nylon face). The VX51 /w cordura has more noticable weaving on the face and XXs less visible, but again it can be caused by age of @meccaNIZM's bag or the photo.

tldr; the olive bags will last as much as the -COR

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IMG_0817.JPG.963667dd9c776f3a55ed9522edcef27b.JPG

I took another crappy iphone photo so you can see the difference between rugged VX41 [L] and extreme VX51 [R]. On the other hand if acr says it's cordura, there is no need to question that, so the -COR are probably VX51. Sorry for another material X-PAC geekery post.

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44 minutes ago, danii said:

 

I took another crappy iphone photo so you can see the difference between rugged VX41 [L] and extreme VX51 [R]. On the other hand if acr says it's cordura, there is no need to question that, so the -COR are probably VX51. Sorry for another material X-PAC geekery post.

the material stuff is one of the best parts of the forum danii!

Edit: Also, you're like the only person making me feel better about that olive 3a-1 purchase :P

Edited by spladow

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13 hours ago, 468262 said:

 My man Errolson's slowly pricing out people who, in a very real sense, helped to make the brand what it is today.

Very much this. I don't begrudge ACR their success, which is more than deserved, but as someone who loved acr from the first time i saw it in 2010 i do feel sort of left behind. 

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I think it's also worth mentioning that acronym is more accepted in high fashion circles now, and considered in the same circles of cult luxury brands by those people (ie, a lot of long-time acr heads dress in head to toe acr the same way rick or yohji fans do). If you're into that tier of fashion, paying 2k+ usd for a trench coat/coat of similar cut to j53 isn't that much of a stretch. It sucks that it's pricing out so many longtime fans, but I can't say I'm too surprised at the direction the prices have taken, it just seems to have happened pretty quickly with every season/drop being noticeably more expensive than the last.

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5 minutes ago, shifty said:

I think it's also worth mentioning that acronym is more accepted in high fashion circles now, and considered in the same circles of cult luxury brands by those people (ie, a lot of long-time acr heads dress in head to toe acr the same way rick or yohji fans do). If you're into that tier of fashion, paying 2k+ usd for a trench coat/coat of similar cut to j53 isn't that much of a stretch. It sucks that it's pricing out so many longtime fans, but I can't say I'm too surprised at the direction the prices have taken, it just seems to have happened pretty quickly with every season/drop being noticeably more expensive than the last.

To be honest, I think they've been generous.  The technical and performance aspect of the gear could have easily gone for Yohji prices some time ago but it's been a slow and gradual build for years.  This reasoning is more in line with what seems to be happening.  He's taking his spot, which for the amount of time elapsed since its inception, is well deserved.

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On 11/17/2017 at 7:22 PM, austinalamualaykum said:

Regarding import duties to USA for the foil 3A-3TS release...

caveat: I'm by no means an expert on this kind of stuff and only used the valuable info previously provided by @CARLOOA and @Voyager to corroborate my own Google-ing. PLEASE correct me if I'm wrong.

  • My order was placed on the evening of the 15th. 
  • Didn't receive a shipment conf email from Acronym, but woke up today to an email from UPS informing me that $59.64 in duties are owed + the $11.00 brokerage fee UPS pockets (for fronting the duties on our behalf). A total of $70.64. 
  • Phoned UPS and was told that the tariff code associated with the package is 4202.22.30.40 ; this code corresponds to a 7.4% duty rate. 
  • Upon referring the code to the HTS cheat sheet (chp.42), I'd say that Acronym already provided UPS the most specific code (70% PA -nylon 30% PES -polyester) aka "man-made fibers."
  • With the most specific code already being assigned to the package, there's no chance that the duty percentage can be further lowered. 

tldr: Pay up ; the 7.4% duty rate is as low as it's going to get for these 3A foil bags.

So I'm in the process of trying to apply the tariff code that @austinalamualaykum did for his 3ts 4202.22.40.30 (think he mixed up the 30 and 40 after looking at the HTS cheat sheet he provided) which would bring the current duty rate of 17.6% (good lord) to 7.4% and I'm getting a response from UPS saying that the provided HTS code can only apply to bags that are made of items made of braids or has braids are somewhere in the make-up of the item.  she said that the shipper’s website does not note that the bags are made wholly or in part of braids and needs me to verify if the bags are made wholly or in part of braids so I am calling out to the community for help!

I looked up some of the definitions of braiding to see if the olive 3a-1 and 3ts meet the critieria and see that braiding is an interweaving of 3 or more strands.  wiki says that for nylon ripstop (what the xpac is made of), reinforcement threads are interwoven at regular intervals in a crosshatch pattern with thin and lightweight ripstop fabrics have a 3-dimensional structure due to the thicker threads being interwoven in thinner cloth. 

Wondering if this could be finagled into being seen as braid?  Calling fabric expert @danii for assistance!

-----------

UPDATE:  I'm sad to say that she will not use the HTS code provided above because she doesnt see the bags having braided parts in the make up of the bag, in the bag strap or braided cords for stitching and UPS would incur penalties in case of an audit.

If anyone is willing to gamble, the other option would be to become the IOR for the shipment which means that you would take responsibility for the shipment ensuring that all information provided is true and correct.  UPS would then process the shipment with the HTS code provides but in the event of a Customs Audit, instead of UPS, you would be responsible for any penalties possibly assessed which is why UPS isn't taking any risks with wrong codes.

In order for anyone to be the IOR, UPS would require the receiver to sign a POA, and obtain a bond.  (There is a fee for bonds which varies).  Any information regarding this would likely be handled by their POA department. 

-guess i'm just gonna pay it (sad face)...

Edited by segue
update

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Heads up for all broke boi’s, the tariff code for the 3TS should be 4202.22.40.30.  SDF almost had me until I checked Chapter 42 and noted that the numbers were transposed as per the earlier post which included 4202.22.30.40 as the tariff code.  Be on the lookout and stay broke boi safe out here!!

Posted this on 12/6.

 

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1 hour ago, segue said:

So I'm in the process of trying to apply the tariff code that @austinalamualaykum did for his 3ts 4202.22.40.30 (think he mixed up the 30 and 40 after looking at the HTS cheat sheet he provided) which would bring the current duty rate of 17.6% (good lord) to 7.4% and I'm getting a response from UPS saying that the provided HTS code can only apply to bags that are made of items made of braids or has braids are somewhere in the make-up of the item.  she said that the shipper’s website does not note that the bags are made wholly or in part of braids and needs me to verify if the bags are made wholly or in part of braids so I am calling out to the community for help!

I looked up some of the definitions of braiding to see if the olive 3a-1 and 3ts meet the critieria and see that braiding is an interweaving of 3 or more strands.  wiki says that for nylon ripstop (what the xpac is made of), reinforcement threads are interwoven at regular intervals in a crosshatch pattern with thin and lightweight ripstop fabrics have a 3-dimensional structure due to the thicker threads being interwoven in thinner cloth. 

Wondering if this could be finagled into being seen as braid?  Calling fabric expert @danii for assistance!

-----------

UPDATE:  I'm sad to say that she will not use the HTS code provided above because she doesnt see the bags having braided parts in the make up of the bag, in the bag strap or braided cords for stitching and UPS would incur penalties in case of an audit.

If anyone is willing to gamble, the other option would be to become the IOR for the shipment which means that you would take responsibility for the shipment ensuring that all information provided is true and correct.  UPS would then process the shipment with the HTS code provides but in the event of a Customs Audit, instead of UPS, you would be responsible for any penalties possibly assessed which is why UPS isn't taking any risks with wrong codes.

In order for anyone to be the IOR, UPS would require the receiver to sign a POA, and obtain a bond.  (There is a fee for bonds which varies).  Any information regarding this would likely be handled by their POA department. 

-guess i'm just gonna pay it (sad face)...

Olive 3A-1

4202.92.97.00  

Trunks, suitcases, vanity cases, attache cases, briefcases, school satchels, spectacle cases, binocular cases, camera cases, musical instrument cases, gun cases, holsters and similar containers; traveling bags, insulated food or beverage bags, toiletry bags, knapsacks and backpacks, handbags, shopping bags, wallets, purses, map cases, cigarette cases, tobacco pouches, tool bags, sports bags, bottle cases, jewelry boxes, powder cases, cutlery cases and similar containers, of leather or of composition leather, of sheeting of plastics, of textile materials, of vulcanized fiber or of paperboard, or wholly or mainly covered with such materials or with paper: (con.) 4202 (con.) Other: (con.) With outer surface of sheeting of plastics or of textile materials: (con.)

4202.92 (con.)

                       Other: (con.)

                                .91  ----------17.6%

                                .93  ----------17.6%

                                .94  ----------17.6%

                                .97  

                   4202.92.97 00 Other 1/................................................ Free (A, AU, BH, 45% CA, CL, CO, D, IL, JO, KR, MA, MX, NP, OM, P, PA, PE, SG) 16.6% (E) No............. 17.6%

 

the tariff code applied to this bag is completely correct, and even if it wasn't, the other code suffix's for said textiles with surface sheeting of plastics are all taxed at the same rate.

 

options to lower code are: 

lie to ups and convince them that the spec sheet is the outer layer of the bag making it a paper / textile at which rate the tax is 0% (4202.99.30.00)

or

suck it up, you know what you signed up for.

 

Edited by nodre

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1 hour ago, GFNS said:

To be honest, I think they've been generous.  The technical and performance aspect of the gear could have easily gone for Yohji prices some time ago but it's been a slow and gradual build for years.  This reasoning is more in line with what seems to be happening.  He's taking his spot, which for the amount of time elapsed since its inception, is well deserved.

Speaking strictly about performance/technical aspects of the garments, how can it be generous if other brands are using the same fabric and selling it at 30% the cost? If you want to talk about how the price is a factor of a smaller shop, less capacity, etc. that would be another story - but arguing on performance merit alone seems to fall on its face.

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4 minutes ago, solographik said:

Speaking strictly about performance/technical aspects of the garments, how can it be generous if other brands are using the same fabric and selling it at 30% the cost? If you want to talk about how the price is a factor of a smaller shop, less capacity, etc. that would be another story - but arguing on performance merit alone seems to fall on its face.

Removing Veilance from the equation that is.  There are a ton of flowy and frilly garments that go for 3K or better.  The argument isn't production/output/value, it's more ACRNM being more likened to Recon than Raf for eons and now that they get some shine we all want to complain about hikes.  This was a long time coming.  I for one can't justify 1,167 for the X-Pac 3A-1, especially when I got my Limonta for almost half that but I'm still copping what I like moving forward.  In a nutshell, respect due.  The grind has been a long haul for them and I think it's good to see them get recognized instead of bitten and chewed.  It's about time they start to recoup.

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10 minutes ago, nodre said:

options to lower code are: 

lie to ups and convince them that the spec sheet is the outer layer of the bag making it a paper / textile at which rate the tax is 0% (4202.99.30.00)

or

suck it up, you know what you signed up for.

LOL at the 'convince them that the spec sheet is the outer layer.' has anyone ever even done that? seems ridiculous lol

The rep also ended up assigning 4202.22.8100 to the shoulder bags (3a-1 or 3ts) the zipper bags (mz3 or mz5) as 4202.32.9300 both which are at the 17.6% rate.

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I did convince them that P23A-DS could be used as overalls if you threw the belt straps over your shoulders and it did get my duties lowered, so it may be possible!!

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6 minutes ago, Stunt said:

I did convince them that P23A-DS could be used as overalls if you threw the belt straps over your shoulders and it did get my duties lowered, so it may be possible!!

This is goddamn brilliant.

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39 minutes ago, GFNS said:

Removing Veilance from the equation that is.  There are a ton of flowy and frilly garments that go for 3K or better.  The argument isn't production/output/value, it's more ACRNM being more likened to Recon than Raf for eons and now that they get some shine we all want to complain about hikes.  This was a long time coming.  I for one can't justify 1,167 for the X-Pac 3A-1, especially when I got my Limonta for almost half that but I'm still copping what I like moving forward.  In a nutshell, respect due.  The grind has been a long haul for them and I think it's good to see them get recognized instead of bitten and chewed.  It's about time they start to recoup.

Wasn't your original point that "the technical and performance aspect of the gear" made it worth yohji-esque prices? That's the part that I'm taking issue with, as other brands are selling similarly designed things in similar materials for a significantly lower cost.

You can make the argument that you can't separate the two, but that isn't how i interpreted your original comment. I don't begrudge the ACR team for raising prices, but I think ACR is fully cementing itself in the high-fashion market vs. the hard wearing, technical apparel gear that brought us here in the first place.

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6 minutes ago, Stunt said:

I did convince them that P23A-DS could be used as overalls if you threw the belt straps over your shoulders and it did get my duties lowered, so it may be possible!!

It's amazing what soft skills do. I keep dealing with the same person because of my last name, she just approves what codes I've been using now.

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1 hour ago, solographik said:

Wasn't your original point that "the technical and performance aspect of the gear" made it worth yohji-esque prices? That's the part that I'm taking issue with, as other brands are selling similarly designed things in similar materials for a significantly lower cost.

You can make the argument that you can't separate the two, but that isn't how i interpreted your original comment. I don't begrudge the ACR team for raising prices, but I think ACR is fully cementing itself in the high-fashion market vs. the hard wearing, technical apparel gear that brought us here in the first place.

Yeah, that way..

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4 hours ago, solographik said:

Speaking strictly about performance/technical aspects of the garments, how can it be generous if other brands are using the same fabric and selling it at 30% the cost? If you want to talk about how the price is a factor of a smaller shop, less capacity, etc. that would be another story - but arguing on performance merit alone seems to fall on its face.

Right. ACR's design is exemplary, but they're often not first to market. The "PB" fabric showed up as Shakedry before Acronym released the J62 or J63.

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New ACRNM formula of success: Add Tecsys/different fabric/tweak(improve/fix) issues on past iteration(s).. charge 2x plus shipping

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I'm not particularly surprised to see that the prices have gone up as much as they have; if your product sells out within minutes (as in the last couple releases), you are definitely leaving money on the table, and resale prices (which are observable on Grailed) confirm that.  I personally paid about 2K for a J53 on Grailed (which felt like a lot at the time but now looks like a decent price, incidentally...), and while I was happy to get the jacket, I felt pretty badly that E and company saw nothing for that transaction.  I don't think this means that prices can never go down, though -- at a certain point, you're leaving money on the table in lost sales instead (or foregone interest -- gotta watch your opportunity costs), or your operation requires more upfront revenue vs. a trickle of sales over time, etc.  I don't get the sense that Acronym is a large enough operation to have a staff economist working out pricing for them, so we may be seeing some rougher estimates here, but I'm glad to see them at least trying to triangulate a price point that makes them more money rather than giving the market away to resellers.

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21 hours ago, lxkhor said:

I don't like the price hike either, but if the brand is slowly growing, so should the spending power of the people who helped make the brand what it is today? I mean, the only thing that seems to be going down in price nowadays is my investment in crypto..... 

LOL I sold a jacket and put it into bitcoin. doubly down. I figured it was the best way to keep that acr money going towards the cyberpunk dream :)

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10 minutes ago, spladow said:

LOL I sold a jacket and put it into bitcoin. doubly down. I figured it was the best way to keep that acr money going towards the cyberpunk dream :)

YOUCH. That double whammy. :( But you're right, we have to do our part for the cyberpunk dream :)

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4 hours ago, drgitlin said:

Right. ACR's design is exemplary, but they're often not first to market. The "PB" fabric showed up as Shakedry before Acronym released the J62 or J63.

Not sure where this misconception comes from, as someone who works for Gore confirmed that they are not the same fabric.

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15 minutes ago, rnstyip said:

Not sure where this misconception comes from, as someone who works for Gore confirmed that they are not the same fabric.

Yeah - ShakeDry is just an aesthetic/build specification, not a fabric. ‘PB’ or Film Out was a newly developed lightweight material as outlined in the lead up to ACR’s review event - the GoreTex brand name for it now, officially, is Infinium. (It will adopt a new code this year too, ‘FO’.)

Interestingly, Stone Island will also be introducing some items using it this year too.

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8 minutes ago, Danwise said:

Yeah - ShakeDry is just an aesthetic/build specification, not a fabric. ‘PB’ or Film Out was a newly developed lightweight material as outlined in the lead up to ACR’s review event - the GoreTex brand name for it now, officially, is Infinium. (It will adopt a new code this year too, ‘FO’.)

Interestingly, Stone Island will also be introducing some items using it this year too.

PB came in two different specifications/formulations I believe and actually is a new tech, the barrier layer is the face layer. Infinium is the subbrand for their non waterproof stuff.

Edited by CARLOOA

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