Warehouse

[cheapmuthafukr]

is it really a bad thing to have good artisan denim available in more places to more people? i doubt that warehouse is gonna cut corners on these jeans, and they have done collabs with other stores before, just not on this level. if anything, it means warehouse is making more money, which is never a bad thing.

or maybe youre worried about people you think arent cool knowing about the shit you do? get over yourselves... a doucebag in warehouse is the same as a douchebag in ed hardy. if you think youre better than someone else because of the clothes you wear, youre a douchebag.

[beatle]

a douchebag in warehouse is the same as a douchebag in ed hardy. .

true * it's just weird how 5 years ago it was almost impossible to get ur hands on Japanese denim...makes me feel like the adventure of discovering all the pieces out there is gonna be lost soon

[Snake]

Well said Cheap. I couldn't agree more.

I wouldn't worry too much about negative impacts on BIG. Gordon being the only North American distributor, I bet he is taking a cut. Also, who do you think JCREW is sending the jeans to for chainstitching?

[salaami]

as to what beatle just said it's a shame how they lurk here to find trends and then act as if they just discovered gold in SF. but a funny thing to me is how he is in the fashion industry and he says he just found warehouse last year. yeah right. making himself sound more aloof than he should be. the truth be told, warehouse is small, special, and not as many cats as we may think are 'up on' it.

cheep, i'm so broke a nigga can't even pay attention...i don't have enough change to change my mind

[milosz]

Why is it unlikely that he ran across it on a trip? I don't find that unbelievable at all. J. Crew is embracing the Americana thing that Japan's been doing for 20 years, wouldn't shock me for them to send designers and buyers over there to scope out potential trends.

"Not many people know" is factually correct - as evidenced by BiG being the only place to get it in the Western Hemisphere (or outside of Asia at all, AFAIK)

Unionmade (I think) mentioned that some bigwig with J. Crew came in his shop and ran across Rogue Territory goods.

[mlyngard]

if you think youre better than someone else because of the clothes you wear, youre a douchebag.

Agreed, but it cheapens the experience a little for me. I appreciate the nuances and heritage of the denim. I feel that appreciation took time for me to learn from you all here on the Forums and from wearing it and earning it. So it's not about 'cool factor' for me.

No hate, just disappointment. Look - if ten thousand new noobs came here saying they were gonna buy WH from Gordon, I'd be thrilled. I just feel like JCrew hijacks the work and love of places like BiG (and this forum). Let the enthusiasts do the hard work establishing the trend, then appropriate it.

Also, who do you think JCREW is sending the jeans to for chainstitching?

Not Gordon. A Levis place, maybe. Union Specials aren't that hard to come by.

[mlyngard]

Why is it unlikely that he ran across it on a trip?

, wouldn't shock me for them to send designers and buyers over there to scope out potential trends.

Wouldn't surprise me either that they might scope Japanese trends. But they aren't making a move on any Japanese trends without proof that it translates to the US market.

My assumed timeline:

- Jcrew follows WH contest. JC well aware of BiG. JC likes WH contest results.

- Jcrew assesses all of BiG and SE's brands for best marketability and compatibility with existing store image. Follow blogs to assess popularity.

- JCrew sends scouts to WH on one of their regular scouting/buying trip to Asia. JC and Warehouse discuss feasibility of collab.

- JCrew 'discovers' Warehouse in Japan. Makes press announcement.

- JC repeats same process for footwear, outerwear departments, etc, etc,....

[weirdnjfan1]

I look at like this.

1) J Crew is willing to get stuff that is out side the norm to the norm. An example is found at the their Broadway store. Most people who shop there, IE young urban professionals, wouldn't think twice of wearing Red Wing or a brand that they have never heard of before, such as Quoddy, even it was offered to them. By doing this collaboration with Warehouse, it shows that they are will to take a risk.

2) Most of the people who shop a J Crew shop there for on reason, the quality of clothing. Granted a few years ago it look like a senior version of Abercrombie and Fitch, but in recent years, it has switched over to some what of a classic Americana work wear style. Granted, most of the people who will be buying these jeans will probably people who have no clue who or what Warehouse is for that matter, the only thing that will matter to them is the quality of the jeans.

That's just my two cents.

[salaami]

the thing is how many people will be willing to pay the $300 for the jeans, and how much of a price difference is there between these and their most expensive 'premium jean' ?

[mlyngard]

I think a huge amount of effort from JCrew goes into market research and risk assessment before they launch anything. It's about as white-bread "safe" as you can get.

[cheapmuthafukr]

i think the most expensive jcrew branded jean is like 225... and the lvc 47 that they have is close to 300.

id do it on a jcrew cc... just cause gordon doesnt have a payment plan. im interested to see the cut too... first truly slim warehouse jean??

[heflys]

I could care less whether they researched it on the internet or not. I'm interested in seeing the product.

[fardin]

as much as we all love warehouse i also dont see whats so bad about jcrew having now a collabo with em. not that i am a j crew fan. i second what cheep said, and his paul quote says it too. i dont give a shit how many people wear the same stuff that i do or for what reason. its not a competition after all. sure its nice to be part of this comunity here. of corse its easy to say all this you live in a city where as it seamy just one guy know of those things. still.

but i dont believ j crew findig out about warehouse on their own. i mean BIG is in the same city doing what they think is new for some years now.

anyway i usually dont write so much bull. ( after all nobody sells the real cool warehouse stuff like hellers or duckdiggers outside of japan anymore asit seems)

here is are some pics from the warehouse blog. someone posted them 2 month ago. so i dont even see whats new about the collabo all of a sudden.

http://ameblo.jp/forgetmyself/archive5-201002.html#main

[Snake]

It seems Mr. Fujiki change the content of the blog. When it was first posted, the blog had pictures of Gordon doing the translation between Mr. Fujiki and JCREW. It also showed some of the stuff JCREW was researching like UES denim and KTM flannel shirt. JCREW did not hijack anything. Gordon helped JCREW to get this collab done. It seems logical that JCREW would go to Gordon for chainstitching services.

@fardin – Heller’s Café x WH collection has some really unique stuff. I have a Heller’s Café X WH outdoor flannel shirt. It is my favorite flannel shirt.

[milosz]

I'm thinking this will basically be a 660 cut - slim straight, a more 'modern' rise than the 800, without being too skinny for the J. Crew customer base.

[aho]

^Exactly what I'm thinking fit wise...The 660 is the perfect cut for my body type so I'm excited to see what they come up with! 484 is a confusing lot number for them especially since their own skinny fit is the "484" slim jean but I am actually a fan of their "Vintage Slim" cut...

[ssheat]

Snake makes a good point and that was something I was thinking about while reading the initial discussion. Gordon and BiG are definitely gaining, both in terms of physical revenue and promotion. BiG is still the North American retailer of Warehouse, and JCrew is only carrying a single collaboration jean. When the average consumer looks to find out more about the product they'll be directed to BiG (and these forums). BiG was most certainly aware of this collaboration and most probably did have some involvement in making it happen.

For those of you saying that this brings down JCrew and Warehouse, this sort of thing will only continue. As Americana and this aesthetic gain popularity, larger names will start looking to profit of of it, and this certainly may be through working with the original pioneers of reproduction.

I personally will definitely check out the jean in person. The cut sounds vaguely similar to the 660, but it seems to be a more modern cut tailored to fit people on this (western) side of the planet with warehouse's denim. That sounds worthy of a collaboration to me. If this collaboration or other people enjoying the same thing as you dampens your interest in japanese reproduction-based denim, you should re-assess your initial interest.

Edit: Two posts about cut since I first started up this post.

I see this being a low-mid rise tapered cut with a fairly slim thigh, but not 484 slim at all. I doubt that there will be any of the anti-fit in the seat like there is on the 660. The cut's going to be good (for me at least).

[Opie]

I could care less whether they researched it on the internet or not. I'm interested in seeing the product.

See this is what i don't get.

On what level is anyone on this forum "interested in seeing the product"?

This won't be different or exciting at all.

Actually, for us, it will be a complete run of the mill five-pocket pair of jeans.

We've seen Mr. Freedom make wacky jeans with leatherpockets.

We've seen hand dyed AWA jeans and Jomons with their 600+ usd price tags.

We've even seen jeans with Kevlar in!

They aren't gonna invent the round platter to serve a largely unknowing mass.

These are only interesting to someone who has dick knowledge about denim and "our" nerdy approach to it.

And if i sound like an elitist prick, then alright.

No hate at all Heflys, i get the same thought whenever i see a new denim product. I've just gotten old on "amazing collabs" and "never before seen quality"

[heflys]

See this is what i don't get.

On what level is anyone on this forum "interested in seeing the product"?

This won't be different or exciting at all.

Actually, for us, it will be a complete run of the mill five-pocket pair of jeans.

In the same vein, I could say the same thing about any denim brand. But, seeing as I'm slightly more knowledgeable about denim, I know that jeans differ in overall design/quality. It's the reason why people prefer certain brands. The only individual who couldn't care about conception is the person who knows "dick" about denim. I only see denim aficionados being excited about this piece.

Why would an individual, who lacks knowledge, care about a collaboration with Warehouse?

[Opie]

In the same vein, I could say the same thing about any denim brand. But, seeing as I'm slightly more knowledgeable about denim, I know that jeans differ in overall design/quality. It's the reason why people prefer certain brands. The only individual who couldn't care about conception is the person who knows "dick" about denim. I only see denim aficionados being excited about this piece.

Why would an individual, who lacks knowledge, care about a collaboration with Warehouse?

I think you are missing that the average jcrew shopper is a wannabe denim aficionado.

They are getting the taste of all the aldens and expensive americana wear people in here have been on for ages.

I'm also pretty sure that this "new" pair of jeans will consist of:

Denim warehouse has used before.

A fit that's very very close to something warehouse has done before.

No details that seperates them from the mass of jeans we wade around in here.

Regarding the difference between brands.

Yes there is difference in cut and style, but they are so subtle that it is litteraly peoples personal taste (in here mind you) that determines what brand you choose.

I'm afraid that i'm rambling, so if the next doesn't make a whole lot of sense i appologize.

My point is that for the average jcrew shopper this will be a big deal. It will be a 300 usd pair of jeans with construction and materials way above what they are used to.

For us in here it's just another pair of 5 pocket jeans with a slightly different fit than the other 100 pairs we have access too.

[heflys]

I can't speculate on whether J. Crew's target demographic are wannabes, or who has the right to wear a product. It simply interest me because I'm a fan of denim, and have an appreciation of Warehouse's products. That's all.

[baldy]

i hate to use a sneakerhead analogy but it's like footlocker selling nike sb's back when it was hot. who else will be selling these premium denims next u know? just sayin

[heflys]

Vintage denim has been in the mainstream fashion media for a few years now. In fact, Kiya/SE has been featured on Hypebeast several times. Most brands manufacture cheaper versions of selvage denim to present to their consumers, instead of seeking the services of respected denim brands (sans Levi's). I doubt we'll be seeing Warehouse in Macy's because of a collaboration with J. Crew, since this type of denim is targeted towards a niche audience.

[baldy]

yea, i understand, but i can totally see a company cutting corners in making selvedge denim to keep up with demand (if they become more mainstream) i forgot which brand, but i think it is actually warehouse if i remember correctly that is having jeans made in china now. im not saying that the jeans are lower in quality, but they are targeted to be literally, cheaper.

edit- It is actually fullcount denims. pg 15 of fullcount thread. on my browser atleast

[heflys]

Seriously? China? God, I hope that isn't true. I'm not knocking China made product, but Warehouse being made in China? I don't see the point. Hopefully it's a mistake.

[mlyngard]

It seems Mr. Fujiki change the content of the blog. When it was first posted, the blog had pictures of Gordon doing the translation between Mr. Fujiki and JCREW. It also showed some of the stuff JCREW was researching like UES denim and KTM flannel shirt. JCREW did not hijack anything. Gordon helped JCREW to get this collab done. It seems logical that JCREW would go to Gordon for chainstitching services.

@fardin – Heller’s Café x WH collection has some really unique stuff. I have a Heller’s Café X WH outdoor flannel shirt. It is my favorite flannel shirt.

I stand corrected, and freshly educated. Thanks man, I didn't know those things. This is amazing dialogue and the reason I love this forum.

I was feeling pretty bent about this. I realized I was feeling like JCrew co-opted and appropriated a brand which the members on SuFu have made major inroads to explore and introduce to us. I guess I've been feeling like the knowledge this community developed was essentially 'stolen' and repackaged for resale to an audience that doesn't want to do that work. That bothered me.

JCrew does an admirable job at introducing classics to a market often unexposed to them. That's a good thing.

Yet JCrew's implied promise is that their products are 'edgy' yet 'safe' and already market-proven for immediate acceptance. No risk for the buyer. That's really bland.

I admire that those on this forum take risks with brands and cuts. I still think JCrew hijacked this subculture's knowledge-base.

I also know that's the way that market operates. I've worked as a team architectural designer for Pottery Barn/Williams Sonoma/West Elm and Gap. I worked on the Pottery Barn flagship in Soho - which cost the chain millions to renovate and was closed in six years. Nothing is riskier and less encouraged than an original idea in that world. Every move is calculated.

[Snake]

@mlyngard - I understand where you are coming from and I agree with you that JCREW is a marketing machine. I don't like a bunch of trend following clowns who can't appreciate warehouse denim and don't know about details such as all cotton thread, steel button rivets, roping, and chainstitch jump on the Warehouse Bandwagon. But just think of it this way, back in the early 1900s to the 1960s, how many people who wear Levi's and Lee knew about and appreciated those details? Levi's and Lees were also available everywhere.

I don't think any Warehouse product is made in China. I do know Fullcount started two entry models that are made in China with

Chinese cotton last month. Checkout Fullcount thread for that discussion.

I do think many Sufu members will be interested in this JC x WH collab if the fit is a good modern slim cut. Warehouse does not produce many slim models. Maybe 660, 800, and Warren standard and that's it. Rest of the line are all based on vinatge cuts.

[lostinthesupermarket]

Fullcount are the guys that are doing a cheaper, China-made jean.

My opinion about this J Crew thing is that they are likely doing it as a small scale loss leader which helps establish/ maintain their "hip" credentials . My bet is they expect to at best break even on it. They certainly aren't going to be selling thousands ( or even hundreds ) of pairs of these.

The fact that it's all to do with establishing that J Crew is hip and ahead of the game fexplains the necessity for this "J Crew man discovers Warehouse whilst in Japan" bullshit. You can expect an ongoing stream of similar "discoveries" from them. It's clearly part of their brand strategy.

My bet is that the merchandise will not shift quickly at 300 bucks a pop and that having gotten Warehouse as a notch on their corporate bedpost, they will move on to their next victim fairly quickly.

[aho]

I'm just saying...have any of our opinions on Mister Freedom changed after J.Crew started carrying them? In the long run, the Warehouse collaboration means little, as lost said in the post above me, just another corporate bedpost but I'm not going to limit myself if the finished product turns out great...Let's be honest, how many of us have that J.Crew chambray as a staple item in our closet... ("Made in China" be damned!)

[Christmas In A Submarine.]

I don't understand people freaking out about j.crew "stealing" all the "work" people here have done to "unearth" Warehouse. I get that some early adopters took some financial risks buying some jeans that might not fit and need to be resold/returned/whatever, but no people on Sufu (that I'm aware of) were hacking through dense forests or scaling sheer rock walls to get their hands on a pair of Warehouse...

and not to be a dick, but it's the internet, other people are gonna read it, even people who work for j.crew. who's really surprised?

anyhow, the bottom line for me is that supporting small brands doing good work is great, but so is having easy access to nice denim. Providing the quality of this pair of jeans is up to snuff I see this as a good combination of both, and who knows what larger consequences it will bring...