Conners Sewing Factory

[kicks79]

I can only imagine that CSF is concerned about people knowing which items he used to base his patterns off? Perhaps also worried that he is opening himself up to litigation from Levis? Still seems like a complete dick move. Doing things like that is the reason that the vintage customer base is small. Why wouldn't he want to share the knowledge? Looking at the wait-time on his items it seems that he is already pretty much at capacity, so is he that worried about competition? 

The whole thing reminds me of Supreme suing some other brand for ripping off their type font when they in turn had just lifted it from Barbara Kruger. 

[Dr_Heech]

I've been in constant contact with Denimseeker over this, trying to be supportive but also trying to figure a way round this problem. Despite alot of positive feedback and support, he has gone off-line now, probably fed up with the whole thing. I mean, you put 2 years of passion into writing a book and one of the so-called main dudes of our small denim world shafts you good and proper, it's hard to get over the shock. He's just one man, and has a family to think about; he's not part of some denim-bully boy mafia.

Although l promised to keep the details confidential, what l can say is that several pages of historically important (to the book, and to DS) photos and information have to be removed or blurred out due to the photos (belonging to an auction house originally) being now in the ownership of Konaka Yoshiaki. Not only the photos but the info/details gleaned from them have to be removed! (so that no one else can gain knowledge) I mean what a right wanker! It's not as though DS was making any financial profit from it, despite a PayPal donation option.

So I suggested to do as asked (to shut up any further litigations) but to replace said photos of similar jackets with similar details (if poss.) and then rewrite the text to accompany them. He said he'd been asked not do that because then the (roughly 170..) people who downloaded the original copy would know which jackets/info 'belonged' to Konaka. I mean .. Jesus H, what an absolute bell-end.

Anyway, although l absolutely love my conners jacket and jeans, l won't be buying another piece again.  I know the jeans aren't the man and they dont have that shitty attitude of his, but l cannot support a company or individual who treats people in this way,.

 

 

Edited August 25, 2021 by Dr_Heech
..

[Maynard Friedman]

I’ve burnt all my CSF jeans and jackets already.

[Duke Mantee]

57 minutes ago, Dr_Heech said:

I've been in constant contact with Denimseeker over this, trying to be supportive but also trying to figure a way round this problem. Despite alot of positive feedback and support, he has gone off-line now, probably fed up with the whole thing. I mean, you put 2 years of passion into writing a book and one of the so-called main dudes of our small denim world shafts you good and proper, it's hard to get over the shock. He's just one man, and has a family to think about; he's not part of some denim-bully boy mafia.

Although l promised to keep the details confidential, what l can say is that several pages of historically important (to the book, and to DS) photos and information have to be removed or blurred out due to the photos (belonging to an auction house originally) being now in the ownership of Konaka Yoshiaki. Not only the photos but the info/details gleaned from them have to be removed! (so that no one else can gain knowledge) I mean what a right wanker! It's not as though DS was making any financial profit from it, despite a PayPal donation option.

So I suggested to do as asked (to shut up any further litigations) but to replace said photos of similar jackets with similar details (if poss.) and then rewrite the text to accompany them. He said he'd been asked not do that because then the (roughly 170..) people who downloaded the original copy would know which jackets/info 'belonged' to Konaka. I mean .. Jesus H, what an absolute bell-end.

Anyway, although l absolutely love my conners jacket and jeans, l won't be buying another piece again.  I know the jeans aren't the man and they dont have that shitty attitude of his, but l cannot support a company or individual who treats people in this way,.

 

 

1. Looking for a solution

2. Supporting the actual injured party

3. Determination

 

Bravo 

[Dr_Heech]

3 hours ago, Maynard Friedman said:

I’ve burnt all my Levis Red jeans and jackets already.

Fixed that for you Mart 

[Flash]

Didnt burn anything but i did try to boil the patch on my unworn ww2 pair ( harder that it looks , thing was tough ) 

I toyed with the idea of selling my conners stuff because im disgusted by the way Yoshiaki has reacted but then I realised that there just jeans and just because they were made by an arsehole doesn't mean i still can't enjoy them for what they are ... a pair of jeans . Ill definitely not be buying anything else from him and but I'm still going to enjoy the stuff I have 

Really hope denimseeker can figure something out to release the ebook in some form because from what I've read so far you can see he has put a lot of work into it 

[Maynard Friedman]

The opposite in fact, all my Levi’s Red gear has been cryogenically frozen, awaiting the next fashion cycle that will look favourably upon their aesthetic. When that happens I’ll be Red or Dead!

[Broark]

9 minutes ago, Flash said:

just because they were made by an arsehole doesn't mean i still can't enjoy them for what they are ... a pair of jeans . Ill definitely not be buying anything else from him and but I'm still going to enjoy the stuff I have 

Definitely agree with this line of thinking.
The boiled patch looks good!

[bartlebyyphonics]

10 minutes ago, Flash said:

Really hope denimseeker can figure something out to release the ebook in some form because from what I've read so far you can see he has put a lot of work into it 

^ this... I remember seeing that shared on denimbro and was most excited to download ... 'tis a sad tale all round...  

[AlientoyWorkmachine]

6 hours ago, kicks79 said:

I can only imagine that CSF is concerned about people knowing which items he used to base his patterns off? Perhaps also worried that he is opening himself up to litigation from Levis? Still seems like a complete dick move. Doing things like that is the reason that the vintage customer base is small. Why wouldn't he want to share the knowledge? Looking at the wait-time on his items it seems that he is already pretty much at capacity, so is he that worried about competition? 

The whole thing reminds me of Supreme suing some other brand for ripping off their type font when they in turn had just lifted it from Barbara Kruger. 

I mean, okay - I can stretch myself to understand why he might be (childishly) upset, but I cannot see how this has any legal standing. What I'm trying to understand is what Denimseeker is actually afraid of - is it just getting flamed on the internet? If so, okay, I get that. But it sounded like there were some other concern. 

An art collector - perhaps someone who owns a significant painting, for instance, cannot just go after some art history textbook publisher that has a photograph of said painting in situ in a museum. The only person that would have any possible recourse to get that picture taken down would be the person who photographed the painting in situ. It may (may) be different if it's being used directly to sell something - property releases are a thing - but I don't see how that applies here - even if the ebook were for sale that likely wouldn't count because of the type of book it is - and especially if the items in question of the photographs are actually just old Levi's...

Can someone tell me what I'm getting wrong? 

[Maynard Friedman]

My guess is (and it really is a guess) that when CSF bought those vintage Levi’s items at auction, somehow they also acquired the rights to the photos displaying those acquired lots. Subsequently they weren’t happy with someone publishing them (albeit for free) without their consent, not that they would have given it anyway.

It seems reasonable that the auction house would have taken the lot photos and therefore the buyer could agree to receive them as IP along with the purchased lot. This may even be an automatic agreement,

In this case, it appears that it’s only those specific photos of the garments that were published unauthorised. If someone published alternative photos of the same garments, it would be OK.

Edited August 25, 2021 by Maynard Friedman

[Flash]

I really don't get it either , I think its all just an empty threat from Yoshiaki.  I'm guessing he thought he had something ( the items bought at auction ) that not many knew about and when he seen them being published in the ebook he panicked and started babbling about lawers and whatnot to scare denimseeker off , in any case he acted like a dickhead 

[Broark]

I think it's all just empty threats, don't think that he truly has much of a leg to stand on legally.
Sounds like he's been making these claims to others as well, which is indicative of just being a dick.
Or he's threatened that he'll be dethroned. 

[Thanks_M8]

All this talk of Konaka being an arsehole and all makes me want to get a pair of Bridge of Times or even a tux by them/him, just out of spite  

[Broark]

36 minutes ago, Thanks_M8 said:

All this talk of Konaka being an arsehole and all makes me want to get a pair of Bridge of Times or even a tux by them/him, just out of spite  

If you manage to find a way to get a pair let me know, I've been trying to get him to sell internationally for months now.

[Maynard Friedman]

He’s probably forbidden to do so by a dodgy agreement made under duress with CSF! 

[silencejoe]

2 hours ago, Flash said:

Didnt burn anything but i did try to boil the patch on my unworn ww2 pair ( harder that it looks , thing was tough ) 

I toyed with the idea of selling my conners stuff because im disgusted by the way Yoshiaki has reacted but then I realised that there just jeans and just because they were made by an arsehole doesn't mean i still can't enjoy them for what they are ... a pair of jeans . Ill definitely not be buying anything else from him and but I'm still going to enjoy the stuff I have 

Really hope denimseeker can figure something out to release the ebook in some form because from what I've read so far you can see he has put a lot of work into it 

I had went through the DS ebook 480pages, it is a really good levis guide book with all the information DS put together. Including all the detail ....very detial...if the denim tailor use this book as a guide no doubt that it can made csf style jeans or jacket. And althrough the pictures are download from internet.  DS did mentioned all the picture source. DS did a hardwork on this and the most important is it is a free ebook.

Edited August 25, 2021 by silencejoe

[MJF9]

What disappointing nonsense... and more, as covered above

We need no sueing, more sewing!

[Maynard Friedman]

23 minutes ago, MJF9 said:

What disappointing nonsense... and more, as covered above

We need no sueing, more sewing!

Quite! Less threats and more threads…

[freshwater]

52 minutes ago, MJF9 said:

What disappointing nonsense... and more, as covered above

We need no sueing, more sewing!

 

28 minutes ago, Maynard Friedman said:

Quite! Less threats and more threads…

Less needle, more needle....

[Maynard Friedman]

Less bitching and more stitching…

[AlientoyWorkmachine]

3 hours ago, Flash said:

I really don't get it either , I think its all just an empty threat from Yoshiaki.  I'm guessing he thought he had something ( the items bought at auction ) that not many knew about and when he seen them being published in the ebook he panicked and started babbling about lawers and whatnot to scare denimseeker off , in any case he acted like a dickhead 

Gosh, it sort of sounds like he's not familiar with how the internet works. 

In any case - it seems most niche communities have these sorts of petty folks and in my experience it has a silver lining in that it reveals people's true motives - which often isn't quite aligned with what brings most of the people together. In that sense it's informative.

If Denimseeker wants to put together a pair now I'd probably buy them. 

[Thanks_M8]

2 hours ago, Broark said:

If you manage to find a way to get a pair let me know, I've been trying to get him to sell internationally for months now.

Just messaged him on IG, will let you know, once I know more  

[andrewrose]

Not much to add, but I agree a very dick move. I don’t know how/if someone in Japan could sue someone in China. Is that even possible? Isn’t some inverse of that what has protected those Japanese denim makers using tabs and arcs from the litigious arms of Levi’s?

I used to work in the wine world, and auctions are a big part of sales in the rare/older/big name side of things. Auction houses publish catalogs, photographed by their people. You can have a catalog, and buy the wine, but you don’t own the photos, which are often also published online.

Sounds like this is a bit of a different situation than Christie’s or whoever, but not sure how buying the item for sale gives you ownership of all past images taken of said item, especially if they’re just floating around on the internet. Or why someone would even think that was true in the first place.

[Dr_Heech]

This shit is spreading ....

Apparently, the baby from Nirvana's Nevermind album cover is sueing the band for misuse of an image without permission () and child pornography  . After 30 plus years.

So think yourself lucky @Denimseeker

 

Edited August 25, 2021 by Dr_Heech

[AlientoyWorkmachine]

2 hours ago, Dr_Heech said:

This shit is spreading ....

Apparently, the baby from Nirvana's Nevermind album cover is sueing the band for misuse of an image without permission () and child pornography  . After 30 plus years.

So think yourself lucky @Denimseeker

 

Ha...well publishing a personal likeness for commercial purposes (cover art for an album or a magazine generally counts - as the image functions as the advertisement for the work) without a release is an entirely different situation. Lawsuits for that stuff happen all the time. I can see how that person might have legal standing. I still cannot fathom legal standing with CSF. 

[roomtemplacroix]

9 hours ago, Broark said:

If you manage to find a way to get a pair let me know, I've been trying to get him to sell internationally for months now.

Has anyone thought about making a Bridge of The Times thread? I also cannot get him to sell me a pair of jeans.

[Broark]

7 minutes ago, roomtemplacroix said:

Has anyone thought about making a Bridge of The Times thread? I also cannot get him to sell me a pair of jeans.

I’d be happy to do that, I made a few posts awhile ago in the unknown jeans thread. Give me some time.
I also might have a way to get a pair, but I’ve got to work on it. 

[Denimseeker]

Doc directed me here and I really appreciate the support and understanding from the community. I also think it will be a good idea to further explain the whole situation here so that you can make a good judgement. The ebook itself is a free, educational purpose only, half-public-half-private (due to pre-ordering, I only share to those who give me a heads up, I have no responsibility if you leak the sharing link to others, and btw Mr Konata is not one of my book recipients) pdf file with all the matters I have researched put inside. I value primary evidence a lot so I tend to put original documents and photos into the book as hard as possible (with every single item being quoted) to support my theories and illustrations. That being said, I have exposed myself to the risk of being sued due to copyright issues. This is one of the reasons why the book is released in such a manner. Of course, Mr Konata, or other owners of the related materials, have every right to take legal action if they still think it is a copyright violation. I respect his decision despite the frustration.

The attachment is the email I have received from Mr. Konata on 23 August, his email address and the items involved are being masked.

From the attachment, you can tell there are 6 items being claimed by Mr Konata. One of the items is a screen capture from the "One Piece of Rock" website, a page related to how the brand identifies and describes Levi's denim texture during WW2. I have explained this in my IG stories. You may check it out.

For the rest, since I cannot disclose what items are involved, I can only tell you what information would be lost if I simply delete the items from the ebook.

1. Evidence to support pocket flap was added to 506XX in the mid-1920s.

2. Evidence to support during the beginning of WW2, garment design restriction order L-181 (button number/pocket flap removal) was in effect before order MPR-208 (Adding "S" to garment lot. number).

3. Evidence to support approaches to the end of WW2, garment design restriction order L-181 was abolished before order MPR-208.

4. Evidence to support jacron paper patch was used together with the leather patch for 506XX.

5. Evidence to show the existence of 506XXE and its iconic T-back construction.

Among these 5 items, 14 photos are involved:

4 of them were extracted from a blog of a vintage clothing store in Japan.

8 of them were extracted from a USA auction house website.

2 of them were extracted from the forum "Denimbro", they were uploaded by a member I respect very much. I see him as my teacher in the Levi's research hobby.

None of the pictures has a watermark nor a copyright claim from a particular person/photo taker.

Considering the historical information involved in these 5 items, only items 4 & 5 can be replaced by other materials to tell the same story from my understanding.

I also see there are a lot of people struggling on whether they should continue to wear their CSF jeans. Despite the frustration and disappointment, I still think you should wear them as long as you feel comfortable. After all, they are still very nice jeans sewed by an experienced, passionate Japanese guy. Wearing a pair of CSF jeans in your wardrobe should not be viewed as a particular opinion or standpoint. Just my five cents.

 

Edited August 26, 2021 by Denimseeker

[dudewuttheheck]

I'm thinking about selling mine still... can't decide right now. Will probably not wear them for a little bit until I make the decision. Some of me is thinking that they're just jeans, but part of me also knows this will be in the back of my head when I wear them. At this point, I think I've won the bad timing awards having waited this long just for this to happen... and for my tab to be missing. Even if he was legally in the right (and I don't think he is) it would still be a dick move and to me, that's the worst part. It's just so incredibly selfish. 

Anyway. Here are some fit photos of the size 34 46 pair while I make my decision.