Denime

[yung_flynn]

I agree with a lot of the above. I like Warehouse so I should like some of the Denime stuff in theory. I did like the original releases under the WH umbrella, but the new 220A banner denim releases don’t really appeal to me. I can’t really keep track of all the different iterations and in my opinion they essentially put a Denime patch and hardware onto the existing WH 1001xx models. The use of Banner Denim is a little strange to me too since it fully blurs the line between the too. I have a newer 232 jacket as well that I really like but that I would guess was a WH product if I did not see the tag. 
 

I would not say that Warehouse ruined Denime since they did help save them from disappearing completely, but they don’t really appeal to me at the moment. It’s telling to me that I’d rather wear my pair of Kyotos (which aren’t really my preferred cut) than to grab one of the new Banner denim releases. 

[Alec Leamas]

2 hours ago, beautiful_FrEaK said:

The grace of late birth 😅😉

Quite so! 😂

1 hour ago, Mtvare said:

Which makes total sense, but also kind of reinforces a point I was trying to make - isn't Denime just an extension of Warehouse now? (And I don't think that was inevitable - they could have taken over the brand without assimilating it so thoroughly to their own. Seems a shame to me.)

Yes I see what you mean, it has been swallowed up and I am aware the reason I probably like the new Denime so much is because it is literally just Warehouse.

[indigoeagle]

After all all the repro brans base their jeans on the Levi's XX.
Like Jelado with the Last Resort research cut up a pair of XX jeans and analyzed them to get as close to the original as possible.
So Warehouse did that with the banner.

Is the Denime banner denim the same "formula" just with the brown weft?

Did Levi's also sometimes use a white and sometimes a brown weft? Or where does this brown weft come from?
I think UES in their WWII also use brown weft (probably other brands do, too).

So with the denim they all want to get as close to the original as possible. We have seen the pics from TCB.
And with the cuts it is the same, no? Perhaps that is where there the bigger differences are.

[willi]

8 hours ago, beautiful_FrEaK said:

I was thinking about this for some time now.
Especially after fading my Denime 220 and seeing so many examples of Warehouse jeans which have strong fades after a short time: do they design it like this so people are satisfied quicker and can start a new pair earlier? Or do they just save indigo and dye less to save money (in the current economic sitaution in Japan)?
Also my Sugar Cane SC 1946 fade rather quick. Or I just got better at wearing jeans...

This is interesting. XX denim for the new 220s were my first Denimes. After wearing for 1 month it looked like I had been wearing for 4-5 months, not what I was looking for and I sold the jeans. Unlikely I would try the label again.

[aho]

14 hours ago, beautiful_FrEaK said:

I was thinking about this for some time now.
Especially after fading my Denime 220 and seeing so many examples of Warehouse jeans which have strong fades after a short time: do they design it like this so people are satisfied quicker and can start a new pair earlier? Or do they just save indigo and dye less to save money (in the current economic sitaution in Japan)?
Also my Sugar Cane SC 1946 fade rather quick. Or I just got better at wearing jeans...

Where can I buy this fast fading denim, and will I have enough time before the WOM contest begins? 😂

Regarding fast fading pairs, it's been a number of years since I've worn WH (I don't remember my OG's fading that fast), and I haven't tried this new Denime yet either, but lets be honest, these are businesses (WH being probably, if not THE biggest of the repro groups) and it behooves them to churn out products and get people to buy more. I think I'm okay with this when the right balance is struck, though I can also appreciate hard wearing jeans that don't fade fast either (my Ooe's seeming particularly stubborn of late)

[reallypeacedoff]

From what I have seen on the IIY4, the 1001XX are insanely fast faders. People's 3-month updates were better than my 1.5-year everyday wear denims. I'm pretty hard on jeans, and I have no idea how they fade them this fast. Is it a good thing? I don't know; I feel like a balance is good. I have Nudie and SDA, and they are relatively slow faders, but my TFH and Denime seem pretty quick in comparison.

Is it how many dips in indigo that prove how steadfast they are, or are there other factors as well? The science behind it is fascinating, but I fear some companies want to be known as super-fast faders; it probably brings in sales. People generally want to see results quickly.

How fast they fade isn't necessarily reflective of a brand's quality. After a year or year and a half, putting them on a shelf doesn't show how sturdy they are. I'd imagine some brands capitalize on this. I'm not saying Denime, but that's an interesting take. I personally love my 220A Offset XX.

[Alec Leamas]

Anyhow, here are the 220XX-47’s, about 2 months in.

Suppose this is very topical given the discussion about fast fading! They are starting to look a lot like the Warehouse banner denim 🫠

[Alec Leamas]

+ that’s a Denime raglan sleeve hoodie too! Unplanned believe it or not.

[willi]

colors are great on that sweat line, really like those.

[beautiful_FrEaK]

On 10/2/2024 at 5:47 PM, indigoeagle said:

After all all the repro brans base their jeans on the Levi's XX.
Like Jelado with the Last Resort research cut up a pair of XX jeans and analyzed them to get as close to the original as possible.
So Warehouse did that with the banner.

Is the Denime banner denim the same "formula" just with the brown weft?

Did Levi's also sometimes use a white and sometimes a brown weft? Or where does this brown weft come from?
I think UES in their WWII also use brown weft (probably other brands do, too).

So with the denim they all want to get as close to the original as possible. We have seen the pics from TCB.
And with the cuts it is the same, no? Perhaps that is where there the bigger differences are.

That's how I understood it. They gave the same banner to Kurabo and they examined it based on this added 10% brown(ish) cotton to the yarns. On Instagram they have some posts talkoing about it.
Basically that the cotton was less clean back in the days.

You are right, there are more brands featuring a brownish weft. Or rather natural/unbleached weft. UES is one of them.

I think what play a bigger role is on which actual model they base their whole procution line on? How many example pairs did they study? In which condition was the sample pair. A good (or rather bad) example is the TCB 40s. The sample pair was one worn down pair in size 28 (or smaller?!) and they based the whole pattern of the run on this sample.
The counter example would be FW which uses several pairs of different sizes to create a pattern. Something I heard from @Duke Mantee and Seiichiro.
And it is very likely that fits are still tweaked so they will fit the targeted customer base better.

[Alec Leamas]

10 hours ago, willi said:

colors are great on that sweat line, really like those.

They are really nice! Chose the red as I like how red sweats fade, leaving the stitching still a more vivid red while the jersey washes out.

[indigoeagle]

1 hour ago, beautiful_FrEaK said:

That's how I understood it. They gave the same banner to Kurabo and they examined it based on this added 10% brown(ish) cotton to the yarns. On Instagram they have some posts talkoing about it.
Basically that the cotton was less clean back in the days.

You are right, there are more brands featuring a brownish weft. Or rather natural/unbleached weft. UES is one of them.

I think what play a bigger role is on which actual model they base their whole procution line on? How many example pairs did they study? In which condition was the sample pair. A good (or rather bad) example is the TCB 40s. The sample pair was one worn down pair in size 28 (or smaller?!) and they based the whole pattern of the run on this sample.
The counter example would be FW which uses several pairs of different sizes to create a pattern. Something I heard from @Duke Mantee and Seiichiro.
And it is very likely that fits are still tweaked so they will fit the targeted customer base better.

Very interesting.
Good point with the models in different sizes.

So in a way it makes sense, since Hayashi then started out to make a pair of jeans with vintage like denim. And Kurabo apparently was the first to do so for him. So with the banner denim being vintage denim fabric (but of the some specific period, 20/30?) one could argue, that it's the same objective.
But I had also read, that Hayashi had not wanted to create a full replica but rather vintage like denim with a modern twist (though for Denime then probably not as much as with Resolute now).
So since WH is mostly focussing on repros one might have expected them to basically copy the original Denime jeans models of the first generation. With Kurabo as the then denim producer still active, it should have been easy to reproduce the specific Denime denim of that time.

Perhaps WH's idea here was to offer Denime jeans with a WH twist. For their WH fans.

It would be cool, if WH could answer some questions like that. Do they have a kind of spokes person?
Perhaps the Japanalogue guy can set up an interview. Not sure, if there has been one with WH.
 

[frank]

The 232XX-54 jacket still looks interesting, might pick it up depending on the measurements when it drops. But browner weft banner denim seems right up my alley since who knows when Warehouse is gonna restock their 2002XX in banner.

[yung_flynn]

12 hours ago, frank said:

The 232XX-54 jacket still looks interesting, might pick it up depending on the measurements when it drops. But browner weft banner denim seems right up my alley since who knows when Warehouse is gonna restock their 2002XX in banner.

I have the standard 232 from last year and  like it. I also figured that I’d rather have the 232 than wait indefinitely for the 2002xx to be restocked in my size. Measurements were identical to 2002xx and even the denim feels like Warehouse

[aho]

So is the consensus that all of the newer Denime fabrics break in/fade fast? Found a 220A in my size but also interested in the 220XX-54 but want something fast 😂

[MJF9]

^ my experience Aho of just a little wear is the 220As can fade fast... sure that those with more wear will chime in with proof positive

[vIGGiou riou]

220A are really fast faders...

Till now, I wore them in Indigo Invitational Contest little more than 190 days from 9 months and 6 days of contest duration. And not so hard. Summer I spent in shorts. But result is ...

EDIT : Including 5 washes

Edited October 6 by vIGGiou riou

[julian-wolf]

On 10/4/2024 at 1:13 AM, beautiful_FrEaK said:

A good (or rather bad) example is the TCB 40s. The sample pair was one worn down pair in size 28 (or smaller?!) and they based the whole pattern of the run on this sample.

My favorite (least favorite) example of this sort of thing is the logwood-dyed waist overalls from TCB / Viktor's Voice. The example that they were working from was heavily faded to a light brown, so they went through months of R&D to figure out how best to reproduce this light brown color using logwood dye. Meanwhile, the other example they were working from was standard denim heavily faded to a light blue. Did they dye the yarns for their reproduction light blue? No, of course not—they did the sensible thing and dyed them dark blue, with the hope & expectation that, if worn similarly to the originals, they would end up looking similar. This is what every repro company does for every indigo pair of jeans, and it never made any sense to me why they took such a different approach for the brown pair, just on the basis of that being the current color of the one example that they had access to.

[nick682]

5 hours ago, aho said:

So is the consensus that all of the newer Denime fabrics break in/fade fast? Found a 220A in my size but also interested in the 220XX-54 but want something fast 😂

The 220A fades crazy fast. My experience with the new xx banner denim is limited, but it doesn't seem to fade as fast as the 220A. 

[aho]

Thanks for the feedback everyone! May be picking up a pair of 220A soon 😂

[reallypeacedoff]

There's something about the 220A; it's really nice denim(e)!

[josh mullen]

Received my 220A, size 34, late last week…and I want to love them. Ran ‘em through a cold wash and, as expected, saw very little movement on the front rise (the waist and thighs shrunk adequately.) So, I washed them again in warm water with full agitation. After allowing them to dry fully, I hot-washed them with heavy agitation. The front rise is stuck at 12.75”. Oh well. Maybe I’ll use my dryer after the next wash and see if that does the trick. I sorta don’t want the waist or thighs to shrink any further, though. 
 

Raw/Post-Hot Wash

Waist: 36.0”/34.5”

Front Rise: 13.0”/12.75”

Thigh: 13.0”/12.25”

 

Edited October 7 by josh mullen

[vIGGiou riou]

some fade detail of my 220A after 192 days of wear and 5 washes (now fresh one)

[reallypeacedoff]

44 minutes ago, josh mullen said:

Received my 220A, size 34, late last week…

Raw/Post-Hot Wash

Waist: 36.0”/34.5”

Front Rise: 13.0”/12.75”

Thigh: 13.0”/12.25”

Are we talking about the 220A XX or the other newly released variation? If it's the former, I got the size 36, and two warm washes and a hang dry yielded:

• 37.50, 13.50, 17.50, 13.25, 10.25, 9.25, 34.50 (pre-soak)
• 35.25, 12.50, 16.75, 12.75, 9.75, 8.75, 32.50 (post-soak)

 

Those look so good @vIGGiou riou!

[vIGGiou riou]

2 minutes ago, reallypeacedoff said:

Those look so good @vIGGiou riou!

Thx ....

[Hendsch]

Hey all, I just found the Denime XX World Tour Jeans in my stack. Sadly it was after my wife decided to wash and dry them and turn the label into a bacon strip . Been wondering for awhile who's these are, and if they want them back? I've had them for about 7 years now (after @chicote sent them to me) and the rise/thigh is to small for my liking these days... Happy to hold on to them for when my son can wear them, but also would be more than happy to send them back to whoever owned them in the first place.

[josh mullen]

1 hour ago, reallypeacedoff said:

Are we talking about the 220A XX or the other newly released variation? If it's the former, I got the size 36, and two warm washes and a hang dry yielded:

• 37.50, 13.50, 17.50, 13.25, 10.25, 9.25, 34.50 (pre-soak)
• 35.25, 12.50, 16.75, 12.75, 9.75, 8.75, 32.50 (post-soak)

 

Those look so good @vIGGiou riou!

They’re the 220A XX. Are the new variations the 54 and 47 models? I don’t keep up with Denime’s offerings, though perhaps I should. 

[beautiful_FrEaK]

1 hour ago, Hendsch said:

Hey all, I just found the Denime XX World Tour Jeans in my stack. Sadly it was after my wife decided to wash and dry them and turn the label into a bacon strip . Been wondering for awhile who's these are, and if they want them back? I've had them for about 7 years now (after @chicote sent them to me) and the rise/thigh is to small for my liking these days... Happy to hold on to them for when my son can wear them, but also would be more than happy to send them back to whoever owned them in the first place.

I think the pair belongs originally to @Flash

[beautiful_FrEaK]

Denime 10th anniversary in a good size (not so good price).

https://www.fromjapan.co.jp/japan/en/auction/yahoo/input/1156123203/

The batch number is nice though  

[Flash]

@Hendsch hold on to them , or maybe see if you can get some interest in a second round ? Your decision mate