Urban Techwear

[po_boy_fuuma_hatesbargerz]

I'm not really offended and Zero History is fantastic but I just want to double check that you know which thread you're posting in.

 

 

Here's the excerpt from the book, and I feel it applies to Urban Techwear as a whole, regardless how much you deny it.

 

Our best analyst thinks it’s not a tactical design. Something for mall ninjas.â€

“For what?â€

“The new Mitty demographic.â€

“I’m lost.â€

“Young men who dress to feel they’ll be mistaken for having spe­cial capability. A species of cosplay, really. Endemic. Lots of boys are playing soldier now. The men who run the world aren’t, and neither are the boys most effectively bent on running it next. Or the ones who’re actually having to be soldiers, of course. But many of the rest have gone gear-queer, to one extent or another.â€

“ ‘Gear-queer’?â€

Bigend’s teeth showed. “We had a team of cultural anthropologists interview American soldiers returning from Iraq. That’s where we first heard it. It’s not wholly derogatory, mind you. There are actual professionals who genuinely require these things—some of them, anyway. Though they generally seem to be far less fascinated with them. But it’s that fascination that interests us, of course.â€

“It is?â€

“It’s an obsession with the idea not just of the right stuff, but of the special stuff. Equipment fetishism. The costume and semiotics of achingly elite police and military units. Intense desire to possess same, of course, and in turn to be associated with that world. With its competence, its cocksure exclusivity.â€

“Sounds like fashion, to me.â€

“Exactly. Pants, but only just the right ones. We could never have engineered so powerful a locus of consumer desire. It’s like sex in a bottle.â€

“Not for me.â€

“You’re female.â€

“They want to be soldiers?â€

“Not to be. To self-identify as. However secretly. To imagine they may be mistaken for, or at least associated with. Virtually none of these products will ever be used for anything remotely like what they were designed for. Of course that’s true of most of the contents of your traditional army-navy store. Whole universes of wistful male fantasy in those places. But the level of consumer motivation we’re seeing, the fact that these are often what amount to luxury goods, and priced accordingly. That’s new. I felt like a neurosurgeon, when this was brought to my attention, discovering a patient whose ner­ vous system is congenitally and fully exposed. It’s just so nakedly obvious. Fantastic, really.â€

“And it ties into military contracting?â€

“Deeply, though not simply. A lot of the same players, where the stuff actually originates. But your civilian buyer, your twenty-first­ century Walter Mitty, needs it the way a mod, in this street, in 1965, needed the right depth of vent on a suitcoat.â€

“It sounds ridiculous to me.â€

“Almost exclusively a boy thing.â€

“Almost,†she agreed, remembering Heidi’s IDF bra.

 

(Sorry mods, hope this is okay to post this much of an excerpt)

 

 

I fail to see how that doesn't wholly apply to our pursuit of 'just the right pant', (see the last three pages on Acronym P10 discussion).  And I'm guilty of this too, but the money and effort we expend in obtaining and purchasing these garments can definitely be called by most people equipment fetishism. 

Edited March 7, 2014 by Just Another XY

[SuE]

Here's the excerpt from the book, and I feel it applies to Urban Techwear as a whole, regardless how much you deny it.

 

(Sorry mods, hope this is okay to post this much of an excerpt)

 

Young men who dress to feel they’ll be mistaken for having spe­cial capability.

 

They want to be soldiers?â€

“Not to be. To self-identify as. However secretly. To imagine they may be mistaken for, or at least associated with. Virtually none of these products will ever be used for anything remotely like what they were designed for.

 

your civilian buyer, your twenty-first­ century Walter Mitty, needs it the way a mod, in this street, in 1965, needed the right depth of vent on a suitcoat.

 

 I fail to see how that doesn't wholly apply to our pursuit of 'just the right pant', (see the last three pages on Acronym P10 discussion).  And I'm guilty of this too, but the money and effort we expend in obtaining and purchasing these garments can definitely be called by most people equipment fetishism.

 

There's some element of that here (the TAD and Arc'teryx LEAF fans) but you can't tar all of us with the same brush. Acronym, Veilance, Outlier etc, are designed for an urban environment. People do use it for riding their bikes to work, for staying dry when it's raining, for keeping warm when it's snowing. Forcelocke, Interops, gravitypockets, jacketslings etc are all useful to urban folk (well except gravity pockets, that's just for showing off ).

 

More to the point, who is going to mistake anyone wearing these clothing for having 'special capabality'? Veilance and Outlier in particular have no visibile branding and are designed for blending into enviroments. Yet the garments last longer and endure. They are good value for money. I wouldn't classigy them as luxury goods.

[shoreman]

Ugh…I guess I shouldn't be surprised that I find it still reads like it's written with strict academic purpose. 

 

So, to get down to the bottom of this in the simplest of terms: If I enjoy gear that has a pleasant mix of aesthetic/performance and durability--just so happens to be military inspired, to some degree--but have zero personal interest in delving into the theoretical, historical and or societal influences behind its--the piece or gear in question-- origin, am I essentially debased into said "mall ninja" category by those who actively discuss such things?  

Edited March 7, 2014 by TresUnCool

[Dressed Down]

Thanks for posting that XY. 

 

SuE, I don't think XY was saying everyone's a Mall Ninja, it's that we've all gone beyond the basic value proposition that technical clothing provides.  People do that in a lot of ways.  The littlest way is to say "this garment functions perfectly for my needs, but I don't like how it looks."  The bigger ways are fetishistizing the one perfect/holy grail garment, becoming a Techninja/Mall Ninja/Tacticool because you prioritized aesthetics, obsessing over superfluous "functions," etc.  By an inch or a mile, we're all over the line.  So you guys actually agree, he was just pointing the essential fact out, while you're justifying it.

 

TreUnCool, I asked around.  We all agreed, no one is a mall ninja.  Except you.

[Igneousity]

Thanks for posting that XY. 

 

SuE, I don't think XY was saying everyone's a Mall Ninja, it's that we've all gone beyond the basic value proposition that technical clothing provides.  People do that in a lot of ways.  The littlest way is to say "this garment functions perfectly for my needs, but I don't like how it looks."  The bigger ways are fetishistizing the one perfect/holy grail garment, becoming a Techninja/Mall Ninja/Tacticool because you prioritized aesthetics, obsessing over superfluous "functions," etc.  By an inch or a mile, we're all over the line.  So you guys actually agree, he was just pointing the essential fact out, while you're justifying it.

 

TreUnCool, I asked around.  We all agreed, no one is a mall ninja.  Except you.

 

Yeah, like the ultimate functionality arguments on the last page rang a little hollow to me. If it's a fashion thing, admit it's a fashion thing. Jeeze.

[caid]

And still no one has registered crotchgusset.com.

[shoreman]

 

 

TreUnCool, I asked around.  We all agreed, no one is a mall ninja.  Except you.

 

Samurai Pizza Caaaaaaaaaaaaaats.

[Igneousity]

Sometimes I just want to be the most fashionable guy in the caldera, is that a crime?

[po_boy_fuuma_hatesbargerz]

Ugh…I guess I shouldn't be surprised that I find it still reads like it's written with strict academic purpose. 

 

So, to get down to the bottom of this in the simplest of terms: If I enjoy gear that has a pleasant mix of aesthetic/performance and durability--just so happens to be military inspired, to some degree--but have zero personal interest in delving into the theoretical, historical and or societal influences behind its--the piece or gear in question-- origin, am I essentially debased into said "mall ninja" category by those who actively discuss such things?  

 

I think I came off too harsh, while we have some systems homology to the mall ninjas, I'd like to imagine we're probably more interested/appreciate the technical ingenuity of the garments and can pay the price for appreciation.  More like historians/collectors of Japanese antiques/ceramics than people who buy samurai swords for self-defense, for lack of a better comparison.

[shoreman]

Na, it's all good. (Makes for a good read during work breaks.)

 

Truthfully, this whole debate is far beyond any thought I've directed towards the subject. As such, I wholly embrace the label. 

[firstdoorontheleft]

[Igneousity]

I think I came off too harsh, while we have some systems homology to the mall ninjas, I'd like to imagine we're probably more interested/appreciate the technical ingenuity of the garments and can pay the price for appreciation.

Otherwise known a "mall ninjas". It's a derogatory term that pretty much explicitly exists to address people who dress like we here in this thread do. Do you really think there's a whole bunch of people going around blacked out in Veilance and Acronym who don't think about the technical aspect of the garment, and not only that but that most people care enough to distinguish two people who dress relatively the same by a unique derogatory term that refers only to the people who don't sperg out about the technical details of the fabric?

We're all mall ninjas here. Just roll with it. Every sense of fashion has a derogatory way of referring to it by those who don't like it. Just because I think a lot of current 20-something's men's fashion takes its inspiration from heroin addicts and yacht club members doesn't mean that they should start writin paragraphs about how that's not technically referring to them. If everyone liked it it wouldn't be fashion.

Edited March 7, 2014 by Igneousity

[SuE]

The only way to settle this is to go back to the source. Ask William Gibson if an Acronym wardrobe makes him (or, more politely, us) a mall ninja or gear queer .

 

Besides, Fashion is foolish. Death to Clothing. Nudist Beach FTW

 

[po_boy_fuuma_hatesbargerz]

Back to techwear: 

 

Rapha Lightweight backpack: Has integrated waterproof shell and has reflective fabric for night-riding.  

http://www.rapha.cc/us/en/shop/rapha-backpack/product/BPK01

[cmdR]

The only way to settle this is to go back to the source. Ask William Gibson if an Acronym wardrobe makes him (or, more politely, us) a mall ninja or gear queer .

Neither. Acronym is techninj.

Props to whoever came up with that label here on Sufu.

[Igneousity]

Yes, mall ninja is in no way related to techninja. Obviously.

[shifty]

I'm doing my best to follow the whole 'are we mall ninjas?' discussion, but my basic takeaway is that in some sense, we are. But I also think that as far as the military influence goes, the military designed the clothing that way because it was practical for what they needed, and a lot of those things carry over for the rest of us (civilians or whatever). Even though we arent carrying around all the same gear that someone in the military might use. Its probably a big 'duh' moment about the fact that it's practical for us, but I feel like thats the biggest difference between a techninja and a mall ninja, we are more or less using the gear for exactly what it's designed for, and a mall ninja almost never gets to/wants to do that.

[Nebulae]

Besides, Fashion is foolish. Death to Clothing. Nudist Beach FTW

W2C D.T. Robo?

[firstdoorontheleft]

According to google this is a tech ninja

 

...and this handsome fellow is a mall ninja, and apparently a member of nudist beach.

[cmdR]

Yes, mall ninja is in no way related to techninja. Obviously.

 

Other than that they both use the word ninja, not really.

Mall Ninja is mil spec cosplay.

The Mall Ninja Primer (Lonely Machines)

Techninj is a fashion subculture, a play on Goth Ninja, similar penchant for black but way more technical and sportswear-oriented. 

Edited March 7, 2014 by cmdR

[Igneousity]

The Mall Ninja Primer (Lonely Machines)

This makes me laugh and want to kill myself at the same time holy shit.

[TEKsevenZERO]

I tried to follow along, but all I walked away with is call yourself whatever you want and others will call you whatever they want.

 

In more important news... I missed the L in this . Someone swoop on the Med. BLARGH

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/STONE-ISLAND-SHADOW-PROJECT-MODULAR-INSULATOR-BOMBER-JACKET-SIZES-S-L-RRP-550-/121232668194?pt=UK_Men_s_Coats_Jackets&var=&hash=item1c3a07b622

I was looking at that wishing I was about 14 years old again to fit into it !!!

 

some please do grab the bargain.

[Inkinsurgent]

I thought mall ninja's were fat guys wearing 511 khakis and maxpedition backpacks and vertx ballcaps full of velcro and "infidel" patches.

If you're going to point at military influence in fashion its gonna be impossible to draw a line between what carries an overt military association and what doesn't. To me even pinrolled baggy pants with high top sneakers bring to mind the silhouette of bloused pants and combat boots. Nearly all accepted menswear staples have a military background.

It seems to me that there's a line to be drawn between actively dressing up and incorporating elements of a certain aesthetic. Most wtaps pieces are more inherently militaristic than tad gear and 5.11 combined, but it's the intent that matters.

[TEKsevenZERO]

If shit looks good I'll wear it be it a mil spec kevlar carbon nano nearfileld pair of knickers or assym cut monobloc all conditions toupee.

 

No point in panic wanking over silly names for clothing-style really, in my humblest opinion of course !

Edited March 8, 2014 by TEKsevenZERO

[TEKsevenZERO]

I really like the new Roshe iteration GPX Geometric, may be a little tired to some but that pattern is very appealing.

 

[aso2004]

On the mallninja discussion..

I came into these kind of clothes as a outdoor person wanting something a bit less flashy and bulky as my regular outdoor gear. Something more refined that I could wear to work everyday without looking to climb everest or snowboard off piste.

But still get a high degree of functionalism disguised into it.The more military stuff (TAD,Mission Workshop,some degree Acronym) doesn't appeal to me at all, I am going for the more sporty stuff.

I rarely go out dressed all tech ( except when it pours) so I never look like some of the guys WAYWT pics

And although I get the Walter Mitty discussion, I am just difficult in all areas of clothing. and beyond( snow/surfboards, cars,food etc)

[Igneousity]

Can anyone recommend a good pair of light shoes? I really wish I'd grabbed those Flyknit Trainers when they were back in stock, but I missed the chance to and I don't want to pay the retarded sneakerhead tax on ebay.

[Nebulae]

^inneva woven

[aso2004]

The inneva are a breed of their own.Absolutely hated them,mates swears by em..

If you got a wide last ..size up but then you might slip out of the low back..

 

Nike has some pretty good shoes on ID and the flyknit  lunar 2 that might work..

[firstdoorontheleft]

Can anyone recommend a good pair of light shoes? I really wish I'd grabbed those Flyknit Trainers when they were back in stock, but I missed the chance to and I don't want to pay the retarded sneakerhead tax on ebay.

I'm in DC today and tried on the flyknit racers and instantly copped. Paid full blown retail too. Would recommend.