Levi's Vintage Clothing

[The Clerk]

No, true to size and they're actually a little loose on him. It was the fit of these on him that made me go for a 30 rather than 32 on my 1901's. He just wore em hard

[Charlie Delta]

Gorgeous!!!

[blm14]

that button fly atari is nutsoid

[Alleyne]

Cultizm contest has started! So it's time to post some fit pics of my 1947 555 Valencia!

Before the pics here are the measurements for those interested!

Tag size is 30x38 (I'm 5'8'')

Pre-soak:

Waist: 29.25''

Leg opening: 8.25''

Inseam: 37"

Knee: 8.75''

Rise: 11"

Back rise: 15.5"

Post-soak (one hour'ish hottest tub water, hanged then worn till dry when still damp but not dripping):

Waist: 28''

Leg opening: 8''

Inseam: 34"

Knee: 8.5''

Rise: 10"

Back rise: 13.5"

Fit Pics Post-soak:

Love the fit of these jeans, a little diaper butt IRL but that's fine.

Quite a different fit and roomier feel than my other jeans in rotation now (PBJ 007 w28, Dukes w29[could have done 28] both skin tight at first but 1" looser everywhere now), as the 47' i can pinch around 1'' anywhere post soak.

At first I thought ordering 38" would be too long and need a hem but I guess it turned out great.

Now all i need is a pair of boots to match them (maybe a belt too!).

Comments?

P.S.

And if anyones interested in the pre-soak fit picks, its at the very bottom of page 588 or here: http://www.superfuture.com/supertalk/showthread.php?p=2040056#post2040056

[jstavrin]

Perfect fit.

[NefariousRecluse]

^seconded. hope mine turns out like that.

[deleted20333]

what are some ways to tell if a pair of lvc or saddlemans are legit or not?

[erk]

what are some ways to tell if a pair of lvc or saddlemans are legit or not?

forget about the saddlemans and get these instead!

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=160383384411

[partytaco]

initially i thought the disappearance of the selvedge coin pocket coincided with the short lived offset rear belt loop and "every garment guarenteed" paper patch of the mid 50's and very early 60's and reappeared when the belt loop meet was centered again and the patch lost the "every garment..." but recently I found a pair with the leather patch, centered belt loop, pre1950 extended outseam stitch, without selvedge in the coin pocket. Maybe a factory blunder???

HH

Not necessarily, as I have had two pairs of early sixties big E 501xx, one pair with hidden rivets, one pair without, but both with no selvedge in the coin pocket.

My Lvc 551zxx have no selvedge in the coin pocket too.

All the info I have points to late fifties, but I'm open to debate !

.

[Dr_Heech]

initially i thought the disappearance of the selvedge coin pocket coincided with the short lived offset rear belt loop and "every garment guarenteed" paper patch of the mid 50's and very early 60's and reappeared when the belt loop meet was centered again and the patch lost the "every garment..." but recently I found a pair with the leather patch, centered belt loop, pre1950 extended outseam stitch, without selvedge in the coin pocket. Maybe a factory blunder???

In my experience, it's very difficult to 'nail down' certain aspects of original levis, for there are many 'cross-overs' (probably due to the many factories making Levis back then).

The off-set belt-loop, for example appears on models made directly after the war too, but documentation only points to the later part of the 1950's-early '60's.

Coincidently, my favorite vintage levis were from that time frame ('57-'64), with those details (Lots of yellow stitching, offset belt-loop, selvedge in coin pocket, disappearance of hidden rivets.. etc)

IMHO, the disappearance of the 'Guarantee' on the two horse card patch, marks the end to true vintage 501's.

.

[Reggie Died]

My 37's just dried up.

Waist went from 34.5 to 32, and inseam went from 34 to 31.5.

Should I re-soak them before getting them hemmed, or do you guys reckon that's enough? It was an hour hot soak.

[dr.house]

What's your regular length? I wouldn't hem them personally, they'll shrink more due to more wet to dry cycles. 31.5 isn't that long, cuff 'em and you'll be fine, eh?

[Paul T]

initially i thought the disappearance of the selvedge coin pocket coincided with the short lived offset rear belt loop and "every garment guarenteed" paper patch of the mid 50's and very early 60's and reappeared when the belt loop meet was centered again and the patch lost the "every garment..." but recently I found a pair with the leather patch, centered belt loop, pre1950 extended outseam stitch, without selvedge in the coin pocket. Maybe a factory blunder???

I agree with the Dr; one of my key sources of information was an ex Levi's guy who'd been right through the system, has a great vintage collection including deadstock 50s, who was involved in the background of LVC and trained all the early salesmen.

We talked a lot about offset belt loops and the lemon stitching; he is convinced the output of LS&Co factories varied, and that at least one factory continued with the centered belt loop; and that the stitching varied across the factories. It could well be that the demise (and reappearance) of the pocket selvage likewise varied between factories.

My 37's just dried up.

Waist went from 34.5 to 32, and inseam went from 34 to 31.5.

Should I re-soak them before getting them hemmed, or do you guys reckon that's enough? It was an hour hot soak.

Personally, I wouldn't hem, I would cuff. And if you're going to get a chainstitched hem, I honestly think it's better to do so before the first soak - otherwise the fabric won't move, and you won't get the roping, which is a big part of the original look. In fact, I had my non-chainstitched 'first blue jeans' hemmed after I soaked, and that looked wrong too.

[entertainment!]

Just started wearing the pair of 1954 501z that I bought for the contest. I got them because they were the only ones between 1915 and 1966 that were available in my size that I didn't have in rotation already. I thought they would be like a 1955 but with a zipper, but they are more like a modern skinny jean from the knee down (APC New Cure) mated with a vintage levi's fit from the crotch up. If that sounds strange, it sure is. Luckily I have skinny legs, so they fit me quite well. But I don't feel like I am wearing a vintage jean.

They also have very skinny belt loops (1/2" width) like 1960s models that seem inauthentic to me.

[airfrogusmc]

I wouldn't touch the length until they've got full shrinkage which seriously is around 10 wet to dry cycles. Just cuff'm.

Also its a WATCH pocket not a coin pocket.

The 55s have skinnier belt loops than the earlier models. I've seen'm skinny on originals and the off set belt loop, Paul, didn't you say that you thought that was a trait from one particular factory?

[entertainment!]

Personally, I wouldn't hem, I would cuff. And if you're going to get a chainstitched hem, I honestly think it's better to do so before the first soak - otherwise the fabric won't move, and you won't get the roping, which is a big part of the original look. In fact, I had my non-chainstitched 'first blue jeans' hemmed after I soaked, and that looked wrong too.

I completely agree with your advice Paul T. I did have a different experience with my Oldest Oldest than you did with your 'first blue jeans' though. I rehemmed my Oldest Oldest after two soaks. I still have the cut off hem and don't see much difference between the new hem and the old hem. It's probably because this fabric (2008) doesn't seem to shrink at all. There is no roping, just what I would call faceting when the multiple layers bend, i.e. the fold are vertical, not sloped. But I definitely wouldn't have hemmed them if I had got any roping first.

The 55s have skinnier belt loops than the earlier models. I've seen'm skinny on originals and the off set belt loop, Paul, didn't you say that you thought that was a trait from one particular factory?

Thanks, Airfrog. I looked on Marvins to check out vintage models. There was one 501z that I thought might have had skinnier belt loops, but I couldn't really be sure from the pictures. The ones in the Lynn Downey 501 book look like they are the wider 5/8" ones.

[cultpop 0217]

Cultizm contest has started! So it's time to post some fit pics of my 1947 555 Valencia!

Before the pics here are the measurements for those interested!

Tag size is 30x38 (I'm 5'8'')

Pre-soak:

Waist: 29.25''

Leg opening: 8.25''

Inseam: 37"

Knee: 8.75''

Rise: 11"

Back rise: 15.5"

Post-soak (one hour'ish hottest tub water, hanged then worn till dry when still damp but not dripping):

Waist: 28''

Leg opening: 8''

Inseam: 34"

Knee: 8.5''

Rise: 10"

Back rise: 13.5"

Fit Pics Post-soak:

Love the fit of these jeans, a little diaper butt IRL but that's fine.

Quite a different fit and roomier feel than my other jeans in rotation now (PBJ 007 w28, Dukes w29[could have done 28] both skin tight at first but 1" looser everywhere now), as the 47' i can pinch around 1'' anywhere post soak.

At first I thought ordering 38" would be too long and need a hem but I guess it turned out great.

Now all i need is a pair of boots to match them (maybe a belt too!).

Comments?

P.S.

And if anyones interested in the pre-soak fit picks, its at the very bottom of page 588 or here: http://www.superfuture.com/supertalk/showthread.php?p=2040056#post2040056

perfect iconic fit you have there. THE jean if you will.

Following all the fuss about 201's last week, I thought that a look at my brothers 201'a might be of interest. I bought them for him in December 07 and I can assure you they're genuine ... at least that's unless Libertys in London's been selling fakes. They're a size 32 32. Not sure how many times he's washed them... not many

perfect vintage fade!

and PAUL. finally checked out your iggy book. fantastic. man after my own heart you are. i remember when i first joined up and you schooled me on a pair of the now famous thai fake 501s.

oh and just a hint about flasher cards, if they are advertising something that isnt even present (hidden rivets for example) its probably a good indication there is something up!

[Dr_Heech]

Just started wearing the pair of 1954 501z that I bought for the contest. I got them because they were the only ones between 1915 and 1966 that were available in my size that I didn't have in rotation already. I thought they would be like a 1955 but with a zipper, but they are more like a modern skinny jean from the knee down (APC New Cure) mated with a vintage levi's fit from the crotch up. If that sounds strange, it sure is. Luckily I have skinny legs, so they fit me quite well. But I don't feel like I am wearing a vintage jean.

They also have very skinny belt loops (1/2" width) like 1960s models that seem inauthentic to me.

The cut on the Lvc '54 z is not like the original 1954 model.

The original had a very similar cut to the '55 as you first assumed. Who knows why Lvc did that ( -carrot silhouette) is anyones guess, but if they fit and you like 'em, then your sorted.

Talking of beltloop width, the recent 1944 re-issues (the ones with the OD green pockets) have much skinnier beltloops than previous ones, same size as the 54 z's + 55's.

.

[ah_long]

My 37's just dried up.

Waist went from 34.5 to 32, and inseam went from 34 to 31.5.

Should I re-soak them before getting them hemmed, or do you guys reckon that's enough? It was an hour hot soak.

my inseam went from around 36 to 31.5

don't hem.. it'll keep on shrinking

[ah_long]

here's my 1937 fit pics

2 initial soaks, hung dry

another soak, machine dried, 90 minutes, high heat

another soak, hair dryer dried, wore damp until dry

[Guest sneekylyric078]

Cross Post from Cultizm LVC contest thread:

Post Soak 1947's: Cold soak 1 hr.

should I cuff or double cuff? (sorry for dark pics)

[partytaco]

Unfortunately it seems that not even Levi's themselves can accurately pinpoint when details changed, honestly I trust the collectors in Japan more often than Levi's. I think a lot of the time now people are using details that they have seen replicated on various LVC models from different collections and different countries as guides to how true vintage Levi's from that time period looked and we all know the errors there.

I don't disagree that there are a handfuls of cross over detailed pairs out there however I would guess by the later 30's that Levi's would have gained control over the consistency of it's product (consistency is the goal of any business, right?) with maybe an exception made during the war.

Lastly, in all of my years of buying/selling/watching/searching out vintage Levi's I can't recall seeing an offset beltloop on a pre mid 50's leather patch pair of Levi's, I have only ever seen this detail on the "every garment.." paper patch.....if you have images of a pair with this detail I would love to see them!!

Airfrog...by the 40's, it was a COIN POCKET.

In my experience, it's very difficult to 'nail down' certain aspects of original levis, for there are many 'cross-overs' (probably due to the many factories making Levis back then).

The off-set belt-loop, for example appears on models made directly after the war too, but documentation only points to the later part of the 1950's-early '60's.

Coincidently, my favorite vintage levis were from that time frame ('57-'64), with those details (Lots of yellow stitching, offset belt-loop, selvedge in coin pocket, disappearance of hidden rivets.. etc)

IMHO, the disappearance of the 'Guarantee' on the two horse card patch, marks the end to true vintage 501's.

.

[Dr_Heech]

Lastly, in all of my years of buying/selling/watching/searching out vintage Levi's I can't recall seeing an offset beltloop on a pre mid 50's leather patch pair of Levi's, I have only ever seen this detail on the "every garment.." paper patch.....if you have images of a pair with this detail I would love to see them!!

QUOTE]

Partytaco

Will try and get some pics up over the weekend for you.

.

[Paul T]

Unfortunately it seems that not even Levi's themselves can accurately pinpoint when details changed, honestly I trust the collectors in Japan more often than Levi's...

I don't disagree that there are a handfuls of cross over detailed pairs out there however I would guess by the later 30's that Levi's would have gained control over the consistency of it's product (consistency is the goal of any business, right?) with maybe an exception made during the war.

Lastly, in all of my years of buying/selling/watching/searching out vintage Levi's I can't recall seeing an offset beltloop on a pre mid 50's leather patch pair of Levi's, I have only ever seen this detail on the "every garment.." paper patch.....if you have images of a pair with this detail I would love to see them!!

Airfrog...by the 40's, it was a COIN POCKET.

Hmm, so you think the offset belt loops is post 1960? I know collectors who would disagree with you. Next time I see my man who has a bunch of deadstock pairs I will snap some photos.

What is certain is that the sitching colors vary over the same period.

[Dr_Heech]

Sounds great Paul,

- looking forward to s/s 2010 collection.

Did you check out the sprogs thread?

.

[Paul T]

Sounds great Paul,

- looking forward to s/s 2010 collection.

Did you check out the srogs thread?

.

Sprogs? Was it your little fella? He was looking very cute - hope you had a good weekend.

[jpsmith98]

Hairy denim on my 1901s (for the contest):

These are the ones cultizm sells, dated 2008 on the interior tag. Curious to know where this denim comes from. Anyone?

[Paul T]

At present the 1901 fabric is from Kurabo.

[partytaco]

Paul - No I think the offset belt loop coincides with the paper patch "every garment..." days. This would make that 1955 to 62 or 63. On vintage Levi's this is also the era you are most likely to see the coin pocket without the visable selvedge edge.

Thread color is tough because the orange thread after many washes can look yellow and both will eventually fade white. Wish this happened on the current LVC product, it's one of my favorite details on vintage Levi's along with those old curled up red tabs.

[entertainment!]

Paul T- Any thoughts on the width of belt loops and when they got narrower?