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Iron Heart Jeans


Guest Guy H

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For me it wasn't about the denim that first got me into iron heart.  I was actually always fairly unimpressed with their jeans, but loved the look of their first gen. flannels.  I couldn't believe the price and swore I would never buy one.  Ended up picking up a used heavy weight, and its been all down-hill since.  I still believe their flannels to be some of their best pieces.  Nothing fancy or flashy, but the fabric is usually exceptional (some of the newer stuff less so than the older stuff), and its a traditional western with proper measurements.  I love the fabrics on other brands, esp. FH but I am no linebacker and hate the look of their shoulder seams past my shoulder edge; it does not give a tailored look and looks cheap to me.  And most other brands do not offer a traditional western cut; always weird pockets or work shirts which hold little or no interest for me.  I love the subtleness of the designs, they look nothing special from a distance, however up close or worn its entirely different.  I have no desire to be flashy and stand out in a crowd, but expect quality construction and top grade materials. The other thing to note is that I love how fabrics are rarely rerun, or at least not year after year.  

After that I finally decided to try a pair of their denim (already many other brands in the closet), I was fortunate enough to find some OG with tabs and original arcs which I love (nothing better than wearing these (get many comments and compliments on the fit and when people ask me what they are my response is always "oh these, they're just some pair of fake levis")).  Since then I have been fortunate enough to line up several other OG pairs and 634sraws all of which are special in their own way.  I still think most of their limit run fabrics SR, SRAW, SE 23oz to be their showcase denims with the most character and potential.

 

Anyways long ramble, but its not always the denim that gets one into a brand.  However it is easy to see why it is so popular.  There is terrific marketing with all the information at your finger tips regarding sizing and fit and many fit pics that are sorted the way the IHUK forum is set up by specific items. I find it a real pain to try and find info on a specific item from other brands and find it frustrating to try and find that info in a general Flat Head topic on SUFU ect...  Plus you don't see other brands promoting themselves as much as IH; with Hakari and gang travelling to different locations to showcase their products.  Its easy to see why people are drawn to the brand with this level of exposure.

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The IH forum has done wonders for the brand... I love the way we all get to interact, discuss new drops, and even suggest our own items... Recently a Norwegian/ French member suggested a superblack pair of 666S'es... They're being produced as we speak... Thàt is fucking awesome... Especially cause I will end up buying it... Gotta have that Cash uniform baby...

I too remember the old days where the IH site was so basic it hurt... I couldn't believe the prices though... This hobby, no, PASSION of ours is costly... But hey, it could be worse: we could be doing meth!..

I'm not sure what caused the backlash though... Hell I even forgot what we're discussing... But I guess now that IH has a bigger fanbase, some of them Belgian and rather hardline, and now that they get a lot more exposure, it's only natural that it created its core of haters as well...

But judging by how this discussion is going, I think we're all too old for this shit, and we respect eachother's choices... And I swear I'm not a hippy...

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Im still recoiling in horror at the sight of white jeans, Do icecream sellers really need 21oz denim.

 

 

Edit- Whoops! Sorry Ben i have just seen the SC thread they are your jeans, What on gods earth possessed you to buy those? I can't even sugar coat a response.

Edited by Double 0 Soul
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Great few pages guys, great debate and many issues raised. 

 

I'm an Iron Heart fan, not so much as I used to be, but that is because I have my own interests in the industry now with other brands. I am a member and regular poster on the IH forum and in the main you cannot find another community where the members are so kind and helpful to each other. I have travelled all over meeting these guys and they are the best, I have made some friends for life.

 

Giles and Paula definitely do understand their market, and spend plenty of time marketing, they travel all over the place to meet their customers and have a very heavy online presence on all aspects of social media.

 

Upon joining the IH forum I was definitely swept up in the feeding frenzy of purchasing, this lead to me "recycling" a lot of items that I liked, but did not truly love. These days my IH collection is much smaller than it once was, but I have kept what I truly love and value.

 

Regarding construction, their gear does seem to stand the tests of time and work better than just about any other brand I have tried, I cannot explain this scientifically, it just does.

 

Regarding how "inspiring" their clothes are, I think that they have a certain look, I know that they are made with care and attention, and I think that the fact that much of what they do isn't so "out there" helps people to feel at ease with the brand. I find their heavy flannels and 25oz denim to be inspiring, I find much of what attracts huge amount of plus rep around these parts to be silly and mere costume (no I will not provide examples), but this is something called personal taste.

 

For me the great strength of the brand to many people is that it is so heavily interactive. You can talk to the guys at the top whenever you want to, not many brands do this and it makes people feel involved. They are not a nameless, faceless corporation, they do care what their customers think, and clearly with Giles involvement they do cater more for customers outside of Japan than other brands.

 

The point raised about the perception of IH in Japan is spot on, Giles has told me himself that in Japan people do not think of IH in the same way as they do Samurai or Flat Head or other similar brands, but that is because they do pitch to an entirely different market, it is clothing for bikers because Haraki San is a biker. 

 

In my short time on the IH forum (2 years) and interacting with the brand on projects I have seen a definite shift in the customer base, from bikers and workers to lawyers, doctors and professional people. Maybe this is indicative of the denim scene i general, but it resonates more with IH because they are pitched as a "biker" brand. 

 

I honestly believe that the times are changing for the whole denim scene, people want something different and interesting from their brands and Iron Heart are reacting to this with more interesting denim (19oz LH twill), this is sensible and shows that they understand the market.

 

I don't see IH's dominant position in the market ending any time soon simply because they do what they do so well.

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Also, to tackle the point made on pricing. 

 

As an upcoming retailer myself I can assure you that what IH charge is very reasonable when you are aware of the facts of retailing Japanese made clothing. 

 

Standard wholesale costing in the clothing industry is 25 - 40% of domestic retail, with Japanese brands it is more like 60 - 65%.

 

Import and duty on incoming shipment accounts for a further 25 - 30%

 

Factor in running a website, paying an outgoing courier, customer returns, obsolescence, insurance and finally making a profit and you see where the price comes from. Most retailers of anything want a profit margin of at least 50% on their costs, and it is considered good practice in retail to aim for a 60% margin. Anyone retailing Japanese denim does not make this money, I guarantee it, and if they do then they are up to something that they shouldn't be.

 

However, when you factor in shipping, import costs, and the fact that most JP retailers and Rakuten shops do not take returns, plus you will wait 2 - 3 weeks for your stuff, then you see why so many people do still choose to buy from Western retailers. In a lot of cases you might save $50 or even $100, but if you screw the purchase up you have literally no come back at all.

 

My 0.2p on that debate.

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qualitative/workmanship/construction........Iron Heart is the best of all brands ...Mr.Freedom,Samurai,TFH,The Rising Sun,PBJ,the Strike Gold,RJB...ect are all great brands and quality too but Iron Heart ist the BEST...my opinion

 

i ve never seen better quality on a produkt... :D

 

by the way...Ts from TFH ( THC series) .are the best .construction/workmanship/quality/fit

Edited by alexx1976
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Why not give some examples of 'mere costume' Mega, come on, it's a debate after all!  ;)

 

I don't think anyone could credibly quibble with the level of customer service Giles offers and the issue of costs is a bit of a none starter really, they are not that much more expensive. I am interested in the your reference to feeding frenzy and buying stuff and I genuinely think it is that (not a dig at you) which detracts from the brand. There is a level of hysteria from IH fans that is not there with other brands. It just seems disproportionate given the general jeans and shirts look - I accept that this is not limited to IH but, honestly, IH is more susceptible to hyperbole than most about the most insignificant of things.

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Honestly, because I have no interest in justifying my opinion, or quantifying my taste or anyone else's. If anyone else wants to have the costume debate, have at it boys.

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On the feeding frenzy thing, this is easily explained by the fact that no other brand has such a concentration of its customers in one place, the forum.

 

I don't mean this horribly, but imagine the scene from Clockwork Orange where Alex is strapped to the chair and force shown images to change his ways, this is a more extreme version of the effect achieved by a brand having a forum.

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I find the shirting somewhat uninspiring, dull and two dimensional, People say "they buy if for the quality" of that i dont dispute, but i own Woolrich flannels that i do actually use for "work"  that i bought vintage for £7each a decade ago and they are holding up perfectly.
 

To justify the quality/price of an IH shirt they would have to last 257years

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Whereas some would favour the clean aesthetic, the subtlety of the fabric, and yes the quality of the construction. To some it is as much about having the knowledge of how well made something is as it is about how long it will/ should last.

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Also, to tackle the point made on pricing. 

 

As an upcoming retailer myself I can assure you that what IH charge is very reasonable when you are aware of the facts of retailing Japanese made clothing. 

 

 

sufu discount, please.  :ph34r:

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I agree on the subtlety of the fabric (apart from the white or red western shirts aint nothing subtle about those), and i agree it is nice to know your shirt was well made but a lot of folks will not actually use it for the purpose to which it was designed so rendering the over engineering a little pointless.

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Also, remembering that the stuff is designed for bikers, it's over engineering is far from redundant if it is used for the purpose it was designed for. 

 

If not then it is like using a steak knife to eat a salad.

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I agree on the subtlety of the fabric (apart from the white or red western shirts aint nothing subtle about those), and i agree it is nice to know your shirt was well made but a lot of folks will not actually use it for the purpose to which it was designed so rendering the over engineering a little pointless.

a product can never be good enough!

 

IH haters are haters of themself!

Edited by alexx1976
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Im still recoiling in horror at the sight of white jeans, Do icecream sellers really need 21oz denim.

 

 

Edit- Whoops! Sorry Ben i have just seen the SC thread they are your jeans, What on gods earth possessed you to buy those? I can't even sugar coat a response.

No harm done! No underlying reason, I just like them. They don't go with the general outfit around here but shit it's boring wearing the same thing everyday. They're a little out of my comfort zone but that's good occasionally and I don't feel white pants are too insane. I do really like them though. Just gotta figure out the best way to wear them!

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