Workshirts

[daveo]

I cut mine off...

[LandoCal126]

morse, it is 7oz Pre-Soak. Not sure about post. And are you talking about the IHSH-09 Heavy Selvedge Chambray Shirt that SE only has 1 Large of? If so, yes it is a "Similar" fabric. Not sure if is exactly the same but will find out.

My bad...

The IHSH-21 fabric is 10oz, not 7oz as previously stated. It is the same chambray used for IHSH-09 and IHSH-13. The IHSH-16 fabric is 11oz. Sorry for the confusion.

[zissou]

I just received my Sunny Sports 40's Workshirt in red chambray. I had my suspicions from the photos I had seen that it was the same plum chambray from Okayama that Hill-Side uses. Upon close inspection, they are, in fact the same- same color, weight, selvage line, everything. I've bugged the Hill-Side brothers in the past to make shirts from the chambray, so I am glad someone finally did. In my opinion, it's the perfect red chambray- muted red warp with natural weft, heavy thread, but loose weave, with just the right amount of slub.

Based on the measurements from Blue Owl and CHCM (both sold out), I bought a Large, which was a wise choice. The fit is very similar to my Large MFSC Utility chambrays (which, remember, shrink to the size of a raw Medium), but the Sunny Sports is a little narrower in the shoulder, with pretty much a straight fit in the body, and slimmer sleeves.

I proxied it from CEL Store, via Hide at SharpService. Total cost was the same as NA retail.

[rnrswitch]

I've bugged the Hill-Side brothers in the past to make shirts from the chambray, so I am glad someone finally did.

Why would they want to make shirts when they can get away with sewing little squares of fabric and selling them to us for nutty prices? They might have to put some effort into it.

edit: oh and I forgot. nice lookin shirt.

[zissou]

Thanks. You have a point there. They use probably the nicest chambrays I've seen, but they are too heavy for the typical bandana.

[mpcec]

Beautiful shirt Mark. How's the length on those? Is it too long to be worn not tucked in. Also does the bottom block (I think this is the phrase) kind of billow out like EG?

[zissou]

Thanks, Mike. Yeah, there is a fair amount of anti-fit in the body, like with EG. One thing I really like about the MFSC chambrays is the waist suppression. The length is almost identical to my L MFSC chambray.

[ThisSunday]

Thanks. You have a point there. They use probably the nicest chambrays I've seen, but they are too heavy for the typical bandana.

They made a few lighter weight bandana for SS10. They are much more bearable now. Nice to se that someone made a shirt out of the plum chambray

.

[rnrswitch]

This is the one that caught my eye:

[zissou]

I do like the 3/4 placket on that one. I'd probably go for it in Sumi, which is some kind of charcoal ink traditional dye.

[mpcec]

Thanks, Mike. Yeah, there is a fair amount of anti-fit in the body, like with EG. One thing I really like about the MFSC chambrays is the waist suppression. The length is almost identical to my L MFSC chambray.

Ah too bad. The EG shirts fit me perfect in the chest/shoulders but I just hate how it flares out... can't really wear the anti fit too well and I'm not into tucking in. Sucks because the best fitting chambray for me is the j.crew one, but the materials/ construction/ etc just don't even compare.

[superbeveridge]

I just received my Sunny Sports 40's Workshirt in red chambray. I had my suspicions from the photos I had seen that it was the same plum chambray from Okayama that Hill-Side uses. Upon close inspection, they are, in fact the same- same color, weight, selvage line, everything. I've bugged the Hill-Side brothers in the past to make shirts from the chambray, so I am glad someone finally did. In my opinion, it's the perfect red chambray- muted red warp with natural weft, heavy thread, but loose weave, with just the right amount of slub.

Based on the measurements from Blue Owl and CHCM (both sold out), I bought a Large, which was a wise choice. The fit is very similar to my Large MFSC Utility chambrays (which, remember, shrink to the size of a raw Medium), but the Sunny Sports is a little narrower in the shoulder, with pretty much a straight fit in the body, and slimmer sleeves.

I proxied it from CEL Store, via Hide at SharpService. Total cost was the same as NA retail.

Love that they use the same chambray as hill-side

[SLAB]

I have the Sumi organic chambray shirt from Sunny SPorts;

also have this one on its way over from Japan (also Sunny sports)

Indigo stripe 40's railroad shirt

and now on to my first Freewheelers shirt (and next month the polka dot shirt from eworkers)

[fardin]

man slab thats a great collection. the indigo striped one looks beautiful.

[Joseph Hill]

Digging around the local army surplus, I flipped through the Ben Davis hickory stripe shirts. Past excursions showed that the only remaining made in the US ones left are in like XXXL, but I had a funny feeling. There it was swimming against the tide of made in Chinas, was one lone USA medium. Not short sleeved, not stupid zipper front jumper, just regular old longsleeved buttondown. Not a big deal for the folks who can swing those sweet Japanese chambrays, but a tiny victory for a po' schlub like myself. (aces on those Sunnysports, dang fine articles they are)

[rnrswitch]

Digging around the local army surplus, I flipped through the Ben Davis hickory stripe shirts. Past excursions showed that the only remaining made in the US ones left are in like XXXL, but I had a funny feeling. There it was swimming against the tide of made in Chinas, was one lone USA medium. Not short sleeved, not stupid zipper front jumper, just regular old longsleeved buttondown. Not a big deal for the folks who can swing those sweet Japanese chambrays, but a tiny victory for a po' schlub like myself. (aces on those Sunnysports, dang fine articles they are)

Nice find. I have wanted that Ben Davis hickory stripe, but not willing to spring for it online because I assumed I would be getting the made in china joint.

[zissou]

I have a MTM hickory stripe denim shirt that I might just have to pass along to someone else. The hickory stripes make all kinds of crazy patterns in my peripheral vision, which makes me dizzy and almost fall over. Strange...

[LandoCal126]

1955 Engineer Chambray Shirt

[zissou]

I don't think anyone has answered it yet. I asked the question some time ago, but I think the consensus is that original vintage shirts during production the seamstress would create the chainstitch run off kinda as a biproduct of working fast when sewing the side seam.. The idea would be that these chainstitches would be cut off before the garment left the factory, but my assumption is that some found their way out of the factory. The japanese in reproducing work shirts may have acquired a taste for the "odd" ones, with this "defect" much like the peeking selvage on the coin pocket of jeans. What was considered a defect is now considered subtle details.

Late to reading this, but my theory was that it had to do with the Japanese aesthetic of wabi-sabi, or 'perfection in imperfection'. This can translate to newer items, such as a shirt, by leaving some part of it unfinished, believing that a garment isn't truly finished until it is worn or personalized. I see this in other Japanese clothes, such as Kato' jeans, where random threads are left untrimmed for the wearer to do with as he sees fit.

[Snake]

Zissou - great fit. I have to save up for the Sumi chambray.

SLAB - great pickup. Where did you get it?

[lostinthesupermarket]

Great shirts zissou and SLAB.

Thanks again for the heads up Snake....the price is outrageous but the jacket is so nice. I figure that it would be good for at least 20 years, so if you amortize the cost over that period it seems almost reasonable. I haven't managed to totally convince myself yet, but emails are being sent in any case.....BTW, what is the correct thread for non-flight leather jackets? I don't want to clog this thread up any further....

RE: the threads on Kato garments....I think zissou's take on them is right. They are usually attached to the inner label and are stitched using the same technique the Japanese use to sew up rice bags... I haven't tried it, but I guess if you pulled them, they would unravel and end up taking the inner

tag off the garment. One of the cool things about Kato is/ was that they

were kind of anti-branding.

[rnrswitch]

Late to reading this, but my theory was that it had to do with the Japanese aesthetic of wabi-sabi, or 'perfection in imperfection'. This can translate to newer items, such as a shirt, by leaving some part of it unfinished, believing that a garment isn't truly finished until it is worn or personalized. I see this in other Japanese clothes, such as Kato' jeans, where random threads are left untrimmed for the wearer to do with as he sees fit.

I don't know. My take would be that the introducing of "imperfection" for the intention of wabi sabi is antithetical to the idea of wabi sabi. My impression of wabi sabi is that nothing is perfect and nothing lasts. When producing something one strives for "perfection," but cannot attain it due to construction process and anomalies. The introduction of these anomalies seems cheap and trite when it comes to work wear. One does not strive for wabi sabi, wabi sabi just is. Just like the person who wears his jeans for the mere intention of fading them, is less on the scale of wabi sabi than some dude who just buys his jeans and wears them and in the end has a nice pair of worn in jeans due simply to the process of wearing.

My ranking of wabi sabi jeans wearing:

1. Dude buys jeans cuz he needs them and wears them not thinking about wash cycles or how many rinses. Does not stare at the fabric wondering when it will fade. Uses the jeans for their purpose and that's it.

2. Dude buys jeans cuz they are high quality and pays close attention to how many washes and wears are had on them and posts occasional pictures on sufu.

3. Dude buys tons of jeans and wears them once or twice or just collects them in the closet not using them for their intended purpose.

4. Dude buys prewashed jeans to look vintagey.

I might actually put 3 below 4, because in the case of 3, the dude is completely insulting the purpose and intention of the jeans, while the guy with the prewashed jeans at least wears them.

In the end I would have to say that these little "anomalies" introduced during the manufacturing process: peaking selvage, chainstitch runoff, these little stray strings on kato jeans, give the impression of wabi sabi, but are not wabi sabi. Wabi sabi is these things occurring despite the strict manufacturing process. They should happen due to manufacturing error or operator error, not through intentional "error." These little things don't add quality to the garment, but they do add character, yet they would add more character if they reached the final product only on a few items and occurred by accident.

My two cents. Or maybe my $1.50. Nevertheless, i do like the anomalies, but sometimes I sit back and think how completely too trying it is.

[viv1984viv]

Great post Switch, id say wabi sabi is beauty through age. 1 is really the only one.....

Ive posted a little bit about wabi sabi here.

http://amerkaji-meme.blogspot.com/2010/04/wabi-sabi-melancholy-of-transience.html

Nice shirts, ought to start looking at sunny sports...

[lostinthesupermarket]

Good post rnrswitch.

In the case of the threads on the Kato labels, I don't think that they included them for the purpose of simulating "wabi-sabi" per-se. I think it has more to do with what they see as the ultimate nature of their clothes. They see them as "tools" which as zissou said are generic and also without purpose until they are bought and used..."completed" as they see it.

Thus I guess the idea is that when you buy the pants, you pull off the label. It's no longer necessary because as you use it, the garment will become unique and customised by how you live in it. At that stage it's no longer a "Kato" garment, it's yours.

As regards the jeans, the gesture of removing the inner label would be pretty symbolic, because the outer leather patch would remain, but I have a bunch of Kato stuff where the "rice bag" stitched label is the only one. Pulling the thread on these would leave the garment without any branding at all.

[tvshooter]

My ranking of wabi sabi jeans wearing:

1. Dude buys jeans cuz he needs them and wears them not thinking about wash cycles or how many rinses. Does not stare at the fabric wondering when it will fade. Uses the jeans for their purpose and that's it.

2. Dude buys jeans cuz they are high quality and pays close attention to how many washes and wears are had on them and posts occasional pictures on sufu.

3. Dude buys tons of jeans and wears them once or twice or just collects them in the closet not using them for their intended purpose.

4. Dude buys prewashed jeans to look vintagey.

- Salaam, Lendo and Tv staring at a pile of japanese denim on Lendo's living room floor comparing notes. trying on diff pairs and taking pic's on the porch. all while smoking stuff and drinking coffee. THEN we go out an find other ppl in RVA wearing denims.

Probably ranks around. . . .

[lostinthesupermarket]

I wish I lived in Richmond.....

[rnrswitch]

- Salaam, Lendo and Tv staring at a pile of japanese denim on Lendo's living room floor comparing notes. trying on diff pairs and taking pic's on the porch. all while smoking stuff and drinking coffee. THEN we go out an find other ppl in RVA wearing denims.

Probably ranks around. . . .

Yeah, I don't know. I would say between 1 and 2. I think y'all have somewhat gotten it right. I would put myself somewhere between 1 and 2 as well, just like a lot of people on this board. BTW I am not intending with that post to single out any people on the board. I think we all have a sickness and a lack of authenticity. There are some people who have a serious love for denim and construction of garments and some people who are out there just to out do the rest of us in the hunt for more denim, basically turning this into a contest as to whose got the most.

[zissou]

I'll definitely agree that introducing something to a garment for the sake of wabi-sabi is not, in fact, wabi-sabi. But, not finishing something is perhaps more so. Although, runoff chainstitch is probably so common, that it's industry standard.

I think the true art of a garment- say, jeans- comes as much from the wearer as the manufacturer. A pair of jeans can be well made from amazing denim, but who really cares unless they are worn and used. I think I'm somewhere between 1 and 2 on your scale, rnr, and I feel better about not paying attention to precisely how many days I have worn my jeans, hah.

[rnrswitch]

I'll definitely agree that introducing something to a garment for the sake of wabi-sabi is not, in fact, wabi-sabi. But, not finishing something is perhaps more so. Although, runoff chainstitch is probably so common, that it's industry standard.

I think the true art of a garment- say, jeans- comes as much from the wearer as the manufacturer. A pair of jeans can be well made from amazing denim, but who really cares unless they are worn and used. I think I'm somewhere between 1 and 2 on your scale, rnr, and I feel better about not paying attention to precisely how many days I have worn my jeans, hah.

We should start measuring wabi-sabi on the RNR scale. I prefer them to be in decibels though. Kinda like the richter scale.

[geneticdrifter]

This page is great. DA questions: (to spur more conversation)

is "trying too hard" antithetical to wabi-sabi in all aspects? clothing as well as life style?

a better question might be, can wabi-sabi apply to ones life style?

are otaku and wabi-sabi diametrically opposed? can one participate in both aspects?

if AFOAF uses clothes like #1 but buys them like #4 where do they go? meaning someone tries really hard to look like a lumberjack or a plant worker from the 30's or a rockabilly guy or a gangster rapper but just wears their "costume" like normal clothes. No attention to quality they just want to look like a specific type of person. buys new stuff when they need it but always in the vein of their "character."

also, lostinthesupermarket, if that isn't Kato's marketing line it should be. I don't care if its wabi-sabi or not, but you make the idea sound appealing.