Red Cloud & Co. jeans

[DhaDha]

well guess now i got a weapon for DWC. will do a writeup once they reach me, probably after new year.

[wtkl]

Hi all,

 

I cannot believe I took so long to find out that there has been such an active redcloud thread here.

I chanced upon redcloud while searching for wabash jeans and it was a cheaper alternative as compared to the likes of ironheart etc.

I have a pair of wabash jeans from redcloud for about almost 2 years and have washed them around 5 times, and I would like to check with you guys here if anybody have ever experienced any similiar issues.

 

Within the first couple of months of wearing, i noticed the part slightly above the hem and the hem itself (where the jeans is rolled up), the threading started to wear out and give way. I had no idea why, I figured it was due to the way I walked, the hems of the jeans rubbed against each other and caused this. but if you look closely at one of the pictures, the stitching gave way in the middle and if the action of the hems brushing against each other was that intense, the scruffs would have been equally worse. This really really bothered me at the beginning, but each time I wore it i just tried to roll the jeans a little higher or cut off the loose thread. I was too lazy to bring it to a tailor.

 

 

 

Another problem I had was the zippo/coins compartment above the front-right pocket. This came slightly later about a year after getting it. the top right part of the pocket gave way again. This I could attribute it to my rough handling/actions. But, honestly I have never faced this problem with my other jeans. The middle portion of the zippo/coins compartment gave way and tore like it was made of paper. I cannot imagine what I had put into the pockets other than round coins in my entire process of owning this pair of jeans that would have caused the tear. Again I feel perhaps this could be attributed to my rough handling/actions but again, I have never faced this problems with any of my other jeans.

As you can see from the picture, where it has been poorly patched in black thread. I couldn't really careless at this point of time already so I quickly got someone to stitched up the tears for me so my coins do not keep dropping or eventually lose an entire coin pocket.

 

 

 

Another problem I faced just quite recently, was the tag/patch that they have in their rear-right pocket, is that the threads started to give way as well. It is really disappointing because i really liked this little detail in the pocket and I have never utilized that pocket at all ever other than the occasional hand-at-the-back-of-pocket-while-waiting-in-the-lift kinda moments. if you take a closer look at the outside fades on the back pocket and the denim in the interior is like fresh.

 

 

 

*Please note, I would like to clearly state I am not here to diss on redcloud or whatsoever.

In fact I really really like the brand and the products that they are churning out and the image/brand that they have become. I would just to find out if it is just me and my rough usage or have anyone with the same pair of wabash have had any similiar problems or if anybody have any great insight on some of the stuff i brought up.

This is definitely one of my top favorite pair of jeans to wear but with all these little issues, I am finding it very hard to love this pair of jeans.

 

Please advise.

Peace

[oomslokop]

i can't answer you, but i'd love a full view of your pants, please.

[DhaDha]

i don't think any of the 'problems' you described are really problem per se, they are just the ways in which a pair of pants ages. Wabash Fabric is inherently not as hard-wearing fabric as denim fabric to begin with, and red cloud uses 100% cotton thread which breaks easier than polycore thread too. 

 

anyway sick looking pair of wabsh. show full view!

[Mr Black]

Sniggers...

(It's a British thing)

i can't answer you, but i'd love a full view of your pants, please.

[chicote]

I've had the same tearing on the inside of the hem on my R400H, but didn't think much of it as it happens to every pair that I've cuffed multiple times. However! I got a pair that was completely falling apart hemmed, and all of a sudden the tearing stopped. Maybe that is the key.

[oomslokop]

Sniggers...

(It's a British thing)

keep your suspenders on mr black! 💂

[TuckshopSS]

Hi all,

 

*Please note, I would like to clearly state I am not here to diss on redcloud or whatsoever.

In fact I really really like the brand and the products that they are churning out and the image/brand that they have become. I would just to find out if it is just me and my rough usage or have anyone with the same pair of wabash have had any similiar problems or if anybody have any great insight on some of the stuff i brought up.

This is definitely one of my top favorite pair of jeans to wear but with all these little issues, I am finding it very hard to love this pair of jeans.

 

Please advise.

Peace

 

All I can say is, that is one really worn pants and definitely amazing. 

 

I am sorry but I will not be able to explain why or how things broke on a pair of pants after wearing it for 2 yrs. 

My belief is that, it is due to wear and tear, frequent wearing. And you have certainly done a great job, wtkl.

 

We welcome all honest feedbacks and comments here, good or bad. All it matters is how we can know more about Red Cloud.

 

Singapore's Tuckshop & Sundry Supplies has got a pair of the same RC Wabash, worn for 3 yrs, washed unlimited time.

 

 

Nothing broke so far....

 

 

Oh... Can I have your permission to post your wabash pictures on our social media?

[wtkl]

i don't think any of the 'problems' you described are really problem per se, they are just the ways in which a pair of pants ages. Wabash Fabric is inherently not as hard-wearing fabric as denim fabric to begin with, and red cloud uses 100% cotton thread which breaks easier than polycore thread too. 

 

anyway sick looking pair of wabsh. show full view!

 

 

I've had the same tearing on the inside of the hem on my R400H, but didn't think much of it as it happens to every pair that I've cuffed multiple times. However! I got a pair that was completely falling apart hemmed, and all of a sudden the tearing stopped. Maybe that is the key.

 

Thanks for your responses and experience, guys.

I do agree, the wabash is generally not as "solid" as denim fabric and the 2nd and 3rd "problem" mentioned earlier is kinda negligible

and rather justified with all the wearing and tearing.

But what really kinda bothered me was the strange case of the loose thread at the hem. Like I said, i tried to yank it off initially and at some point it got a little out of control and it let out a big hole as shown in one of the pix. Subsequently, i just cut it loose and folded the pants higher and got on with it.

 

 

 

 

All I can say is, that is one really worn pants and definitely amazing. 

 

I am sorry but I will not be able to explain why or how things broke on a pair of pants after wearing it for 2 yrs. 

My belief is that, it is due to wear and tear, frequent wearing. And you have certainly done a great job, wtkl.

 

We welcome all honest feedbacks and comments here, good or bad. All it matters is how we can know more about Red Cloud.

 

Singapore's Tuckshop & Sundry Supplies has got a pair of the same RC Wabash, worn for 3 yrs, washed unlimited time.

 

 

Nothing broke so far....

 

 

Oh... Can I have your permission to post your wabash pictures on our social media?

 

 

Thanks for your response, Tuckshop!

As mentioned above, I'm abit more affected with the stitching at the hem. And after the loose stitching took place a couple of months after getting the pants, I guess it sort of got through to me that it was just a pair of pants afterall and made me just wear the pants and work it as it should be. But with the recent discovery of the tears and loose stitching of the patch in the rear-right pocket, it made me a little disappointed as this is really my favorite pair of pants to wear and the wash and everything is really starting to come together.

To be honest, despite all these, I am really considering getting another same pair of rc wabash to start from the very beginning.

[wtkl]

And here with regards to some requests for full view of my pants.

And to Tuckshop's earlier request, please feel free to use the pictures, I am more than glad to share them with you.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Meanwhile, I would be glad to hear from anyone of you if you have had similar experiences whatsoever, I'd like to think it's just my rough usage because I really just worked the pants with a fuck it mentality.

 

Also, I will be most glad if anyone of you have any advice to share on getting the fades out from behind the knees and other non-prominent parts such as the calves area.

Much thanks in advance.

 

Cheers & happy holidays.

[oomslokop]

beautiful view

[TuckshopSS]

And here with regards to some requests for full view of my pants.

And to Tuckshop's earlier request, please feel free to use the pictures, I am more than glad to share them with you.

 

Meanwhile, I would be glad to hear from anyone of you if you have had similar experiences whatsoever, I'd like to think it's just my rough usage because I really just worked the pants with a fuck it mentality.

 

Also, I will be most glad if anyone of you have any advice to share on getting the fades out from behind the knees and other non-prominent parts such as the calves area.

Much thanks in advance.

 

Cheers & happy holidays.

 

Thank you wtkl.

 

We have sent the pics to Raymon and he posted on his RC facebook, https://www.facebook.com/officialredcloud

 

Also mentioned the upcoming Wabash pants for Red Cloud is available on Jan 2015 in model code, R5500-B.

[DhaDha]

well i guess they can really stand on their own.

 

 

 

first impression is very good indeed, through and through. i shall write full review when the festivities are over. 

and now for something completely different:

 

 

 

keychain i got as freebie from R400 from Tuckshop. They age rather well from 2 years hanging on my car key. The rivet oxidises really well. Strange i didn't get any oxidation from my R400, but they used older, stock universal rivet. will be interesting to see if the new r400sp's rivet will oxidise. 

[TuckshopSS]

The fit of Red Cloud R436 cinchback

 

[d-rew12]

Some updated pics of my R423xx 13.7oz. About 4-5 months of wear and 2 washes. I only wear them for work and they are usually shoved into galoshes and then waders over them (that's why there's front combs). Sadly, they're getting a bit too slim for me now. The pics darkened a bit when uploading so they're a little lighter in person, but this is close

Edited January 1, 2015 by d-rew12

[redragon]

RC Wabash, really like the "marbled" button combination with the fabric.

 

The guy at Tuckshop advise me to size abit bigger because the shirt will shrink so this is the pre-soak fit:

 

Will update more with the post-soak fitpic soon...

[goodrain]

what size is that? and what is your height/weight?

[DhaDha]

Here’s my review of Red Cloud R400SP (warning : long read!)

 

 

I’ll skip the spec. as you can find those on Tuckshop website easily enough. The before soak pics can also be found there or on the last page.

 

 

Initial impression of these was indeed very good. I was quite impressed with the Original R400 (from 2012 run) a few years back. They compared favourably well with Japanese/American/Italian made jeans, and the denim was second to none as well, as the fades can attest. However, that didn’t prepare me for the R400SP. Somehow they exceeded the original R400 even! Stitches are clean with no loose thread anywhere. Hardware is sturdy and very heavy-duty looking, especially the back buttons. The contrast stitching is very beautifully done, with reddish orange thread running through the dark blue denim. One of the most beautiful contrast stitching I’ve seen imho.

 

Construction looks good and sturdy. If these last as long as the R400 have been for me, I’ll be a happy camper.

 

If I have complaint, it would be the same thing I’ve said before: Wabash pocket bag. I think this was ever only found on the 2012 run of R400, but I could be wrong. While the pocket bag of R400SP is made of sturdy looking canvas material, it cannot compare to the Wabash fabric especially in term of aging property. Please use more of that Wabash fabric for pocket bag in the future! Anyway this is purely internal and only the wearer would ever know of such a trivial matter at all.

 

 

Leather patch has changed from before, or at least the finishing has changed. The new patch has a shiny finish, with graphics and writing imprinted. Before this was merely printed, and over time would rub off. I guess the new patch would retain their graphics better than before, which is a plus. (before soak/after soak and fed with leather feed)

 

 

Now the fabric. 25oz. Thick. Hairy. Dark. Smooth. The denim is quite regular, with no visible slub. Here’s before and after soak pic. The fabric gets a lot hairier after soak. I gave these 2 soaks. First was 2-hours hot soak. They didn’t shrink as much as I thought so I gave them another almost boiling water soak. At first I thought there was not much leg twist, but I was wrong! The fabric is so stiff and prevents leg from twisting, only after some wearing did the leg twist really show. But like I said, very stiff fabric even after 2 soaks. When I put these on the first time I didn’t need to work out afterword. It was that much of a hassle really (not to mention buttoning up fully took me half an hour and my thumbs).

 

Measurement before soak
W: 33/FR:11.2/BR:14.5/TH:11.75/KN:8.5/LO:8/IS:34

Measurement after soak

W: 32/FR:10.5/BR:14/TH:11.5/KN:8.25/LO:7.75/IS:32

 

Tuckshop said these are bluer than, say, IH or Samurai 25Oz. I can’t speak for the Sammy 25oz, as I have never fondled them in real life, but I have to say that while these are actually bluer than IH, they are as dark. Different shades of indigo but comparably dark. I wouldn’t be surprise if these give a very high contrast wear. We’ll see.

 

 

Bonus pic. I guess this is how they up the weight: two blended wefts. Can’t help but think how awesome it would be if one of these were to be indigo-dyed like the R400’s.

 

 

Hairy stuff, almost fluffy! (although not as much as the original R400)

 

 

Selvedge Line. While the fabric is very hard and stiff, the weft side is also hairy, giving it a fluffy hand. When wearing these have a rather pleasant, soft/hard feeling.

 

 

Fit pic after soak. Fit remains unchanged from the R400. Basically lower rise 1947 cut. One thing that has improved from R400 is front pocket openings. In R400 they were rather small and hard to reach into, even with my comparatively small Asian hand. With these, things have changed and front pocket openings are now standard-size.

 

Now the elephant in the room: Price. These cost $429 at Tuckshop, which is probably the retail price worldwide. This is the same, or in the same ballpark, as IH 25oz and Samurai 25oz. One thing that you can’t deny about the appeal of Red Cloud, at least of a few years ago, is that they provide Japanese/American quality workware/garment, done the old way to the highest standard, at a price point lower than Jap./USA Made product. In other word, same quality but cheaper. With R400SP, they are charging the same price. Now that one of the appeals is gone people might be asking: ‘then why not just get IH/Sammy 25oz instead?’

Well personally, I think these are at least the same quality as IH 25oz I’ve handled and fondled at shops. Can’t speak for Sammy 25oz as I have not had any experience with them. If you can justify the prices of IH/Sammy 25oz, then purely from what you get for your money (construction/craftsmanship/material quality) these can be similarly justified.

 

You might still think that because these are made in China, and even with the same quality materials costing similarly enough, the labour should still be cheaper.  Well, do consider that RC runs its own high-standard/high-quality factory, and the fact that these are a very limited production run. If IH/Sammy churn out 25oz jawns at this quantity, I’m sure the price would be a lot higher, and they would also be gone as soon as they drop (look at ROY for instant). So, overall, I think the price is justified well. 

 

At first I was not going to soak/wear these until DWC in May, but I couldn’t resist. So I guess until then I’ll put a few wears to mellow the fabric down a little, well within the amnesty wear.

 

TL:DR Awesome jeans, nothing worth faulting. worth the price. DWC here I come!

Edited January 7, 2015 by DhaDha

[cmboland]

^^^ i like long reads and i appreciate this!

[redragon]

@goodrain

Size 15.

I am ~70 kg, embarrassed to say that I do not remember my own height...will measure up soon & let you know asap. 

[beautiful_FrEaK]

Great review DhaDha!

Really enjoyed reading it

[exaptavist]

.

Edited October 9, 2015 by hoggreaser

[bradl]

Awesome dhadha, really stoked to see what you do to these. Also, I had a hard time with that price, but to be expected with something like this.

[TuckshopSS]

Informative write-up DhaDha!

 

You are right about the changes. 

 

New leather for patch

Pocket opening are wider

 

The cut and workmanship stay the same. Or rather I would say improve tremendously especially on this 25oz fabric.

 

Regarding the price, we discussed with Raymon before from the consumer point of view when he was presenting this R400SP last year.

Well, as a retailer for Red Cloud, we normally try to fight for better price on behalf of consumers.

However, what Raymon explained make sense and we agree that it is an honest price.

 

The thing about Red Cloud is that, the mill that manufacture Red Cloud's staple fabrics (14.5oz and 17oz) dropped everything to take up this experiment of making something they are not used to on Raymon's request. 

As I have heard, the rejection rate (meaning flawed fabrics due to manufacturing) is alot higher than the staple fabrics. Of course this is partly due to Raymon's involvement in quality control that failed his expectation.

 

After the 25oz fabrics were done and sent to Raymon's factory to make into jeans, he encountered many problems when producing the jeans. All machines need to be re-adjusted to sew this heavy fabrics which basically stopped all the other production just to make 25oz jeans....

 

Considering these factors, for a 'newbie' in heavy weight jeans, I must say Red Cloud's spirit of experimenting new directions is commendable. And sadly, his recommended price to retail is certainly justifiable comparing to experienced heavy weight jeans makers.

 

Due to the above back-end efforts, Raymon mentioned that he will not make heavy weight jeans again. These are going to be for this run only.

[TuckshopSS]

We just did an event in Malaysia.

 

A small get-together BBQ. The store is The Yard Backdoor Dry Goods.

 

Here are some pictures,

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You can view all pictures at Red Cloud's facebook. https://www.facebook.com/officialredcloud

 

 

[TuckshopSS]

Full restocked on Red Cloud Jeans 

 

R423 - http://www.tuckshopsundrysupplies.com/store/red-cloud-r423xx-14-5oz-loose-cut-denim-jeans/

 

R423 fading example

 

 

R424 (Wukong Arc) - http://www.tuckshopsundrysupplies.com/store/red-cloud-r424-14-5oz-slim-straight-denim-jeans-wukong/

 

R424 fading example

 

R425 - http://www.tuckshopsundrysupplies.com/store/red-cloud-r425-14-5oz-slim-tapered-denim-jeans/

 

R436 (Cinch-back) - http://www.tuckshopsundrysupplies.com/store/red-cloud-r436-14-5oz-vintage-style-denim-jeans/

[TuckshopSS]

Mr. Louis Koo (å¤å¤©ä¹) wearing Red Cloud jeans, R424BE

 

He is a Hong Kong movie star for those who doesn't know.

 

 

[TuckshopSS]

Giving more insights about Red Cloud Overall MFG & Co (in short Red Cloud).

 

Red Cloud has been producing their products in their own factory since their establishment in 2008/2009. 

 

On their facebook page, Raymon said, 

"There are many brands in the world who out-source their production to elsewhere, but not for Red Cloud brand. 

I established my factory since 2008/2009 producing only my design of jeans and apparels under Red Cloud brand. 

All quality controls and factory operations is manage by myself. 

All workers are chosen by myself base on their skill levels and expertise and pay accordingly.

 

This is Red Cloud Overall MFG & Co's fundamentals."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

All pictures can be found on Red Cloud facebook page https://www.facebook.com/officialredcloud

[TuckshopSS]

Red Cloud Wabash Pants, R5500-B 

 

 

Cinch-back details

[srudy]

Just bought a pair of Wabash today for AB Fits SF.  They should be hemmed in a week or so.  Will post pics soon.  Can't wait to break them in!