Full Count 2009 Contest Redux

[setterman]

Setterman: You and I are in the same size territory. Me, because I'm decidedly 25bls overweight. You, probably because you're fit and just really big.

Nah, I'm fat too! ;-) Need to drop at least 20 lbs.

Currently wearing a pair of size 38 LVC 1955s and and size 38 Sugar Cane 1947s. The LVC fit me perfectly. They're basically the same shape as the 0105, but with a little more rise. Wish I could have gone down to a 36 in the Canes, so the legs would be narrower, but I couldn't go a full two inches smaller in the waist.

[setterman]

Contest 0105C, new 1108Cs. Bright out, so the jeans appear lighter colored than they really are.

[Denim Phenom]

Ed, those companies may work but I'm never buying another pair of jeans that I haven't tried on first. No more of this guesstimating shit.

[salaami]

setterman, first things first...those contest joints are killing it with the vintage fading. secondly, if you got the same waist size in the 1108 as you did with the 0105c you should get just what you wanted. i'm actually thinking about doing the opposite and getting the 0105 in either the contest version, or the natural indigo. i'm leaning towards the nat. indigo. i was thinking about the eternal contest, but i really want to take these denime to a full, uninterrrupted 2 yrs. i'm going to BiG soon, so i gotta grab a pair of something when i'm there. ..

[setterman]

setterman, first things first...those contest joints are killing it with the vintage fading. secondly, if you got the same waist size in the 1108 as you did with the 0105c you should get just what you wanted. i'm actually thinking about doing the opposite and getting the 0105 in either the contest version, or the natural indigo. i'm leaning towards the nat. indigo. i was thinking about the eternal contest, but i really want to take these denime to a full, uninterrrupted 2 yrs. i'm going to BiG soon, so i gotta grab a pair of something when i'm there. ..

I understand the appeal of the natural indigo, but I can't say enough good things, or give a high enough recommendation to the contest denim. I'm sure you can't go wrong with either.

Eternal 811s have been on my radar too, but I have to draw the line with these 1108Cs. Hopefully they give me the narrower, straighter look I'm wanting right now. Between them, the 0105Cs, the LVC '55s, and the SC '47s I should have all the vintage styles I'm wanting covered.

[aho]

I already repped you setterman but I just have to second salaami on those contest jeans....They IMMEDIATELY had me jonesing for a pair even though I have enough denim on my hands...Beautiful stuff my friend!

[Maynard Friedman]

setterman, first things first...those contest joints are killing it with the vintage fading. secondly, if you got the same waist size in the 1108 as you did with the 0105c you should get just what you wanted. i'm actually thinking about doing the opposite and getting the 0105 in either the contest version, or the natural indigo. i'm leaning towards the nat. indigo. i was thinking about the eternal contest, but i really want to take these denime to a full, uninterrrupted 2 yrs. i'm going to BiG soon, so i gotta grab a pair of something when i'm there. ..

Salaami, thought you were trying to complete the Osaka 5 set. Have you considered the natural indigo SDA 103s from BIG?

[erbs]

Are there any plans to do another production run of these?

The 15oz. denim looks great, but the 1108s are all sold out. I wish I wouldn't have missed out on this contest.

[LeicaLad]

I've always wanted a pair of momotaros, but we'll see. After wearing jeans that actually fit and aren't sufu tight, I'm leaning towards another company that offers dad jeans.

I definitely agree with the better cut idea. And with the guestimation to sizing. Too many pricey errors. I've got several excellent pairs of great denim in wrong sizes. I even have a pair of the 10th Anniversary Eternal 811's that are a size too small. Maybe I can trade into the upcoming contest.

The momotaros look like great denim, but the cuts all seem to be low-rise or mid-to-low-rise. I'm definitely not going back there. It's a body shape issue.

I'd go back to another pair of these great Full Counts, but my size has been sold out a long time. Sigh. Sometimes, the hunt for perfect jeans is a great adventure. Sometimes, it's just bloody hard work.

[Denim Phenom]

Momo's do have low rises, which, I can't wear anymore.

I tried on my LVC '47s a few weeks back and i thought I was wearing girls jeans (as cliche as that sounds). They were really tight in the thighs and had almost a flare to them. I felt really awkward wearing them, even in just my bedroom.

[untungl]

Not gonna lie... I put the FC contest jeans away after my year was up to start wearing my samurai s002JP yamatos but i pulled 'em out again.

They are just perfect

[joelz]

I did the same untungl. It's like wearing a hug.

[BrownMetallic]

sorry, dbl post.

[BrownMetallic]

Not gonna lie... I put the FC contest jeans away after my year was up to start wearing my samurai s002JP yamatos but i pulled 'em out again.

They are just perfect

I did the same untungl. It's like wearing a hug.

.

yup, same here. 'put the s001jp on rotation after the contest. but, i've had the FCs all year & having a slight withdrawal__ somehow i've gotten used to the soft & comfy feel of 'em.

i'm having [motivation] issues getting started with &/or soldiering on [to break in] any other another pair right now. so, i took the 1108Cs out just so i can wear em when i want to.__ to fill in the void

aside from the Yamatos, i got 2 naturals [s5000ai & D1334] included in my current rotation__ it'll be awhile before they come even close to the FC status.

[LeicaLad]

Well, I sure haven't given up on mine.

I'm just back from 6+ weeks in Vietnam, Laos and Bangkok. The heat was unbelievably crazy hot. There were times I wondered why I was wearing jeans and not something much, much lighter. Call it dedication. Or, call it stupid. Damn! It was hot!

I got a small snag, and, boy, did it start to spread fast. Lucky, I have a street tailor nearby the Bkk residence, and he did a fabulous patch that is practically invisible.

Otherwise, the pure cotton thread is dying in a few too many places. While I love the repro/premium denim, this obsession with non-poly-core thread (AKA: pure cotton) seems more than a bit stupid to me. It's almost a good reason to go with heavy-weight denim: the heavier weight denim don't even try to go cotton-only stitch thread. The poly-core just lasts longer.

I put a certain amount of time under my car in Bangkok (I have an antique car that has to be brought out of storage and put back every time I come or go.) It was a lot of time on my last day, this time, as I broke the car jack and had difficulties with my local replacement jack. Between 6 weeks of sweat and dirt in rural Laos and VN, plus this additional grime, means these jeans are very ready for a wash.

The trouble is what others find: Other jeans pulled from the drawers just don't feel as good. These are going into the wash and I'll just suffer until they're dry enough to wear.

It really is gonna be tough to replace these.

[salaami]

with all due respect( jeans look dope btw) i can't disagree more about the cotton thread. first, your jeans look like they've had quite a beating over the last year in very humid south-asian climates, and the jeans are still in one peice. all i see is some front-pocket damage, and as long as the crotch isn't blown out theres nothing i can see that a little time with a needle and thread won't fix. the thread is all-cotton so that it will PURPOSEFULLY wear-out over time, it wears away with the denim threads, and even changes color with time. if you bought a pair of deadstock pair of levis the thread probably wouldn't have lasted any longer with equal wear. in japan the wearing thin of the thead is a badge of honor. samurai offers real heavyweight denim, and all cotton thread. ..

[LeicaLad]

Hi Salaami,

Yes, I am quick to acknowledge that my opinion on cotton thread will be clearly in the minority. I just don’t see seams failing as thread disintegrates worthy of the badge of honor status. It just looks like your pants are falling apart. I want amazing denim, and I want it to hold together as long as the denim is worth wearing.

I’ve actually done a lot of seam repair on my contest pair, including back yoke, crotch and, repeatedly, the pockets. The difference is that I usually opt for repairs that are not visible, unless you simply have to go big due to major blow-out. I do have an old pair of Levi’s that are barely visible with leather patches on top of patches (in some cases, on top of more patches). This is the pair that sustained me through two years of hitch-hiking around central and south Asia. Now, I go for invisible repairs to showcase the denim.

I just don’t understand why a poly-core thread, meaning a cotton-synthetic twist thread, cannot give the exact same appearance, and save us from many blowouts. It can look exactly like cotton, can fade, etc., but hold seams together longer. Forgive me, I just hate having to reconstruct my expensive artisan denim. (Heresy!) They also always blow out at the most inconvenient moments!

As for the heavy-weight stuff, I thought that everything over 17ozs pretty much required polycore thread. If Samurai is using cotton-only, I’m amazed. I wonder how well it holds up to the stress? I’m certain that Iron Heart use polycore thread on their heavy denim.

In the end, this is just an opinion. I don't really feel strongly about it at all, and I will live with whatever. I really, really DO appreciate all the efforts to make super-high quality jeans. If I have to do some repair work as part of the price, well, hand me that needle!

LL

[Denim Phenom]

LL, what's up with no pictures of your adventures?

[LeicaLad]

LL, what's up with no pictures of your adventures?

Hey DP,

Sorry, but I just haven’t been taking as many photos on my last runs. Plus, these adventures aren’t quite the same as my year of Living Dangerously in the NWFP. I haven’t gotten to hang out of a Huey chopper over prime Taliban territory since then. (AKA: Taliban Target Practice where we were the Target.) I think I’m grateful.

These last runs have been to an area in central Laos and Vietnam to work with an ethnic minority group called the Bru. On the Vietnam side, the same minority peoples are called the Van Khieu (it’s the name Uncle Ho gave them). I include some youth from the Pakoh people, which are a sub-group. They’re all from the Mon-Khmer language family, but they actually do not have a written script for their own language. Hard to believe these days, but it's true.

My project is an HIV and human trafficking reduction program that is looking to reduce the impact from the improvements to Highway #9, funded by the Asian Development Bank, as part of the Asian Highway Network expansion programs. If you want to check the map, the road runs from Suvannakhet, Laos, thru Khe Sanh, Vietnam, down to Hue.

In theory, this East-West Economic Corridor is supposed to run clear across Thailand and Myanmar down to the port at Mawlamyaing, but that last section will take forever to be constructed due to the political problems in Burma/Myanmar. So, for now, I’m focused just in the areas near the Lao-VN border.

I’m just back from conducting a series of training workshops on radio drama productions. Since we can’t do written materials, and many of the villages rather remote, we decided to go radio. I don’t have the budget nor time-line to do TV production.

It's a small 2-year project. I have a staff of 3 field people. Two on the VN side, one on the Lao side. I'm the "team leader", but am only hired at 25% time. Go figure.

Anyway, the point is that I have photos of young people in a workshop setting, a few more from conducting interviews in the villages, but I just didn’t think any of them were that interesting visually to clutter up the place here.

Nor are any of the photos vaguely related to the subjects of these boards.

There are times I miss hanging the feet out the chopper, and those moments made for good photos. Since I could also show off new boots and denim in those shots, I felt justified.

I’ve tried to set up a few entertaining shots in these settings, but, so far, none have particularly worked.

Thus, I haven’t bored you with ‘em.

I haven’t noticed anyone else posting adventure shots to speak of. Surely there should be a few, eh?

Thanks for asking. Makes me think how boring my life is becoming. I find it very weird to be living back in the US at all.

Sigh.

[Denim Phenom]

So, what exactly is it that you do in all of these places? Have you been working for one company for the last few years or several?

I know those are very broad questions for something really particular.

Maybe I'll get some action shots once my bike is done. My buddy would think it weird that he's taking pictures of me wrenching on my bike.

[LeicaLad]

Let’s see. How to answer that?

The usual phrase is “independent contractor†or “freelance technical expertâ€.

I know it as “hand-to-mouthâ€. It’s my own fault. I’m pretty strongly opinionated, and often willing to speak out – even when I know it might cost me. I had a great gig in the UN system, until the corruption among the national staff officers in my country program just became too much… and I spoke out. Well, the U.N., like our gov’t, doesn’t really want to know about these things. They’re embarrassing, and messy to work out. The whistle-blower always, repeat: always, gets screwed.

Thus, I take technical contracts from various employers. It’s not that I haven’t had some really amazing adventures, but that I now have a wife and child to support. Guess I didn’t think too hard about that before opening my big mouth, eh?

So, the gig in the NWFP of Pakistan was with the US State Dept. I managed road construction in the border areas, and oversaw the annual poppy crop survey (thus, the chopper shots). They outsource many gigs. Part of the rationale is that, should such a contractor get killed, it doesn’t officially “count†as an official gov’t casualty. (You may think I’m joking, but this is true.)

My current gig is with the Asian Development Bank. As noted, I'm "Team Leader" of a field project, but hired only 25% time (for 100% responsibility). They give what they call “intermittent†assignments, so they don’t ever have to provide benefits. It’s the WalMart approach to international development staffing. This, too, is not a joke.

I hunt for interesting and, if I get lucky, meaningful work. I’ve been spoiled by a few great projects. For example, I spent a few years producing a dictionary of the Thai Sign Language. It’s now the national reference work, and they’ve expanded educational opportunities for deaf kids more than a hundred fold. Damn tough act to follow.

But, for now, I just hunt for work and hope it's enough to provide.

Like too many people, I’m highly qualified and experienced, but am a single health incident from homeless. Weird, but true. But I'll be homeless in fine denim and shoes, eh?

This should teach you to ask a serious question. You might get an answer!

Cheers,

[Denim Phenom]

Still trying to come up with a good response to that.

What did you major in in college?

[LeicaLad]

Still trying to come up with a good response to that.

What did you major in in college?

I have a master's in urban planning, and a ph.d. in political science.

What that means is that I am authorized to annoy authority figures, and I am quite good at it!

The payback, however, is a bitch.

[salaami]

i should've said ''respectfully disagree''. to each his own. one of the heads of one of our favorite brands said he uses cotton thread so that the customer can develop a relationship with his neighborhood tailor. interesting. but thinking about it, what pants wont start to fall apart after a solid year of wear? that's over 300 consecutive wears. its a wonder they last this long all things considered...your life sounds fascinating

[LeicaLad]

Hey Salaami,

No stress. I understood how you meant it.

I'm curious if the quality of cotton thread has declined over the decades. I mean men wore jeans for more than a single year, and all the while doing serious labor to boot. I think patching jeans was pretty normal, but if seams had been an issue I think there would have been fussing, eh? Or the jeans just wouldn't have sold. (This is total conjecture, of course.) But then who would have made record of such?

When in Asia, finding a tailor to do repairs takes 5 mins. And cheap, as well. The repair of my snag cost me 10 Baht - about US$ .30 cents - and all of a 5 min. walk up the street. I couldn't imagine finding someone in the US who would do it, let alone consider the cost. Ouch.

Authenticity comes with a price, I suppose.

But I do wonder if these seam problems were as common back then? Was the cotton thread just better then?

LL

[salaami]

authenticity always has a price. but fake sucks, unless it's thai 501s;).

i've asked several of our celebrated sufu think-tank cats, and none of them can really even begin to say how long a pair of levis, boss-of-the-roads, strongholds, lees, etc. were to last a regular hard-working man back in the 'good ole days'. one key factor was that people were much more likely to mend a garment and keep it going until absolute death, especially work pants. no work, no eat, so the jeans have to stay at least functional for labor. people washed without regard to fading, so they had to have washed the jeans with the regular wash as usual. my mother still washes my stepfather's cheep Riders work jeans every week(like mother, like son:D), and it's fucking 2010!

please don't think that if you put two horses on either side of a pair of deadstock vintagelevis they aren't going to rip...

[Denim Phenom]

After trying on jeans for about an hour yesterday I ended buying a pair of Size 33 FC1108s. They didn't have any contest denim ones left so I got a pair of the regular ones. However, if you want a very special pair of pre-lawsuit 32s they may or may not have them. I didn't see anything, wink. Gordon is doing the one wash service for me and when I pick them up we'll see how much needs to be cut off.

I decided on those because all the other pairs I tried on just didn't fit right. Evisu 2000 No.1, Oni Hand sewn were too baggy. Joe McCoy, momotaro 0201 didn't have enough ball space.

The guy there was working his ass off trying to get me into something that fit and was very helpful to my wife and I. We probably tried on 10+ pairs of jeans between us and I'm the only one that left with something.

If anyone is on the fence about the real McCoy engineer boots, pull the trigger. So nice. If you're on the fence about the mister freedom boots, pass. Snooze fest.

Later we went to self edge and my wife still couldn't find anything that fit right. I'm thinking we'll have to get a custom pair made somewhere or find the rrl jeans she got 2 years ago.

[Denim Phenom]

There I am, in Coney Island, a few days ago. Coney Island sucks, my Nathan's Chili cheese dog ruled.

That is the most recent fit pic of my 0105s.

[laughter95]

THIS IS IT!__ would need another 6 mos of effective wear to properly prime & get them [really] going, but .... oh well.

#004 = 1108C :: self-installed red tab&arcs [low-profile].

start date: 03/27/09 :: end date: 03/17/10 [ 11mos + 20days x 5 washes ]

see title 1010-10

[locallau]

anyone feel like these shrank a lot in the thigh area?

these used to be regular straight, but now they seem to be a slim straight fit. not that i don't like it, i just remember having a lot more ball room and sitting down is a little more uncomfortable.