Loopwheeled/Vintage T-Shirts

[Broark]

I ended up getting the Joe McCoy navy pocket tee made from sea island cotton and it is quite nice. Really love the color. Only real complaint is the length of the body, it's a little on the short side since I have a long torso.

[jung]

Merz is a tubular knit machine, not loopwheeled.

 

Peter Plotnicki at Merz told me they use hanging loopwheel and he sent this photo of the machines.

[IMG]http://i41.tinypic.com/21o4fb5.jpg[/img]

[jung]

The McCoy's Ballpark sweats aren't loopwheeled (at least my hoody isn't). Unless they decided to change that recently.

 

I'm not sure about the hoodies but the sweats are produced on loopwheel machines in Wakayama.

[bradl]

Peter Plotnicki at Merz told me they use hanging loopwheel and he sent this photo of the machines.

[IMG]http://i41.tinypic.com/21o4fb5.jpg[/img]

"With the help of a traditional knitwear manufacturer based in the German Swabian Mountains, vintage fashion aï¬cionado Peter Plotnicki revived the "old way of crafting clothes".

Driven by his passion for traditional fabrication processes, he and the team created a collection garments solely made by 1920s-1950s circular knitting machines. All tops are based on authentic working man's apparel ranging from the ï¬rst decades of the 20th century to army shirts of the sixties — some slightly modiï¬ed, some copied from the original piece down to the last seam.

Peter Plotnicki sets great store by the label "Made in Germany": the trimming's cotton fabrics, buttons, labels, hangtags, and packaging are German-made.

High quality traditional products — manufactured in Germany — without compromises!"

[devilish]

I think that I read either on SuFu or elsewhere that the Real McCoy's are no longer loopwheeled. If you look on BiG's website for example nothing is listed as being so. It is mostly tube knit. In the past I believe some things were but not anymore.

[ksisouk]

I'm not sure about the hoodies but the sweats are produced on loopwheel machines in Wakayama.

Pulled from McCoy's thread:

the RMC discontinued all loop wheeled offerings last year. Anything produced in 2012 (and ss13) was not loopwheeled. The new collection is bringing back a loop wheeled sweat and a white loop wheeled tee,  probably because of retailer pressure. Those will be the only two loopwheeled items.

[Slowitchu]

So whats the real differences then between a Loopwheel and tube knit?

[S-Town]

The tubular knit is the construction (no side seams).  The loopwheeler is a more specific type of vintage tubular knitting machine.  Loopwheeled fabric shirts may or may not have side seams.  Non-loopwheeled fabric shirts may or may not have side seams.  Hence all the mystery, confusion, and discussion.

[garden gnomes in space]

Regarding Merz:

As far as I understand it they are trying to copy/replicate tees/undergarments from a specific area (Europe 1940/50, Army) and I'm sure they got the specs close to original (including machinery).

So far I have no wholes - but the sleeve ribs can fray. Especially, since the sleeve hem opening is quite narrow and the rip itself not very stretchy.

Whats your personal take on this Foxy?

 

 I come from the perspective that as much as I respect the period correct replica's,  i find it pointless to buy them when the cost/longevity ratio is so out of balance.  A $90 period correct tshirt is useless to me when it will not last 4 trips through the washing machine.  You know damn well nobody was spending the equivalent of today's $90 back then on t shirts.  

[Goominim]

Someone needs to make a definitive guide to loopwheeled shirts and post it as a website. It seems that 99% of us, including me, find it extremely esoteric.

 

Most of our favorite shirts and sweats aren't loopwheeled, so why does everyone give two shits?

 

I love my LVC Tees and never really cared if they were loopwheeled or not. I hope they aren't, 'cos it's just pretentious bullshit.

Edited September 6, 2013 by Goominim

[Broark]

I dunno if it's pretentious bullshit but some people just find the construction of fabrics interesting. Especially when it comes to the loopwheel machine, considering how old they are and how they produce really interesting and unique fabric. You could possibly say the same thing about old selvedge looms if you look at it the way you're suggesting, just because we're discussing construction doesn't mean it's pretentious. Just my two cents.

[S-Town]

I agree Broark!  It's really hard to consider it pretentious when 99.9% of the general public doesn't have any clue about the construction of our clothes, and 99.9999999999999% doesn't give a fuck about the construction of our clothes.  We all have our motives for what we do, but showing off loopwheeled or selvedge goods to the world isn't it.  At least I hope not, because you will be disappointed in the public response.

[garden gnomes in space]

im interested pretty much exclusively for the construction method, period.  I am not convinced that loop-wheeled shirts are more durable, better, or produce a nicer feeling fabric etc..  

Edited September 6, 2013 by garden gnomes in space

[Broark]

I'm not sure if the loopwheel machines produce nicer or more durable fabric, but from my experience they produce a more irregular and more interesting looking and feeling fabric.  My Tezomeya shirts have little slubs and irregularities all over them and I think it makes them a little unique.

[coleslawyum]

Loopwheeled fabric is more interesting, in my opinion, as much as old shuttle loomed denim is interesting. However, the fabric isn't anything to write home about if the cotton wasn't interesting to start off with. The combination of both these factors as well as dyeing methods, makes for a overall more interesting fabric. How can a garment constructed with cotton thread and rusted buttons be more durable than a polyester fabric, poly thread, and stainless button garment? Its not.

 

Regarding loopwheeled fabric, the difference is noticeable, but whether or not its better than non-loopwheeled is relative to what a person is looking for.

[S-Town]

Sorry to segregate the population, but this is a question for the bigger fellers (5'10"+, 185lbs+). What brands have you had the most luck with, in terms of fit. And not borderline fit, but a comfortable one. Verifiable loopwheel aside, Barns, Iron Heart, and FilMelange stick out as legit options. What else have you guys come across?

[Goominim]

I dunno if it's pretentious bullshit but some people just find the construction of fabrics interesting. Especially when it comes to the loopwheel machine, considering how old they are and how they produce really interesting and unique fabric. You could possibly say the same thing about old selvedge looms if you look at it the way you're suggesting, just because we're discussing construction doesn't mean it's pretentious. Just my two cents.

 

honestly, i have some deadstock 501 shrink-to-fit from the '80s and early '90s that rival any selvedge denim i've bought.

 

loopwheel just needs a definitive guide to demystify and educate the fans. i have a suspicion that even the long-time followers of loopwheel don't really know what's going on.

[Broark]

I agree with you on the definitive guide aspect, but I think it's pretty difficult considering there isn't a very easy way to identify them.

S-town: I've had good luck with Flat Head THC series and Tezomeya.

I've had my eye on some Barnes and Filmelange shirts but haven't pulled the trigger yet.

I'm 6'3", 215.

[Goominim]

there isn't a very easy way to identify them.

 

that cracks me up

[Broark]

Aside from irregularities in the weave of the fabric and some really close examination it is kind of difficult to identify. Don't really see what's so funny.

[S-Town]

^

Broark, so with your beautiful girthiness, what size do you wear in TFH shirts? I tried a 44 once, and it felt like a straight jacket!

The biggest Tezomeya look good though. And their colors are awesome; subtle, with nothing forced.

And in my opinion, the mystery of loopwheel is what makes it such a fun topic to discuss.

[Foxy2]

Whats your personal take on this Foxy?

 

 I come from the perspective that as much as I respect the period correct replica's,  i find it pointless to buy them when the cost/longevity ratio is so out of balance.  A $90 period correct tshirt is useless to me when it will not last 4 trips through the washing machine.  You know damn well nobody was spending the equivalent of today's $90 back then on t shirts.

I understand where you're coming from.

I expect the same basic performance and durability from Merz as I do from any standard tee - but I don't think that there is guaranteed ratio between retail price and performance/durability (e.g. the more you pay the better product).

So far, all my Merz b. Schwanen tees (I own 4 or 5) have managed way more than 10 washing cycles without falling apart or having holes (I don't wear belts on a regular basis) - the issue with the sleeve hem/rib didn't really surprise me and I'm sure, if I would have returned it to the shop I would have been refunded appropriately. However, I chose not to return it.

What I like about Merz b. Schwanen:

- fit (depending on the size you choose)

- pattern construction (especially the sleeve set-in)

- length (they are longer than some)

- sleeve width (slim and narrow)

- detail trimmings

- colors

- the cotton quality and weight (not too heavy, not too light)

- made in Germany/Europe

- they are made on old equipment

I like the idea that old machinery from 1920 or 1940 is still operating instead of getting scrapped...

[Broark]

^

Broark, so with your beautiful girthiness, what size do you wear in TFH shirts? I tried a 44 once, and it felt like a straight jacket!

The biggest Tezomeya look good though. And their colors are awesome; subtle, with nothing forced.

And in my opinion, the mystery of loopwheel is what makes it such a fun topic to discuss.

I have two FH in a size 46 (fits like a 44). They're definitely not super tight, but overall I like the fit a lot. The fabric is quite heavy so I don't wear them too much in the summer here in Texas.

I have the Tezomeya tees in the biggest size and I like the way they fit even more. They're a bit lighter and breathe better. Need to place an order on some more of those soon, as they take a little while to make.

[jung]

"With the help of a traditional knitwear manufacturer based in the German Swabian Mountains, vintage fashion aï¬cionado Peter Plotnicki revived the "old way of crafting clothes".

Driven by his passion for traditional fabrication processes, he and the team created a collection garments solely made by 1920s-1950s circular knitting machines. All tops are based on authentic working man's apparel ranging from the ï¬rst decades of the 20th century to army shirts of the sixties — some slightly modiï¬ed, some copied from the original piece down to the last seam.

Peter Plotnicki sets great store by the label "Made in Germany": the trimming's cotton fabrics, buttons, labels, hangtags, and packaging are German-made.

High quality traditional products — manufactured in Germany — without compromises!"

 

They don't use the term loopwheel over there. Look at the machines, the machines look like hanging loopwheel.

[jung]

Pulled from McCoy's thread:

 

 

So Superdenim, one of the few UK Stockists, are selling Real Mccoy sweats for £165 and falsely declaring them loopwheel.

[Double 0 Soul]

Groundhog day for the Loop thread again folks^

[Superblues]

So Superdenim, one of the few UK Stockists, are selling Real Mccoy sweats for £165 and falsely declaring them loopwheel.

Yep, it seems common for shops to describe non-loopwheeled clothing as loopwheeled. I wouldn't say the Superdenim shop is in the heart of this Japanese-workwear-whatever world (I'd say they don't care enough), but it's surprised me that even shops that are do it. If it's a case of them just making an error with the designation of the term, well, they ignore it when they know better and continue to falsely label stuff loopwheeled. It of course goes beyond error at that point and is just definitely, deliberately, misleading.

[Superblues]

I checked the measurements and also anticipated it thanks to the peerless advice of The Flat Head's Kyle, so the fit is fine for me, but that's a small size 42 in some ways. I might try to take more photos at some point; you know, wear it.

[S-Town]

I have two FH in a size 46 (fits like a 44). They're definitely not super tight, but overall I like the fit a lot. The fabric is quite heavy so I don't wear them too much in the summer here in Texas.

I have the Tezomeya tees in the biggest size and I like the way they fit even more. They're a bit lighter and breathe better. Need to place an order on some more of those soon, as they take a little while to make.

I wish the FH tees in 46 were more readily available in lots of colors and whatnot. The Tezomeya look pretty sweet. Where did you pick them up?

[HoustonChris]

Sorry to segregate the population, but this is a question for the bigger fellers (5'10"+, 185lbs+). What brands have you had the most luck with, in terms of fit. And not borderline fit, but a comfortable one. Verifiable loopwheel aside, Barns, Iron Heart, and FilMelange stick out as legit options. What else have you guys come across?

 

I'm 6'0", 180ish and I stick with Iron Heart (size Large), Triple Works (size Large) and Flat Head (size 44).  All are pretty comfortable, though I did buy a Flat Head "Wide Body" by mistake, and it's definitely loose fitting.  In fact, I plan on selling it when I finally get around to taking some pictures.