Leathercrafting Creations: PYC

[southfive]

you pay the bills with this stuff corter?

dunno if thats too personal, but im genuinely curious

[warhorseworkshop]

hiatus in posting. been busy.

[warhorseworkshop]

hiatus in posting. been busy.

[corter]

you pay the bills with this stuff corter?

dunno if thats too personal, but im genuinely curious

yep, I've never had another full time job-this has been it since late 2007~ish. It's not as easy as just making enough money though, I've simplified my life enough to make it work because it's what I love and want to do. We really don't talk about the business side of things much, but I'd really like to. Here's a few tips to people starting out that would have helped me a ton. I think it goes without saying that you've gotta be madly, passionately head-over-heels in love with your craft. If you're not, don't even bother trying to make it a full time gig.

-Simplify the hell out of your personal life and expenses, and make yourself at least a rough monthly expense sheet. The less you have to make, the easier it is to "make a living". When you work for yourself both your working and personal life becomes one, so make them fit each other like puzzle pieces. The most important thing is that I only buy what I can afford in cash, including in the business. No investors, partners, lenders- they're all stress and extra work and expense. I've got no car payments, credit cards, one small student loan paid off a year ahead incase of emergency, and live in my workshop. This allows me to write off half my rent on my taxes. I live close enough to a city to enjoy having the amenities and resources in walking/bike distance, but far enough out to keep rent low. Even things like $10/month netflix instead of $40/month cable tv will mean $360 less you have to bring in per year (maybe another week vacation time?).

-Learn how to value your time. Take that number from above and add in whatever extra you'd like to make per month to save/spend. Say like many recent grads you're looking for $40k/year to live your ideal lifestyle. that's $770 per week working 52 weeks a year. How much do you want to work? At 40 hours per week you value your time at $19.25, at 20 hours a week it's $38.50, so lets go with 20 hours per week. With lower life costs come lower business costs, and with lower prices on your products come more sales and more income. This also will help you weed out the good and bad ideas. Theoretical example: You may want to expand your line with a tote bag. However, the tote takes 5 hours to make and $40 in materials. 2($40)+5($38.50)= $272.50 sug. retail, but you can only compete at a $200 pricepoint. That means for every bag you make and sell directly to your customers (no room for wholesale here!), you need to put 2 extra hours of work into making your $40k/year goal. So if you sell just 10 totes, you've missed out on a whole week's worth of income. It may be much smarter and benificial to your company to expand your line with a $25 bracelet (still coming in under a competitive $30 pricepoint). Though it may seem like a way smaller addition, if you can make 15 an hour and sell them at a $20 profit, you'll actually make 10x your desired hourly wage.

-Use the internet. You can work from anywhere, reach people anywhere, and everything from your website to store front to advertising can be free on a small scale until you grow your business to need and be able to afford more elaborate setups.

- Wholesaling isn't fun. You either make twice as much product for the same amount of money (really less, being that your material cost doubles) or double your retail prices to make as much as you would selling directly to customers. YOu also loose control of your customer's experience with your company. Work with cool people and cool stores, but as an independent artisan it shouldn't be your first goal to make it to retail.

- Bring as few people into your business as possible. The more people involved, the more product it takes to be a profitable business.

The more people chime in, the more others can learn and help the global community of artisans grow and prosper. Now's a great time to be a maker, and I'd be interested to hear what everyone else does/thinks on this subject. I know a lot of you now sell online!

[corter]

you pay the bills with this stuff corter?

dunno if thats too personal, but im genuinely curious

yep, I've never had another full time job-this has been it since late 2007~ish. It's not as easy as just making enough money though, I've simplified my life enough to make it work because it's what I love and want to do. We really don't talk about the business side of things much, but I'd really like to. Here's a few tips to people starting out that would have helped me a ton. I think it goes without saying that you've gotta be madly, passionately head-over-heels in love with your craft. If you're not, don't even bother trying to make it a full time gig.

-Simplify the hell out of your personal life and expenses, and make yourself at least a rough monthly expense sheet. The less you have to make, the easier it is to "make a living". When you work for yourself both your working and personal life becomes one, so make them fit each other like puzzle pieces. The most important thing is that I only buy what I can afford in cash, including in the business. No investors, partners, lenders- they're all stress and extra work and expense. I've got no car payments, credit cards, one small student loan paid off a year ahead incase of emergency, and live in my workshop. This allows me to write off half my rent on my taxes. I live close enough to a city to enjoy having the amenities and resources in walking/bike distance, but far enough out to keep rent low. Even things like $10/month netflix instead of $40/month cable tv will mean $360 less you have to bring in per year (maybe another week vacation time?).

-Learn how to value your time. Take that number from above and add in whatever extra you'd like to make per month to save/spend. Say like many recent grads you're looking for $40k/year to live your ideal lifestyle. that's $770 per week working 52 weeks a year. How much do you want to work? At 40 hours per week you value your time at $19.25, at 20 hours a week it's $38.50, so lets go with 20 hours per week. With lower life costs come lower business costs, and with lower prices on your products come more sales and more income. This also will help you weed out the good and bad ideas. Theoretical example: You may want to expand your line with a tote bag. However, the tote takes 5 hours to make and $40 in materials. 2($40)+5($38.50)= $272.50 sug. retail, but you can only compete at a $200 pricepoint. That means for every bag you make and sell directly to your customers (no room for wholesale here!), you need to put 2 extra hours of work into making your $40k/year goal. So if you sell just 10 totes, you've missed out on a whole week's worth of income. It may be much smarter and benificial to your company to expand your line with a $25 bracelet (still coming in under a competitive $30 pricepoint). Though it may seem like a way smaller addition, if you can make 15 an hour and sell them at a $20 profit, you'll actually make 10x your desired hourly wage.

-Use the internet. You can work from anywhere, reach people anywhere, and everything from your website to store front to advertising can be free on a small scale until you grow your business to need and be able to afford more elaborate setups.

- Wholesaling isn't fun. You either make twice as much product for the same amount of money (really less, being that your material cost doubles) or double your retail prices to make as much as you would selling directly to customers. YOu also loose control of your customer's experience with your company. Work with cool people and cool stores, but as an independent artisan it shouldn't be your first goal to make it to retail.

- Bring as few people into your business as possible. The more people involved, the more product it takes to be a profitable business.

The more people chime in, the more others can learn and help the global community of artisans grow and prosper. Now's a great time to be a maker, and I'd be interested to hear what everyone else does/thinks on this subject. I know a lot of you now sell online!

[ihatebrianwilliams]

Thanks for sharing that with us Corter. Nice to see and hear some financial responsibility in a world of credit and loans. It is so great when someone can make a living doing what they love.

Leather for me is a great hobby, gets me out of the house (even if its just in the garage). I have a great sense of satisfaction when I finish something. I have had daydreams of starting a business while I work. Would love to hear how some of you other guys make it work.

[ihatebrianwilliams]

Thanks for sharing that with us Corter. Nice to see and hear some financial responsibility in a world of credit and loans. It is so great when someone can make a living doing what they love.

Leather for me is a great hobby, gets me out of the house (even if its just in the garage). I have a great sense of satisfaction when I finish something. I have had daydreams of starting a business while I work. Would love to hear how some of you other guys make it work.

[zissou]

Brian, I started selling on Etsy, and it has treated me well. The best thing was having a few items featured on blogs, which I think brings in most of the traffic. The income has given me some money for clothes or home improvements without having to dip into my paycheck or savings.

My advice for anyone wanting to sell something is to just take it slowly. Honestly, it took me about a year of making goods for friends before I was truly happy with my items and felt like selling them to other people. Still, there is always more room for improvement, better leathers, etc.

I'm definitely not as into it (or as brave) as Corter, but then again, I have a mortgage and young child. I enjoy my day job, and it has great benefits. So, leather goods will always just be a hobby for me.

Also, be selective as to what you make. I don't make every little thing that people ask me to. Any time someone asks me to make a wallet, I just send them to Hollows or Corter, depending on what they want. I also don't make iPhone or ipad cases, because there are a million other options out there.

The couple times I've done wholesale, I've pretty much regretted it for the reasons Corter mentioned. I hate making 20 of the same exact thing. Although, there is something to be said for the efficiency of assembly line production.

[zissou]

Brian, I started selling on Etsy, and it has treated me well. The best thing was having a few items featured on blogs, which I think brings in most of the traffic. The income has given me some money for clothes or home improvements without having to dip into my paycheck or savings.

My advice for anyone wanting to sell something is to just take it slowly. Honestly, it took me about a year of making goods for friends before I was truly happy with my items and felt like selling them to other people. Still, there is always more room for improvement, better leathers, etc.

I'm definitely not as into it (or as brave) as Corter, but then again, I have a mortgage and young child. I enjoy my day job, and it has great benefits. So, leather goods will always just be a hobby for me.

Also, be selective as to what you make. I don't make every little thing that people ask me to. Any time someone asks me to make a wallet, I just send them to Hollows or Corter, depending on what they want. I also don't make iPhone or ipad cases, because there are a million other options out there.

The couple times I've done wholesale, I've pretty much regretted it for the reasons Corter mentioned. I hate making 20 of the same exact thing. Although, there is something to be said for the efficiency of assembly line production.

[corter]

Zissou, speaking the truth for sure. I was lucky enough to get into it before life started, so to speak, so I'm very lucky that the real expenses hadn't happened yet.

I think the craziest aspect about the business end of things, at least online, is that product markets can be tested almost instantly. Some of the stuff I design takes months, but some- like the Japan bracelets-went from concept to product available for purchase in a matter of minutes. Design something, make a prototype, post it either in forums, tweet it, tumble it, facebook, etc- it's so easy to get your ideas in front of thousands of people these days. Regardless of how you're trying to make a living, you've got built in markets on specific forums basically telling you what they need, and the voids that can be filled. You can build a reputation in a matter of days, and get tons of business in weeks. The benefit, as I said earlier, is it's all free. Besides your prototype, you risk nothing.

[corter]

Zissou, speaking the truth for sure. I was lucky enough to get into it before life started, so to speak, so I'm very lucky that the real expenses hadn't happened yet.

I think the craziest aspect about the business end of things, at least online, is that product markets can be tested almost instantly. Some of the stuff I design takes months, but some- like the Japan bracelets-went from concept to product available for purchase in a matter of minutes. Design something, make a prototype, post it either in forums, tweet it, tumble it, facebook, etc- it's so easy to get your ideas in front of thousands of people these days. Regardless of how you're trying to make a living, you've got built in markets on specific forums basically telling you what they need, and the voids that can be filled. You can build a reputation in a matter of days, and get tons of business in weeks. The benefit, as I said earlier, is it's all free. Besides your prototype, you risk nothing.

[hollowsleather]

Interesting conversation in here today.

I especially agree with the notion that crafting (at least the way we're doing it, sans employees and machinery) can only be done for a living if you're willing to pare your life down to the bare bones.

Beans and rice, thrift stores, split rent, and bike rides make me happy, so it works. If I had a car, kids, debt, mortgage, or anything like that I doubt that I could get by, though I would definitely still be making things as a hobby.

Another important aspect, I think, is knowing the difference between loving something, and loving the idea of it. It's really easy to love the idea of working from home and making cool stuff all day, but the reality is that it's still work. You have to love the work itself, and not just the idea of being a maker.

[hollowsleather]

Interesting conversation in here today.

I especially agree with the notion that crafting (at least the way we're doing it, sans employees and machinery) can only be done for a living if you're willing to pare your life down to the bare bones.

Beans and rice, thrift stores, split rent, and bike rides make me happy, so it works. If I had a car, kids, debt, mortgage, or anything like that I doubt that I could get by, though I would definitely still be making things as a hobby.

Another important aspect, I think, is knowing the difference between loving something, and loving the idea of it. It's really easy to love the idea of working from home and making cool stuff all day, but the reality is that it's still work. You have to love the work itself, and not just the idea of being a maker.

[t.wayne]

interesting conversation indeed.

i'll try to play devils advocate for a sec:

mostly everyone seems to agree on the bare bones lifestyle, which makes me curious. is that mainly because the margins for leather crafting are just not large enough to support any other lifestyle? or is it more a mindset that you guys find to be essential?

what about companies like tanner goods? they just opened their new flagship shop and it doesn't seem like they would share the same mentality. maybe makr would fall in the same category?

*disclaimer: i don't actually know any of the tanner goods guys personally, so i have no way of knowing what their business strategies or leather crafting philosophies are

[t.wayne]

interesting conversation indeed.

i'll try to play devils advocate for a sec:

mostly everyone seems to agree on the bare bones lifestyle, which makes me curious. is that mainly because the margins for leather crafting are just not large enough to support any other lifestyle? or is it more a mindset that you guys find to be essential?

what about companies like tanner goods? they just opened their new flagship shop and it doesn't seem like they would share the same mentality. maybe makr would fall in the same category?

*disclaimer: i don't actually know any of the tanner goods guys personally, so i have no way of knowing what their business strategies or leather crafting philosophies are

[zissou]

I think pretty much any business in which it is one person making goods by hand will either have small profit margins or small quantities. Even higher end goods, like shoes, can only be produced in a small quantity by one person. Think of Julian of Julian Boots- every time I see photos of the guy, he's wearing the same outfit of clothes. Maybe it's a choice, but I doubt he's rolling in dough.

As for Tanner Goods, I believe it's a few guys, and they've been fortunate enough to have great marketing and/or visibility. Loads of retail shops carry their belts at least. In my opinion, and I apologize for stepping on anyone's toes, the hardware they use is relatively inexpensive, and it looks like relatively little time is put into construction (e.g., a couple of snaps instead of stitching, wire keeper instead of leather keeper, etc.). That said, they produce large quantities at wholesale prices, have a few guys working there, and now have a shop to pay for. So, I doubt they're rolling in dough either.

Bottom line? I doubt any one person is getting rich off of making belts themselves.

[zissou]

I think pretty much any business in which it is one person making goods by hand will either have small profit margins or small quantities. Even higher end goods, like shoes, can only be produced in a small quantity by one person. Think of Julian of Julian Boots- every time I see photos of the guy, he's wearing the same outfit of clothes. Maybe it's a choice, but I doubt he's rolling in dough.

As for Tanner Goods, I believe it's a few guys, and they've been fortunate enough to have great marketing and/or visibility. Loads of retail shops carry their belts at least. In my opinion, and I apologize for stepping on anyone's toes, the hardware they use is relatively inexpensive, and it looks like relatively little time is put into construction (e.g., a couple of snaps instead of stitching, wire keeper instead of leather keeper, etc.). That said, they produce large quantities at wholesale prices, have a few guys working there, and now have a shop to pay for. So, I doubt they're rolling in dough either.

Bottom line? I doubt any one person is getting rich off of making belts themselves.

[corter]

It all depends on what you want for your business. The reason most artisans don't make a full time living with their craft, or make a meager living and live sparingly, is because they don't actually study the business side of their business. Look at Arrow Mocs- the dude won't raise his prices, won't expand, even after working with some huge names. He could be right up there with Quoddy right now if he wanted to be. 50% of your knowledge as an artisan business owner HAS to be in business, or the things you make won't sell in the best way. You've gotta know the business end as much or more than your hand craft, and you can 100% make a killing with your craft regardless of what it is. As they say, there are many ways to skin a cat.

Say Tanner brings in $350k gross sales a year. Theoretically, about $75-100k is spent on materials, so we'll go $80k. $25k on equipment/websites/maintenance/insurance/misc. Then at least $25k on rent of their retail space, and $20k on packaging/supplies/etc. Say the owners have 3-4 people working full time, so figure $30k each for that if they're paid the average garment-producer salary. you've got $70k left over- after taxes, that's around $55k a year.

Now, say you're an independent leathersmith running a small business. No employees, no wholesale, all straight-to-customer sales- you make double what Tanner does per item, and you need to make half of the gross sales- thus, you need to make what one of their hired artisans does per year, average. To make the same $70k, you've gotta do about $120k in sales. Say you average $100 per sale, that means 1,200 sales a year, or about 3 sales a day. Granted, some people will buy $300 worth of belts, wallets, and card holders in one swipe, and some will buy a $20 bracelet, so give and/or take. You've got $30k in materials/supplies, $10k in packaging/supplies/tools, and $1k in web, and $9k in space rental. You have no employees, no store overhead, no boss, no retailers requesting specific products,nothing- just an online retail space that anyone in the world can visit.

It's all a choice of what you want to do. You can embrace the internet and keep your overhead very low, raising profit margins 200% or more selling direct , or you can go the traditional route and bring on more people and run a bigger production to make the same after covering your overhead. The "online artisan" is new, but look at Johnny Cupcakes- $4mil in sales with one retail store, mostly online, in 2009. No stockists, nothing. You're creating jobs, yes, but if your goal is to make things for a living and be able to support yourself, being independent is probably the quickest way to get there.

Regarding there being money in leather goods, again- it all depends on your business model. There's money in almost anything if you figure out how to make it work, and I think our generation is the first to be able to use the internet to multiply that 10 fold. I live sparingly~ish because I'm young and have just always done that- I've never owned a car, never had a credit card. That's why I was able to make this my full time job so early on.

[spy]

Loving the conversation in here.

For what it's worth, I'm currently working a part time job and using this as supplementary income, but I'm thinking of embracing this as a fulltime, career venture. At the moment, I'm working on getting my stuff out there, because as good as it looks online, it's different when people have it in their hands. That's why i'm working on doing deals with a few local stores, such as Wilderness Workshop and maybe Stels. While I know i'll be making less per piece, I'll be able to get more brand recognition by having my pieces in these stores.

This is all granted I'm making mostly bags. Wallets and belts are more the thing of you guys here on the thread, looking at you for Boston corter, haha. That being said, I needed to bump up my retail pricing because the material cost is higher per bag than per wallet. It might cost me 60-100 to make a bag that I will sell at 250-350. Now that I'm going into retail, my prices per piece will have to go up to closer to 400. Also, seeing as my bags are all handmade, I've found most people who can actually touch these things are quick to realize the value of them, especially since I'm using a great thread (tandy linen threads) and usually all solid brass hardware. I'm hoping I can continue to expand into a few stores and get some publicity and at the same time begin to attract more customers online.

The most difficult part for me now is getting my initial, visible customers who can really help spread the word about my work.

[Goombi]

Thanks for sharing all the great info with us!

Props especially to corter for being so financially responsible.

Inspired to use my day off next week to hit up my local Tandy's. Now I need to search this thread for the posts that list what to start up with.

A quick question: When doing prototypes for new pieces (ex. bags) do you try out the pattern and fit using muslin? Or something sturdier like denim?

[spy]

A quick question: When doing prototypes for new pieces (ex. bags) do you try out the pattern and fit using muslin? Or something sturdier like denim?

I just get down in the shop and start sewing things up. I'm pretty good at making something that I'm imagining come together without too much planing or templating. However, sometimes I like to make a miniture when dealing with new constructions. See my little mini mailbag compared to my large one on the page previous for an example of this.

At this point I've made enough bags to really just be able to throw them together in a few hours, since thats what I'm concentrating on mostly. It's a lot to handsew, but I find it to be worth it.

[ihatebrianwilliams]

A quick question: When doing prototypes for new pieces (ex. bags) do you try out the pattern and fit using muslin? Or something sturdier like denim?

I use a paper grocery bag and scotch tape. But I make small stuff.

[patrick_b]

where in Boston are you Spy? I'm up here to! are you the gent Rob at Tandy was telling me about?

I've been to that Tandy in Chelmsford!

Eric I had an interesting incident in ME recently. I live in Newburyport, MA & was up at Portland Dry Goods in Portland. The owner/mgr (not sure) was showing me the leather goods and was describing this great leather craftsman from Boston who had just delivered these (very familiar looking) wallets and belts.

I pulled out my Corter Slim Card Case and said, "you're talking about Corter Leather." We got a kick out of the fact that I had one of your items in my pocket. Everything looked great and you clearly have a fan at Portland Dry Goods! I'm loving my little wallet/card case as well. I'll have to pick up a belt this summer too, so if you see an order for Newburyport...that's me.

Great discussion about handcrafted goods. I'm enjoying it.

[corter]

Loving the conversation in here.

It might cost me 60-100 to make a bag that I will sell at 250-350. Now that I'm going into retail, my prices per piece will have to go up to closer to 400. .

Retail or wholesale? Both of those stores sell canvas bags that cost more haha.

The thing with that is, say you bump up your retail to $400. That means they'll want the bags around $180 to mark them up 2.2x. Even if they pay $200 per, you're making about $120 per bag. Not sure how fast you are, but bags take me anywhere from 12-18 hours to make by hand, so that's right around minimum wage salary for ya. Because of the price, they'll probably sell well- so what happens when you get stores that want monthly restocks? You're stuck making $8-10/hour full time, because you can't just up and say "Ok, so my bags are $400 wholesale now".

Just be careful. The worst mistake you can make is to try and start a business before you know how to, because you're shaping the perception of your company from the first day you interact with anyone in the business. Your stuff is great, but read some business books, maybe take a class or two on retail in the fashion world.

[corter]

I've been to that Tandy in Chelmsford!

Eric I had an interesting incident in ME recently. I live in Newburyport, MA & was up at Portland Dry Goods in Portland. The owner/mgr (not sure) was showing me the leather goods and was describing this great leather craftsman from Boston who had just delivered these (very familiar looking) wallets and belts.

I pulled out my Corter Slim Card Case and said, "you're talking about Corter Leather." We got a kick out of the fact that I had one of your items in my pocket. Everything looked great and you clearly have a fan at Portland Dry Goods! I'm loving my little wallet/card case as well. I'll have to pick up a belt this summer too, so if you see an order for Newburyport...that's me.

Great discussion about handcrafted goods. I'm enjoying it.

Kazeem? Hes a trip man, called me at 7:45 yesterday morning haha. Really great dude, super nice, and he's made quite a little store for himself there. Next time I'm up in Newburyport I'll have to let you know!

Speaking of bags, here's the final production tote. Been working on the design a lot, and it's finally ready!

[hollowsleather]

Eric you pretty much summed up why I don't make large bags without a machine. I could do it by hand, but in order to make any money off of it, I'd have to charge like $600. I don't want to be that guy that makes the $600 bags.

Is that a cloth tag I spy on the tote? That's pretty cool. Did you end up changing your logo like you had mentioned?

[spy]

Good point Eric. Maybe we can meet up together in Boston some time, ill bring a piece with me. The only thing I'm trying to do is not charge too too much, otherwise I won't make any sales.

Since I focus on bags, I've.gotten quick at putting them up. The mail bag 2 pages ago only took about 6 hours start to finish. If they sold for 450 or 500 I would be making about 300 give or take, which puts me in a good position, after materials I'm at 35 an hour or so.

I'll talk.more.later. this is a lot to type on a smartphone

[spy]

Good point Eric. Maybe we can meet up together in Boston some time, ill bring a piece with me. The only thing I'm trying to do is not charge too too much, otherwise I won't make any sales.

Since I focus on bags, I've.gotten quick at putting them up. The mail bag 2 pages ago only took about 6 hours start to finish. If they sold for 450 or 500 I would be making about 300 give or take, which puts me in a good position, after materials I'm at 35 an hour or so.

I'll talk.more.later. this is a lot to type on a smartphone

[corter]

Eric you pretty much summed up why I don't make large bags without a machine. I could do it by hand, but in order to make any money off of it, I'd have to charge like $600. I don't want to be that guy that makes the $600 bags.

Is that a cloth tag I spy on the tote? That's pretty cool. Did you end up changing your logo like you had mentioned?

In my opinion, $600 is almost too little for a hand sewn full leather bag. Maybe wholesale? J.Crew's machine sewn stuff is $450, and those are made in factories overseas. I understand most of our business is the forum crowd that wants to pay half price, but in the retail world, you'd be looking at an easy $1,500-$2000 for the same bag, and they'd be nice enough to sell for sure!

The tag is veg. tanned leather- 3 or 4 oz I think? These were stamped before the stamp failure, so they'll have the old logo. Redesigning this summer, everything's going to be unbranded for a while so the tags will just be leather tags, no logo.

Spy- As I said, if they sell for $450-500 retail, you'd be getting paid $200-225~ish wholesale from the shops. Direct-to-customer might be fine, and If you can work with that profit margin wholesale, that's great! But in the $450-500 price range, you're mostly looking at machine sewn bags and canvas bags. You'll never find a bag under $1k from a larger company that's full leather, the size of yours, and completely hand stitched in the USA. At the $450-500 mark you're still in canvas duffel territory. It seems like you're fairly new to this, just getting your teeth so-to-speak. A solid full leather bag will absolutely sell at $600, because you're underpricing the market by half, if not more. You just need to take the time to design and produce a bag that people want to buy.

[TheBlackGoat]

Eric you pretty much summed up why I don't make large bags without a machine. I could do it by hand, but in order to make any money off of it, I'd have to charge like $600. I don't want to be that guy that makes the $600 bags.

Is that a cloth tag I spy on the tote? That's pretty cool. Did you end up changing your logo like you had mentioned?

Agreed, leather bags out of veg tan leather gets expensive...its atleast 4 to 6 sqft of material. And if your using good stuff that's about $50 in leather in leather..and hardware...now your looking at another $15 to$ 25. Then if your do a standard 10% markup on material plus account for waste material from cutting. It gets expensive.

Corter, bag looks great!!!

To the subject of turning leather into a business. You have to love the process and not the idea of it, like a few of you said. I have been making stuff for years. And I am only now ready I feel to turn it into a biz. I. Have spent a lot of time designing and perfecting my craft. I am trying to offer somthing different. That is why I have started using different leathers and trying to make designs based on my own tastes while still keeping japanese leather craft methods.

Anyways my website should be up in a month or so. I will post and link to it when it is done. I would love any comments or suggestions when it happens. I love this thread! Its the only place on the internet that people make stuff that's cool.

I get back from Vegas on Saturday, I will start making the tutorial on Monday and should have the it done by Friday and will offer the pattern to anyone who wants it......okay now back to partying