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phaseCOMPLETE

Graffiti Saved My Life

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THE MASTER GRAFFITI THREAD - post ALL graffiti-related comments here.

Based on how many people came out of the woodwork for Bobby Hundreds hardcore thread, i was kinda curious how many people on Superfuture came out of the graffiti scene. Seems like half the graphic designers I meet these days started as writers, which probably makes sense since both are about letter form and communicating a message. Also seeing as how graffiti has played such a large role in "street art", as well as fashion, how many people here we're actually caught up with it at some point.

Another interesting thing to debate is where is graffiti culture going? Seems like graff was getting a lot more hype in the 90's when kids in the Bronx we're doing block long murals with kids from Europe and there were at least a dozen graff mags out. I don't doubt that it's much bigger these days when you consider that there's actually paint companies that cater to writers specifically, and how related scenes and industries have grown so huge in the last 5 or so years. It just seems like graffiti is still sort of flying under the radar which is kind of weird when at the same time there's been a street art explosion. Does anyone see graffiti legitimizing itself over time the way skating has, and turn into an industry unto itself?

Anyhow, just curious where people's opinions lie if they have one.

the next time i have to talk to you, you wont be alive enough to hear it

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yeah man, thats true..i started off when i was 13. first tagging with markers.. then doing throw-ups. with 14 i did my first e-2-e in daytime..but after getting busted with 18, i took it slow.. but definitely graffiti or hip-hop in general captured my youth. (not the bling shit, but the b-boy stuff, breakdancing, going to jams by train as a youngster through whole germany,sleeping in some trainstation, bombing trains, recking cans, doing sketches in school, falling asleep in school cause done trains in the night).

so i am really thankful to this culture, cause it gave me one of the best times of my life..

i remember stealing the henry cooper book, subway art, from a book store, when i was 13.

i didnt even understand the english text. but i remember the smell of each page. it was like magic. i got fascinated and obsessed with it. i learned how to do sketches from there, then got some mags, where i learned more about nyc legends like dondi (my favourite), t-kid, etc. the whole old school thing. then with 17 went to ny, just to see a real subway. i was overwhelmed by the vibe. i saw tags from legends all over the place, although 97 the grafiti boom already was over and not too much was to be seen in ny. we went to seens shop.

it was a great time, with great memories, met great people, made good friends..

i used to love her..

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i was into it for about 10 years or so, but even now, if i get a hold of a pen or marker, i'm writing over everything (or when i get out of the shower and can catch steam tags on the mirror). i think that graff has already been legtimized...at least by the art/design world. starting with futura and phase 2 (i looked at dude's books in my public library when i was 13), and now with twist, espo, reas, and kaws in the us and people like delta elsewhere. as far as the legal aspect...i hope nobody ever legitimizes it...it's vandalism.

RHFIV

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It's kind of funny how you sort of forget how big names in the art/hipster world, are actually writers. Or at least started out as such. Names like Kaws and Futura are so huge, but people sort of forget about the origins of it all and instead have been focusing on the latest vinyl toy or hard to get garment.

I wonder what ever happened to all the magazines. Back in the early and mid 90's there were dozens of them. I remember the thrill of flipping through mags like 12 Ounce Prophet or Under Cover for the first time. Now you don't really see too many, and the ones you do see are mostly euro mags showing people few have ever heard of. Shit used to be exciting, and people we're really pushing the form to new levels. Seemed like there were a lot of superstars that were always on the verge of really blowing up big. (I guess the finally did, hence Futura, Kaws, Espo, Reas, etc). Back in those days kids like Os Gemeos were these undiscovered writers featured in some graff mag, and now you see them doing world tours and sneakers with Nike. Not that I got anything against it, but it seems like graffiti got raped by everyone and then shoved to the side or something.

Anyone think that with street art blowing up the way it is, and fashion always looking to appropriate the flavor of the month, we'll see a resurgence or maybe even an evolution of the sport? Ecko's been advertising a video game based on graffiti, and we've seen it creep into a ton of other games for the last couple years. I'm just kind of wondering if we're about to see it all blow up and become more main stream the way everything esle around it has. Not sure I want to see writers on the cover of Wheaties boxes, but it does seem like graffiti is due to come into it's own in a big way sometime soon.

the next time i have to talk to you, you wont be alive enough to hear it

Edited by phaseCOMPLETE on Jun 15, 2005 at 09:47 AM

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I am an outsider here, since I have no experience with graffiti (and no respect for tags either, sorry).

anyway, I really have a very large amount of respect for graffiti artist. Some of the work done is absolutly incredible, and hard to believe can be done with a spraycan. I think many taggers give real graffiti artist a bad rep.

Anyway, I love how many old graffiti artist are kind of changing lanes to the modern art scene, because they bring such a freshness and completly new vibe to the art, which has been, in my oppinion, much needed in the art scene.

Go graf artist!

(I do enjoy actual images painting with spraycan, and enjoy the lettering part of it less. But both sides very talented.)

Edited by Marcus on Jun 15, 2005 at 02:31 PM

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I was never into tagging (don't like to ruin others property), but I've loved it since like 7th grade. Pastor (from philly) is probably my favorite artist- I remember I emailed him one day and he actually took time out to respond to my whitebread, 8th grade self.

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yo guys, dont judge stuff you dont know shit about...

for a writer it all comes down to style in the end of the day.

so its possible that some extra-weird five million colors 3-d realisitic piece (what some may call art) is not as good as simple tag or throw up. its the boogie down vibe you need. we call it style. a aimple tag with style may be more worth than some huge wall piece.

some "artist" may do great paintings, but he doesnt get the reputation for being a writer. cause a writer writes his name, by tags, or throw ups or pieces, on murals, on trains etc.

artists paint. on canvas or maybe some walls (when they have permission to).

so if some artist can make some paintings with a can, but he cant tag, i dont accept him as graffiti writer, since he has never learned the basics.

but i respect that a lot of hardcore guys go into art and make their living out of it, but those guys know where they come from..(e.g: cope2 being the ultimate bomber).

besides i like the graphic side of it, also the street art. or what delta does..btw he always was great in letters..

i appreciate the art stuff, and i accept that those guys do have real skillz.

but that doesnt give anybody the right to look down on real graffiti writers, or to judge them or treat them like criminals.

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its been a while since ive been here. i cant even remember my orignal name and pw. lol

i was introduced to graffiti back in middle school. i was all about the four elements back then. ha! times are changing, i guess

anyway, graffiti looks like its always been "ok" to be plastered everywhere. but then again the recent explosion seems like a trend so i dont think itll stay for long.

i agree with juxtaposed. you arent a vandal if you only do permission work.

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handstyles can be every bit as ill, if not more than, pieces. actually, most of the time i like looking at nice hands or throwies over pieces. you gotta respect dudes who bomb hard. here are some of my faves as examples (just to name a few):

dc- cast, ultra, cram

philly- nemel, dasar, kadism

rva- forse, rcade

nyc- sacer, earsnot

RHFIV

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This thread finally convinced me to end my lurking days and register for a name.

I stopped writing a couple of years ago, after I had been at it for almost 5. I just reached a point where I felt the risks substantially outweighed the enjoyment I received. While I was (and still am) sad to have left that part of my life, graffiti continues to influence my day-to-day life. Hell, I'm still convinced that I'm going to total my car eventually while staring at either side of the freeway and driving 80 mph. I love being able to drive next to a train yard and peer inside for glimpses of pieces or streaks, and the sound of a train rumbling by in the night sends me back to nights in the yard.

I still try to stay up on the scene as well as I possibly can by visiting graffiti websites and purchasing the occasional magazine (still can't be beat IMO as pooping-n-reading material). I know someone in here mentioned Subway Art as a favorite book - I echo that sentiment. ESPO's 'The Art of Getting Over' is also up there. As far as magazines, 12 oz Prophet has always been my favorite, as they consistently knocked out top-notch shit. I haven't seen anything from them recently, but hopefully they haven't stopped completely.

phaseCOMPLETE asked whether graffiti will ever legitimize itself like skating has. I doubt it. I see the current 'trend' of graffiti as just that - corporate America latching on to another 'cool' 'hip' fad that they think teenagers will associate with. This too shall pass, if for no other reason than the fact that true graffiti is usually a felony.

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i remember when.........

saint tmr owned the LIE

JA owned every bridge, from billburg to manhattan

GHOST SANE SMITH ruled the subway tunnels and elevated platforms.....

I owned all the mailbox in my neighborhood

www.wellbred.org

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ABEL FUCKED MADONNA. (Shouts to Cost + Revs).

Definite shouts to JA. On ups (and consistency) alone, king forever.

Queens: CRISIS, STIZ, NEAR, SIE, BOE, KW, infamous SAINT

Wall of Fame originators, esp. GAZE, SUB... O.G. HAZE.

gritty city circa early 90's: 357 + 5x7 croos, dem run tings.

Who knows the Queensbound 7 train view as it came out of the tunnel from Vernon/Jackson ave? whaaat!?!?! Too many repped to name. The illest yard, on some 2047 next level shit.

~multiflavored RodLavers~

http://abelnyc.com

ALPHA/BRAVO/ECHO/LIMA

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Quote: Who knows the Queensbound 7 train view as it came out of the tunnel from Vernon/Jackson ave? whaaat!?!?! Too many repped to name. The illest yard, on some 2047 next level shit.

NATO owned the 7 line for a while back i nteh early 90s.........

MOD AIC!!!!!WHAT WHAT!!!!!!

www.wellbred.org

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Anyhow, getting back on topic, does anyone know whatever happened to all the graff magazines? What ever happened to Video Graf? For a while people we're saying they were going to start it back up, but it's been years since I've seen anything from them. Last decent video I saw was State Your Name which came out kind of recently. There's been a few books out, but it seems like mostly stuff from Europe. Mainly the most graff i see these days, besides the streets, seems to be in video games, and the occassional lame marketing campaign. I think the only existing graffiti clothing company is Writers Bench, and I can't remember seeing anything new from them in a long ass time either if they're even around. Anyne know whatever happened to that Vapors Project magazine. Now that was a fresh graff magazine with potential. Never saw a second issue though.

So that kind brings me back to ther question of what the hell happened to that whole scene? How come when so much of what's in the spotlight now seems to have grown up out of graffiti, or at least contains a large number of writers behind it (Futura, Kaws, Alife, Reas, Dalek, etc), why do you suppose graffiti still seems to be in the shadows of what's hot right now? Can't say I want to suddenly see drippy handstyle logo's on the next season of t-shirts from people, but I wouldn't mind seeing graffiti get some more light instead of all the artfag crap that keeps falling into the spotlight now. Much respect to Banksy and the people really doing their thing, but I'd much rather see an effort to develop new tags and handstyles, then see people tripping over themselves to get their new stencil graphic or obey rip off wheat paste noticed by woostercollective.com.

the next time i have to talk to you, you wont be alive enough to hear it

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Actually, I just remember Supreme had a graffiti graphic on one of their shirts this summer. But you get the point.

img10251315129.jpeg

the next time i have to talk to you, you wont be alive enough to hear it

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u guys may know me.

I used to tag "alfalfa lives" in high school.

"Your mom's in my business, she's in my business

Can't you see girl that your mom's trying to end this?"

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Quote: Anyhow, getting back on topic, does anyone know whatever happened to all the graff magazines? What ever happened to Video Graf? For a while people we're saying they were going to start it back up, but it's been years since I've seen anything from them. Last decent video I saw was State Your Name which came out kind of recently. There's been a few books out, but it seems like mostly stuff from Europe .... Anyne know whatever happened to that Vapors Project magazine. Now that was a fresh graff magazine with potential. Never saw a second issue though.

I agree. As someone in this thread said, with all of the old writers hopping into graphic design and other visual industries, I figured there'd be an influx of new *better* books, magazines, etc. But it hasn't happened yet. But this reminds me, I came across some information on a new book getting put out by 12oz Prophet. I think it's called "AKA: NYC." It linked to their website, but nothing's on it yet. www.akanyc.com

After searching through the 12oz site, I came across some concrete info on the book. It's supposedly almost 200 pages of coffee-table-book quality. The NYC book is apparently the first book in a series covering different cities (I think?). And I found this on the 12oz website:

"there will only be 10,000 copies printed of the first volume and all will be specially packaged. each will be individualy encoded on the cover with the edition number. the first 500 will have a specific color combination on the cover and some extra stuff included in the package. the next 2500 will be a different color combination on the cover, and the remaining 7000 copies will have a third color combination on the cover. there's few stores that will be getting them and definately not newstand or chain stores. when we get a little closer, we'll post something about it and release the store list so everyone knows where to look for them."

Anyway, hopefully this comes through. It looks dope.

Edited by Awesome Rad Face on Jun 16, 2005 at 07:13 PM

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You got me digging now. Just found this:

Quote: BECAUSE WE CARE ENOUGH TO BURN FRIENDS...

The 12ozPROPHET crew is back. We’re back because graffiti’s legacy is in danger, and because we’ve lurked in plain sight for far too long. While graffiti culture floats happily along knowing full well that it only shines in a struggle, graffiti ‘cool’ continues to contribute significantly to the foundation of today’s street culture industry. After a hiatus of several years, 12ozProphet is now back to stir things up in the name of the common good. Join us as we welcome a misrepresented movement back to relevance, and once again return it to the spotlight it deserves.

12ozPROPHET Magazine was launched in 1993 with the goal of raising the bar for the graffiti world and integrating it’s distinctiveness into the wider world of street culture and design. Though there were graffiti magazines before us, we presented the mayhem with an elegance and attention to detail never before seen. We were the first to package top notch graffiti, innovative design, exceptional printing and intelligent thought provoking text. We ran the most extensive interview that Barry McGee (Twist) has ever given. We wrote the first in-depth article about graffiti on the Internet, and also broke Os Gemeos and the Brazilian graffiti scene to the world. In other words, we set the pace. After 12ozPROPHET, graffiti magazines suddenly had to appeal to a wider world of culture whose interest we had piqued. Articles had to be intelligent and well researched, design had to be not simply expedient but artful, and print quality had to be superb. Graffiti was all of a sudden relevant.

12ozPROPHET PROUDLY PRESENTS ALSO KNOWN AS...

Graffiti and the hybrid cultures surrounding it all need a big kick in the ass, and there are few that are more qualified to do it than us. ALSO KNOWN AS will be a 190-page, full-color, perfect-bound, graffiti-obsessed, street culture bible released twice yearly. The focus will be nothing short of dear, dirty destruction; the glorious variety of fuck-you graffiti that offers no attempt to make friends. Absolutely every page will be pure unadulterated content, without room for advertisements or nonsense. We’re also supplementing this first release with several inserts including a kiss-cut sticker sheet, a special fold-out poster, vinyl die-cut stickers, and an exclusive pop-up diorama featuring characters by Reas. Likewise, the print production orgy we’ve got planned for this volume includes alternating several sections of the book to one of a series of carefully selected specialty paper stocks, as well as produce each section with one of several spot colors and varnishes specifically chosen to highlight the content we’re showcasing. Though each volume of ALSO KNOWN AS will be limited to a total edition of 10,000, some copies will be more exclusive than others by way of a tiered release identifiable by one of three distinctly colored foil stamped covers, each individually inscribed with a unique edition number. Multiple paper stocks in the same publication? Several different spot colors? Various types of varnishes? Multiple covers that are individually numbered? You can’t do that without an entire print house at your beck and call. But we’ve got that covered. We’ve got a high-end printing press and bindery shop in our back pocket, and we’re ready to flip this completely unfair competitive advantage into the most elegantly filthy graffiti and street culture publication that the world has ever seen.

Our intention with ALSO KNOWN AS is to deliver an overwhelming sensory delight at first glance and new visual, tactile, and intellectual nuances on the hundredth. We look forward to making other publications look clumsy, and to once again reset the standards of the culture. With 12ozPROPHET, we provided the handbook for an entire generation of designers, marketers, apparel companies, publications, and hipsters to bite from, and bite they did. With ALSO KNOWN AS, we’ll drop another set of

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Hey Red Face -

Mind dropping a link to where you got that news from? Were there any other photos or a release date?

the next time i have to talk to you, you wont be alive enough to hear it

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damn, those flix are amazing, can't wait to see this thing.

kinda puts things in perspective when you see stuff like that, and then flip through the latest book on stickers and stencils. lol

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^^^ Just read the thread. If I had more info, I'd post it. If you have more info, you post it. But dont ask if we have more info like we're holding back, cause that's just silly.

the next time i have to talk to you, you wont be alive enough to hear it

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