Awesome Denim Startup

[Magnetman14]

Had to throw in awesome for a little visibility on this most busy of forum.

In the beginning stages of starting a denim line. I am fully aware of the odds and that the denim industry is super competitive, still going for it. I have what I believe to be sufficient funding, money is not the prime issue. I'm just a little curious if anyone is interested in getting involved in the project from a design point of view. I'm really curious what guys like you have to say and 100% open to suggestions and ideas, pride is a fools fortress, correct?

What do you like and what can't you find. This whole deal can start at the consumer and really make some sweet jeans.

I'm in the greater NYC area btw.

Sorry, not trying to bastardize this forum

[geneticdrifter]

do you need designers?

or

do you need design advice?

sounds a little like market research...

[jasonfoote303]

We like:

[Goldfish]

You should totally run into John Varvatos at a restaurant and ask him for help.

[Magnetman14]

I do need a designer, to clarify, but advice is welcomed too, so guess it is a little like market research. Just thought i'd start off broad.

If there's any designers who would like to see some designs possibly become a reality, let me hear.

and they stole my crisp nyc name, bastards

[ah_long]

funny how ppl come here for business advice..

as a designer, you should be designing a brand that represents you, a brand that carries a philosophy..

we here are just following trends (some might disagree, but we do have a cult/trend going on here @ sufu).. so for you to come here to ask for advice, you're simply asking a bunch of internet users who follows a certain trend and what they like.. obviously our taste would change over time depending on what the brands offer and such...

it's ok for you to be specific to ask questions like what cuts of jeans do we like.. etc.. but to ask what we like and just try to make money that way.. sorry man, ain't going to work.. u can't just do that for every season..

[mpcec]

If you don't have a concept or any designs in mind then what are you doing really? It sounds like the only thing you have down so far is 'sufficient funding'... and I'm guessing you're the same dude who made the topic over at SF so your funding isn't exactly a sure thing.

I personally want to buy from new brands if the people behind them have a clear passion and vision. Look at Karl from Rogue Territory or the dudes from OOE or Blue Highway... those are brands I want to purchase stuff from. Not some brand who draws all of its inspiration from a thread on superfuture...

[Magnetman14]

not the same dude, btw

Not to change my game after the fact, but I'm primarily looking for a designer, someone with some knowledge, etc. I figured I'd try and get some input from people who like jeans while I'm at it, see if my ideas are anywhere near something that people like. After I read my stuff again, I didn't really come off the way I wanted to, my b.

I know what I want to do, this isn't something I came up with on a Sunday night after watching HBO.

I have a clear vision for the brand I would like to build, I have for a while.

All that said, still looking for someone

[milosz]

Why do you want to make jeans? What's driving you? You're trying to enter a saturated market, you better have a good plan.

There are a million denim startups now, and they all suffer from two flaws, IMO:

- making the same cuts, either skinny or slim straight, low-rise, etc.

of boring, sanforized denim

- using the same style (and often same exact kind) of boring sanforized denim

The Japanese brands are interesting because there's so much diversity to their product lines, and because (generally) there's something unique about the denim they use.

[Magnetman14]

Whats driving me? I want to build a brand, something to which I can produce a quality product. Yea, I'd like to make some cash, but the reality I'd have better odds taking the money and starting an E-trade account, so money isn't the prime focus. Even starting a line for tween girls would probably have more success. Hmmm.

But this is good, thanks

[fobsquad]

you've come to the write place. we're profashionals.

[ah_long]

Whats driving me? I want to build a brand, something to which I can produce a quality product. Yea, I'd like to make some cash, but the reality I'd have better odds taking the money and starting an E-trade account, so money isn't the prime focus. Even starting a line for tween girls would probably have more success. Hmmm.

But this is good, thanks

why denim?

you aren't even a designer yourself.. the fact that you have to ask for advice here, shows that you lack interest in denim itself..

if you wanna build a brand and quality product, i'm sorry dude, asking a bunch of internet users won't do it..

the brand and philosophy should be what you believe in, not what we tell you to do..

[Sleazy P]

what makes this awesome?

[geneticdrifter]

i say if you need a designer, you start offering some money.

some of your well funded cash in a sufu user's paypal account will get you plenty of advice.

i volunteer. send me money. and i give you advice.

note:sometimes you gotta read the 2 page thread to get the jokes. smh

[chubby]

stoooooopid.

so so so stupid.

at least start a dialogue that is more specific than "what do you like."

Are you that much of business asshole that you cant even USE the website and gauge for yourself what people on here like? It could be done, EASILY, in just a month of active membership. No one is going to spoon feed you, and trust me, your business venture & you are naive & stupid.

Stupid questions get stupid answers.

[aho]

I never really understood threads like this because if I had the money/funding, you sure as hell can bet I know exactly what I want to do with my own brand everything down from sourcing the denim to what exact machinery would be needed. As far as designs...what more can you really ask of us? This is a repro (ish) based website so of course we like classic 5 pocket jeans and you're not going to find anyone on here with that next big trend in mind for denim (pocket flaps?! Custom embroidery?! Studs?!??) as that's not really our interest (I could be wrong however! lol)

So yeah, I wish I could help you out! But really, if you want to fund my own ideas I'm all down for that as well

[Eels]

Just don't half-ass anything.

Wish you luck.

[Magnetman14]

I don't think stupid was necessary. Naive yea. The realization that this site existed got me a little over zealous, so please excuse. Not for anything, gaining the knowledge i don't know nearly as much as I thought was worth it.

I'm guessing that finding someone who would want to get involved in a project after I was made to look like a big douche is not gonna happen, fair enough.

I'm gonna take my other idea, a blanket with arm holes, and make some serious cash

[aho]

Just curious (not trying to antagonize), what did you have in mind for your brand? What led you to want to create a denim line and what do you believe in?

[Magnetman14]

I like the concept of a high quality product, not something that's too fashion forward. Something that gets better with age. I don't own a lot of shit, but what I do have, for the most part, is nice stuff, it's much more satisfying than blind conspicuous consumption.

The t-shirt company didn't pan out the way I planned, but that business seemed a little too much like pop music to me, nothing was lent any longevity. This led me to denim. I like leather too, that's another thread for another time.

In hindsight, I really could have started this thread on a much better note, because, and my fault completely, i do look kind of dumb.

[aho]

The thing is, with denim, you need to have a bleeding passion for it...This might sound a little over romanticized, but in my mind, denim has to be everything you think of...A way of life! Look towards brands like Ooe Yofukuten...There's a certain passion towards what they do, the process that they follow that begins with digging through endless amounts of vintage denim...Deconstructing each piece and trying to understand every little nuance and small detail that others would overlook to produce what is in their vision a quality product they can stand behind rivaling the big names of the past. It takes years of studying and endless repetition of technique to get to that level but in the end they put out a product that is unique, artisanal and of the highest caliber. This is the type of dedication it takes and in the end, who's to say you'll be making any money at all! But you can bet that all these guys (Ooe, Double Volante, etc.) would still be doing this even if at an economical loss...It is their passion, it is their craving...it is their life!

And I'm not saying that this isn't you...But if you ask me, if you want to get into the industry, start out by getting to understand the product itself...Work at a garment factory, take in the techniques! Learn what it means to sew and stitch things different ways...what types of construction makes a jean more durable, etc.! Learn what denim mills are producing, what types of textiles you appreciate...don't fall into the mode of thinking that anything Japanese is good...There is good Japanese denim and there is horrible Japanese denim! Experience first hand the difference between different machinery...why we all drool over chainsticth etc. Learn what kinds of body types suit different fits and how to adjust accordingly! I could go on and on but I'm basically saying that if you want to get something going, your best bet isn't by fishing around for ideas on a internet forum, but actually getting in there and doing the work yourself!

Anyways best of luck to you...you are in a position that I am very jealous of! Here's hoping that you find your own "denim voice" and maybe we'll all be buying your products soon!

[milosz]

That's a better start - you're interested in denim for quality, the way the material ages, historical signifiers, yada yada yada.

Now, that's the fundamental basis for the Japanese repro industry - take a look at Blue in Green's website. What do you think you have to offer to differentiate yourself from Sugar Cane/Warehouse/Full Count/etc.?

Lower prices? Different styling cues?

Sounds like you want to start a business and sell a brand, but you're not 100% sold by your endeavors themselves - you don't know much about jeans, didn't know much about graphic tees. Maybe you should think about shelving going it alone to work in the industry in some capacity to learn the ropes and find your niche, or go into marketing and build/sell someone else's brand.

[Magnetman14]

It only took three pages of thread to ground me in reality.

Nice.

I've been trivializing the denim scene, I see that even after like .323 seconds on the rest of the forum.

[heyitslando]

I mean I think it's a good idea, but I gotta agree with most people on here, especially aho- denim has got to be your LIFE for you to start something up. nonetheless, good luck dude! Id totally be down to see what kinda stuff you come up with and if you need extra help with ideas or something Id do that.

[geneticdrifter]

your talking about craftsmanship and quality and you were just involved with a t-shirt company. ???? tshirts are everything but, well crafted and "meant to last."

Brosef, it sounds like you have money, but you need some basic business skills. Denim doesn't need to be your life to make money, or manufacture denim. If you want to sell your products to people here, your life will have to be denim or atleast appear to be. Point is, you need to find a business you're passionate about. Making jeans, selling life insurance, crafting doll houses; whatever. The passion is required to endure the struggles of starting the average business. things you will learn intro to business. respect yourself and the money and invest in schooling.

People with a passion for money can win. But this is a tight rope to walk. It requires much more effort to plot and scheme. Of course, unless, you're a sociopath.

more money than sense. if we are being honest.

[grmanny]

The thing is, with denim, you need to have a bleeding passion for it...This might sound a little over romanticized, but in my mind, denim has to be everything you think of...A way of life! Look towards brands like Ooe Yofukuten...There's a certain passion towards what they do, the process that they follow that begins with digging through endless amounts of vintage denim...Deconstructing each piece and trying to understand every little nuance and small detail that others would overlook to produce what is in their vision a quality product they can stand behind rivaling the big names of the past. It takes years of studying and endless repetition of technique to get to that level but in the end they put out a product that is unique, artisanal and of the highest caliber. This is the type of dedication it takes and in the end, who's to say you'll be making any money at all! But you can bet that all these guys (Ooe, Double Volante, etc.) would still be doing this even if at an economical loss...It is their passion, it is their craving...it is their life!

And I'm not saying that this isn't you...But if you ask me, if you want to get into the industry, start out by getting to understand the product itself...Work at a garment factory, take in the techniques! Learn what it means to sew and stitch things different ways...what types of construction makes a jean more durable, etc.! Learn what denim mills are producing, what types of textiles you appreciate...don't fall into the mode of thinking that anything Japanese is good...There is good Japanese denim and there is horrible Japanese denim! Experience first hand the difference between different machinery...why we all drool over chainsticth etc. Learn what kinds of body types suit different fits and how to adjust accordingly! I could go on and on but I'm basically saying that if you want to get something going, your best bet isn't by fishing around for ideas on a internet forum, but actually getting in there and doing the work yourself!

Anyways best of luck to you...you are in a position that I am very jealous of! Here's hoping that you find your own "denim voice" and maybe we'll all be buying your products soon!

Nobody, mark my words, nobody will ever create their products for very long if they're operating with negative cash flow, no matter how passionate. I know way too many chefs who are passionate about their cooking, only to have to close shop when their place ran cash flow negative for a period of time. Japanese artisan denim producers are still human after all.

To the OP:

Who's your target market? Are you trying to target entry level denim heads, or are you going for the upper tier? I hope you realize that this market is still an extremely tight niche market. Your perception of the raw denim market may be different cause you're on sufu all the time, but the market is still extremely small.

The biggest problem I see with the raw denim market right now is, despite many sufuer's that will deny this, is that there are only a few companies that source their denim internally, most of the other japanese companies source their denim from the few mills within japan. I think you if you were somehow able to learn the art and craft of denim production, and made pants and other things from house made denim, you may have something.

[mondayc]

I like jeans that fit nicely. Can I get a job?

Seriously though, I don't think you're savvy enough to start your own line. You come onto a forum full of internet strangers and ask us what we like despite the countless threads on what we like and all the "awww sick jawnz + rep" responses.

There are designers/store owners among us, whether they post or simply lurk, that use the forum partially for their market research. None of the successful ones have needed to start a thread like "Kiya from Self Edge here, what should we carry?"

[aho]

Nobody, mark my words, nobody will ever create their products for very long if they're operating with negative cash flow, no matter how passionate. I know way too many chefs who are passionate about their cooking, only to have to close shop when their place ran cash flow negative for a period of time. Japanese artisan denim producers are still human after all.

I see what you're getting at grmanny, but I should've been more clear...All the chefs you mentioned, I bet even though they had to close shop they still cook in their spare time/as a hobby right? I didn't mean strictly in the business sense...

[chubby]

I don't think stupid was necessary. Naive yea. The realization that this site existed got me a little over zealous, so please excuse. Not for anything, gaining the knowledge i don't know nearly as much as I thought was worth it.

I'm guessing that finding someone who would want to get involved in a project after I was made to look like a big douche is not gonna happen, fair enough.

I'm gonna take my other idea, a blanket with arm holes, and make some serious cash

Haha. I like it.

sorry to call you stupid. I assume people lurk on these forums for a while before posting, which I guess in your case you probably are just realizing how great of a resource SuFu can be, and are really excited about it.

Lurk and Post, restart this thread in a month or 3.

[willy cheesesteak]

just make sure they have cool pockets bro