501 Inseams Through the Years...

[Jim Cissell]

Anyone have any idea why Levi's started putting a double stitched inseam on their 501s around the early 1970s?

A nice, durable detail, but it's also funny they dropped it recently...

Jim

[tweeds]

double stitching? what does this refer to...?

[denimdestroyedmylife]

two lines of single-stitching that run parallel, no?

(my sams have double-chainstitched inseams)

[cheapmuthafukr]

i thought that he was talking about felled...

i dont know... i wish my sams were

[denimdestroyedmylife]

what, you wish they were felled?

[snugglepony]

double stitching? what does this refer to...?

sewn together, overlocked, folded over, then stitched twice in parallel through the folded part to complete the inseam.

looks like a flat felled seam from the outside, but not from the inside.

[Jim Cissell]

I'm refering to the felled seam, or double-row of stitches along the inner (leg) seam. That seam was traditionally a single line of stiching, until sometime in the early 70s. They then went to the double-stitched seam (which many of their other models share) until about 2003, when they adopted the so-called 'anti-fit' styling to their 501 pattern, and reverted back to the vintage single-line inseam.

I understand this newer cut was based upon the beloved 1947 model, which also shared this single stitch inseam.

My question is why, after going to the double stitch (which looks good and is more durable) did they abandon it? Less costly to manufacture may be one answer, but I suspect there were other reasons...

Jim

[Tarmac]

probably a simple fact of, Hey maybe we can do this and people will like it enough to buy more. Then there was no increase in sales. Then they went back to cheaper.

Felled inseam requires more material (enough to fold under), more labor, more stitching...

But if anyone knows any inside history, please respond.

btw even old navy has felled inseams on some $15 models.

[snugglepony]

getting our terms straight:

double row of stitching:

does not always indicate a flat felled seam (the picture below is NOT felled):

[cheapmuthafukr]

^^thats how my canes l-e r----s

i mean cowboy pants

look.

[mopar_jj]

started it when they gave up making redlines(early 80s),stopped it a few yrs back when they closed the usa plants.

[Jim Cissell]

I very much associate feeled seams with quality.

I can remember when shirts had the single line stitch on many of the seams, and only the VERY well made ones had the felled. The double-stitch is much more common now, probably due to the cheaper labor availability. You really can get better quality clothing for the dollar now than say, 20 years ago, even with inflation factored in.

So, in my mind they should've retained the felled inseam. It just looks better, it washes and ages nicely, exhibits lots of character, holds-up over time longer, and just seeems better. I think all of the seams on jeans should be felled, actually!

Look at shirts, for example, and see if you'd rather buy one without the felled seams...

Jim

[denimdestroyedmylife]

i agree. but felled inseams are bulky, though. they feel like cords running down your legs. i can totally see how it'd chafe the legs of saddled cowboys.

[snugglepony]

I think all of the seams on jeans should be felled, actually!

i agree with you almost entirely, jim -- the only exception i'd make is for denim w/ a yard weight above 14oz. or so... flat-felling a seam adds an extra fold to the process, and with denim in the 17-21oz range, you'd really notice the "cord" thing ddml is talking about.

if you're looking for a jean that's as beautifully finished on the inside as the outside, look no further than a pair of imperials -- all seams are felled, and there is no visible overlocking (even the fly's seams are finished cleanly!).

[denimdestroyedmylife]

same goes for the sugar cane sc40400n, based on a levis 47

the inseam is hand-felled, then single-stitched with ultra-close stitching

no overlock

the fly seams are bound!

and the pocket bags are selvage

[tweeds]

sewn together, overlocked, folded over, then stitched twice in parallel through the folded part to complete the inseam.

looks like a flat felled seam from the outside, but not from the inside.

ah. yes i was wondering...my terminology is a bit shabby.

i thought he was referring to flat-felled seams at first.

personally i prefer felled seams too - the serged finish looks pretty untidy from the inside.

[snugglepony]

look what i found.

funny how conversations tend to repeat themselves...

[tweeds]

sewn together, overlocked, folded over, then stitched twice in parallel through the folded part to complete the inseam.

looks like a flat felled seam from the outside, but not from the inside.

snuggles, is the technique you described the one you show in the picture?

[snugglepony]

the picture a few posts above?

yes -- if you look closely, you'll see three lines of chainstitching and the overlock threads.

[here's where i wish we had a superfuture blackboard for sketching... wayne?]

the front and the back part of the leg are sewn together once, leavin 1 cm or so of excess material inside the leg.

this excess material is overlock stitched together, then folded over to lay flat.

lastly, the seam is finished with two parallel lines of stitching, binding the overlocked excess material on the inside to the finish denim.

i think these steps are probably combined by some massive jeans sewing machine and the whole process probably takes 5 seconds...

it's likely just as strong a seam as a flat-felled seam, just not as pretty to look at.

[tweeds]

ah, i get it...

it takes a bit of imagination to convert a 3D seam concept into words.

is that a detail that sugar cane reproduced from lee?