supermeatheads

[FADEtoDARKNESS]

That article was fuckung informative. Thanks alot

[back211]

OKokokokok here

If your body doesnt have glucose or glycogen, (which are in carbs) your body goes catabolic and breaks down muscle into simple sugars to fuel itself.

[mrchariybrown]

I respectfully accept you statement haha because I agree sorta. Let me explain.

You go into a catabolic state when you run out of glycogen and glucose, so your body breaks down the protien in your muscles and use it as energy.

Cortisol, epinephrine, norepinephrine, testosterone,growth hormone, insulin-like growth factor-I, insulin, glucose, lactate, glycerol, and free fatty acids are all things that get depleted during workouts and decrease when your body doesnt have these things to burn, these levels will drop. These are either hormonal anabolic properties (t, gh, insuline, etc.) or nutritional (glucose, lactate, glycerol, etc.) the nutritional factors are easily found many carb sources, thus increased carbs as well as protien before and during workouts decrease the effects of muscle breakdown due to a catabolic state.

Let me say however i easily believe you when you say you gained muscle while on low levels or carbs, mainly because you can grow easily through proper recovery and calorie surplus, however things like utilizing peri nutrition and what i just discussed, helps grow more efficiently, just like building blocks on a foundation ya know? like another tool in a builders toolbox

bottom line; a catabolic state due to carb defficiency isnt as detrimental as it sounds but its all residual and builds up through time.

Idk, I wrote alot but i dont know if i was able to get my point across haha or if you guys can understand at what im getting at. I got some knowledge just not a gift for easy explanations.

that I agree with.

I just didn't want the meathead noobs to think that just because they don't eat carbs during a workout, that they'll lose muscle.

also, the reverse, just because I don't eat carbs before a workout, doesn't mean others shouldn't. I only do that because I'm on an IA-style warrior diet right now and I cram about 2200 calories down after my throat from 6:30pm to 10:30pm haha.

all in all, I think we can both agree that everyone's bodies responds differently to diets depending on the macros, total calories, and type and amount of training involved.

for example, I'm starting to realize that my body runs the best on a simple half timed carb diet, but I like the ease of use of the IA-style warrior diet at the moment.

OKokokokok here

If your body doesnt have glucose or glycogen, (which are in carbs) your body goes catabolic and breaks down muscle into simple sugars to fuel itself.

this, I don't fully agree with. I know plenty of people that have run full-on keto diets without sacrificing much, if any, mass. it really depends on your genetics and your body's response to those types of diets.

[back211]

this, I don't fully agree with. I know plenty of people that have run full-on keto diets without sacrificing much, if any, mass. it really depends on your genetics and your body's response to those types of diets.

I totally agree but just because you body goes into a catabolic mode doesnt mean you will sacrifice mass. Glycogen is stored in blood and glucose in muscle and liver. When you use up glycogen and glucose your bodys number one concern is to upkeep glucose levels, not muscle recovery. Now this only occurs after around an hour or even 50 min. So at around an hour usually one body goes catabolic no matter what. Glucose and Glycogen is found in simple carbs.

Depending on your body and what you have as fuel to burn depends on how much mucsle you end up burning for simple carbs.

However going to a keto- diet or low carb diet doesnt mean you wont loose alot of mass, even if your body goes catabolic, esp if your at a young age, your body has higher energy levels.

I used to eat no carbs and workout hard for 2 hours. This basically is the greatest example of when your body would go into a catabolic state however I went from 175-187 while keeping 8% bf within a couple months.

Now i utilize this nutrition during my bulking phase and ive been able to gain 30lbs in 3 months, while staying at 12% bf..

[back211]

btw its great to meet another tnation member

[mrchariybrown]

very nice!. I'm actually just a lurker of tnation at best. I'm more ironaddict gung ho since I'm not really a mass monster and more into the powerlifting and lifestyle aspect of the game.

[FADEtoDARKNESS]

Tnation is a load of shit. Biotest has good quality control but there are much better supplement companies out there.

T nation articles -

Blah blah product placement blah blah informative statement blah blah YOURE A SISSY BITCH PUSSY VAGINA URGH MAN THE FUCK UP blah blah product placement blah blah BUY OUR SPECIALLY FORMULATED FORMULA PROTEIN 110% BETTER ABSORPTION RATE TAHN OTHER COMPANIES...AND WE CUT OUT THE MIDDLE MAN SO YOU ONLY HAVE TO PAY THIRTY DOLLARS MORE THAN YOU WOULD ELSEWHERE

In terms of their products

As IA and Joe would say "Beradis post workout voodoo bullshit"

OMG YOU WONT GET SWOLE UNLESS YOU INGEST OUR SPECIALLY FORMULATED BLACK OPZ PROJECT TAHT YOU CANT GET YET BECAUSE ITS SO FUCKING SUPER AND MADE FOR ELITE ATHLETES LIKE US T WRITERS...ok wait guys you can NOW GET IT! ITS CALLED ANACONDA AND ITS ONLY 400 BUCKS FOR A 4 WEEK SUPPLY! FUCKING TOTALLY WORTH IT.

lol

<3 chairy for puttin me up on that IA tip...not enough rep in the world for what that site has done for my training

[back211]

same same started out getting into lifting for strength and still doing it for that reason. I love powerlifting mainly because of konstantin konstantinovs (

) and ever since ive seen him lift, damn ive had this journey after strength heavy lifting and size will follow.

ill check out iron addict, thanks for the info

[ke1]

Need some advice by some real serious meatheads.

I'm an ectomorph (5'7 135) trying to gain some mass, specifically in my chest and back. Disregarding diet, because I'm well aware that I need to overeat and what not, what sort routine is best fit for me?

I really like strength training (Bench/Squats/Deadlift/Backrows/Military Press) with maybe 5 sets of 5 reps, but is that routine appropriate for medium to maximum weight gain?

I'm an active athlete (Wrestling/jiu-jitsu) and I'm not looking to gain any unnecessary muscles (HUGE pecs, huge biceps) as it wouldn't benefit me as much in these sports.

[mrchariybrown]

Need some advice by some real serious meatheads.

I'm an ectomorph (5'7 135) trying to gain some mass, specifically in my chest and back. Disregarding diet, because I'm well aware that I need to overeat and what not, what sort routine is best fit for me?

I really like strength training (Bench/Squats/Deadlift/Backrows/Military Press) with maybe 5 sets of 5 reps, but is that routine appropriate for medium to maximum weight gain?

I'm an active athlete (Wrestling/jiu-jitsu) and I'm not looking to gain any unnecessary muscles (HUGE pecs, huge biceps) as it wouldn't benefit me as much in these sports.

there is no such thing as a "best" routine. try out routines that interest you and find what works "best" for you.

[FADEtoDARKNESS]

hey ke1, use iron addicts for routine advice. Great stuff for beginners/intermediates/advanced people

oh and chairy , I'm gonna get that 500lb dead lift in no time.

[daphneYOUfindME]

starting strength is a pretty decent program. i was on it from october 09 to january and went from 135 lbs to 153 (at 5'8) in that span of time. at that point i was kind of tired of eating so much to keep up with the demands of the program and i started to plateau on the deadlift and squat. it was not a clean bulk so i did end up with some fat but my strength gains made up for it. at the moment i'm ~148 lbs, 330 1rm deadlift (tested maybe 3 months ago), 290 squat, 215 bench.

as for getting "too big" on the program, it is not easy to get huge unless you're stuffing your face all day. lifting iron is the easy part, eating is not ;[

[ke1]

Alright thanks for the help everyone.

[Leeacto]

No offense to Daphne, but for 153lbs, I don't think that's very impressive for a program workout. You should be benching maybe 240+, 375+ DL, and 315+ squat.

These numbers are just from memory as a HS footbal player

[FADEtoDARKNESS]

I don't think there is any general "you should" requirements for a specific weight class, especially when you're not considering any other factor involved.

I mean, what if he jumped his squat from a measly 95 to his 290 in a four month range...thats not bad at all...

[daphneYOUfindME]

No offense to Daphne, but for 153lbs, I don't think that's very impressive for a program workout. You should be benching maybe 240+, 375+ DL, and 315+ squat.

These numbers are just from memory as a HS footbal player

i'm actually under 150 now and i started lifting a year ago. if i had a better diet and trained more seriously i'd probably have better numbers but powerlifting is something i do for fun and to stay active. i'm no football player trying to throw up impressive numbers

[Leeacto]

from you original post, it sounded like you were pretty serious about it. How often do you work out?

I just think when a lot of people start to weight train "for real" they credit their first program for the large increases they see when in reality their body is just becoming more accustomed to where it "should" be with proper training.

that said, you're probably naturally a pretty strong guy, daphne. And if you were to focus on a program, that's when you'll see even better gains

[Leeacto]

Also, has anyone tried Progenex products? The crossfit community is pretty into it, since i think they sponsor the meets.

[daphneYOUfindME]

the purpose of my post was to give some perspective to ke1. i've been working out for a bit over an hour 3x/week(deadlift, bench/overhead press, squat) but recently threw in a fourth day so i can bench and ohp more than once a week and see some progress. i'm following the 5/3/1 Big But Boring program right now. besides the main lift there are only two accessory lifts so i'm able to get in and out of the gym fairly quickly.

my squat was probably the toughest to move up since i had a mild knee injury and hurt my groin due to poor form. switching to box squats for a few months really helped. i also blame my small hips

here's a little comparison:

7/30/09

7/1/10

i can't even zip up those april 77s in the first pic anymore, and they look like denim leggings. as far as progress goes relative to the amount of effort i put in, i'm satisfied with the results.

[FADEtoDARKNESS]

you look like a buff version of my friend

[daphneYOUfindME]

need a vial of chariy's blood to shoot up some swole juice. i should test my 1rms soon, i have a feeling i can pull at least 350 and squat 300 now.

[Leeacto]

that's a pretty big physical change. congrats

[Solix]

Anyone with any suggestions on clothing? I sweat a TON. During cardio days I usually end up going through 3 tees because they get so saturated. I usually use just some older regular cotton or polycotton/cotton blend tees/

Is there something I'm missing out in not buying workout-specific clothing? Something that'll keep me cooler and wick away/hold sweat better? Or is it just something that I'm screwed with genes-wise?

[ke1]

Daphne, thanks for the program and pictures, it really put into perspective how much I could gain with mildly serious training. Great gains btw.

[Leeacto]

Solix, I'm guessing it's just genes. maybe use the Dri-fit stuff from Nike or Adidas, but you may just have to live w/ it.

[zerofuture]

Are there distinct benefits to powerlifting (heavy weights, low reps) vs. what I'll term 'regular weight training' (lower weights, higher reps)? It seems like a lot of you are focused on the former.

My apologies if this has been touched upon already.

[arem]

Solix - I sweat very heavily when I work out too, switching to something like Nike Dri-Fit or adidas Climacool will really make a difference. Most people don't really perspire enough to see the difference between a regular cotton T and a synthetic, but there's a huge difference IMO. Definitely worth buying one and trying it out. The weird thing is that I can't wear them casually, because they make me sweat even when I'm not exerting myself.

[Leeacto]

Are there distinct benefits to powerlifting (heavy weights, low reps) vs. what I'll term 'regular weight training' (lower weights, higher reps)? It seems like a lot of you are focused on the former.

My apologies if this has been touched upon already.

I think most people are generally in two camps: Get really strong and Get ripped.

The benefits for both are pretty general. Powerlifting just makes it easier to lift big things more easily in every day life. The downside, I think, is you can accelerate wear on your joints.

So generally it's just a preference.

Also, this thread was used more by the powerlifting types (kunk, knucks, me) when it was started. Now it's changed to incorporate all styles

[knucks]

if anyone is curious as to how some powerlifting dudes and i train...

http://michiganpowerlifting.blogspot.com/

[daphneYOUfindME]

Daphne, thanks for the program and pictures, it really put into perspective how much I could gain with mildly serious training. Great gains btw.

no problem, the biggest piece of advice i can leave you with is: focus on form. don't be in a rush to increase numbers. if you need some advice feel free to pm me. even after a year of lifting i still consider myself a novice but i can definitely give a beginner some helpful tips.

Are there distinct benefits to powerlifting (heavy weights, low reps) vs. what I'll term 'regular weight training' (lower weights, higher reps)? It seems like a lot of you are focused on the former.

My apologies if this has been touched upon already.

powerlifting is more fun