football: the beautiful game

[Tisswat]

^

yeah henry was pissed at kirkland wasting so much time when wigan was up 1-0

In that case it's pretty funny. It's like RvN cheering in front of that player as posted earlier.

[RobbertJan]

what do u guys think about eto´o refusing to play the last 5min and then today calling rijkaard a liar, haha typical eto´o stuff,

[aitsuka]

what do u guys think about eto´o refusing to play the last 5min and then today calling rijkaard a liar, haha typical eto´o stuff,

he actually said that?

meh, highly replaceable player

love guily, that player is explosiveness in human body form

[RobbertJan]

ajax got killed by werder, fucking lindebergh what a stupid moron and he's supposed to be the experienced player

az drawing in a fantastic match against fenerbahce, they should have won though, when they really tried they were 10x as good as fener, but az still lacking in defense.

[lightinaugust]

raaaa. nostalgia.

koeman, zidane, juninho, ronaldo, garrincha - some of the best players ever

PYKA5fU9dD8

dYUtKKbBTkw

dwoInvA-NKk

dJOGRWkWcIc

[evisu 2000]

remember when henry and pires tried this a few years ago... amateurs.

2ieOS1qSj4Q

[stfuken]

My teams are liverpool and ac milan

players: kaka, viera, ibrahimovic, cannavaro, sheva, and CROUCH

This thread was entertaining to say the least.

[tweeds]

anyone that keeps a lookout for the french ligue 1? how good is lille?

[RobbertJan]

^not, french league isn't good, only lyon is pretty good, but it sais enough that they always win with a huge difference

[superdupersang]

remeber the french ligue is whjere ronhaldiniho first entered europe

[RobbertJan]

^doesn't make it a good league, when he played at psg they only finished 11th

[Tisswat]

anyone that keeps a lookout for the french ligue 1? how good is lille?

The nice thing about the French league is that there is no "traditional" top three or four teams that win the prizes. The odds are more evenly distributed so to speak when compared to other leagues in Europe (and probably throughout the rest of the world).

[aitsuka]

italian league is hard to predict too

look at catalania, palermo and forientina

[mis]

juninho pernambuco is by far the best free kick taker in the world

[tweeds]

pernambucano

i disagree..beckham for me was the best striker of the dead ball (at least in our time), whatever else he might be on the rest of the pitch.

[evisu 2000]

my personal favorite is/was sinisa.

[swisloc]

The nice thing about the French league is that there is no "traditional" top three or four teams that win the prizes. The odds are more evenly distributed so to speak when compared to other leagues in Europe (and probably throughout the rest of the world).

ummmm... hasn't lyon won like the last five year or something? And marseille dominated that league in the early 90's pre-scandal. it's not evenyl distributed, lyon is WAY better than every other team. the french league is terrible and predictable. it's like a slightly better version of the scottish league.

the scottish league, uhg. celtic should just join the premeirship, finish mid-pack, and they should disband the rest.

[swisloc]

italian league is hard to predict too

look at catalania, palermo and forientina

i disagree on this as well. Fiorentina was top four last year, who expected them to be bad?? Sure you have a couple of surprise teams, but that happens in every league, and then there are the usual suspects on top (i'd say a bigger surprise would be Sevilla actually having a chance to WIN La Liga). in fact, as an american soccer fan, my bigest beef with european club soccer is that it is too predictable. i fully realize that the money structure is far different than american sports and is steeped in tradition, but it's a problem for the sport that any random multi-billionaire can buy a team and buy a international superstar at every position unchecked. this is why the same teams are always good, as everyone knows, but it makes things slightly less interesting. don't get me wrong, i love watching it (when we can actually see games here), and having played my whole life, truly believe it's the best sport on the planet, i just wish it was more evenly competitive at the highest level. I'm not talking game to game, but rather, season to season.

thoughts? am i that off base?

[RobbertJan]

^no, cause in scotland people live for football, all the stadiums are always sold-out, regardless of the match, that's the real genuine football ambiance, and there unique in the world this way

best free kicktakers of last decade: pierre van hooijdonk, juninho, beckham, zidane

[swisloc]

^no, cause in scotland people live for football, all the stadiums are always sold-out, regardless of the match, that's the real genuine football ambiance, and there unique in the world this way

best free kicktakers of last decade: pierre van hooijdonk, juninho, beckham, zidane

good point. plus they do bring the intensity week to week, even if the skill isn't as high as other leagues.

zidane was an amazing freekick taker. people forget this.

[polishmike]

Swisloc, makes some good points but I still have to disagree. I'm not going to talk about italian league because this season is not a "normal" one. With all the teams getting points deducted and Juve not playing in Serie A, the table looks like it looks and not much might change till may.

I don't see why you're so surprised about Sevilla. They have been consistent year to year. Last year they won the UEFA Cup and finished 5th in the league (which was only 2 points behind 2nd Real), they year before that they were 6th with only 2 points behind 4th spot that would put them to the Champions League. They have many great players that might not be superstars but they win the games and play for the team. I think Sevilla is a team to watch unless they start selling their talent.

I support Liverpool so I can't really talk shit about billionaires buying clubs but it is a natural transition. Liverpool needed money to fund the new stadium and also needed money to compete with ManU, Chelsea and Arsenal. I really have no problems with the owners. I was surprised when ManU fans were pissed off when Glazer took over. Are they still pissed now when they are pretty much sure of the title? You need money to compete in Premiership and Champions League every year. To me it doesn't really mater where the money is coming from as long as my team is winning. Money is not always everything, you can look at West Ham and Reading and where they are in the table.

I also love the competitiveness on the top of the leagues, I love how a team can't drop one game cause that might mean the title. I love watching players playing to the fullest every time they are on the pitch. To me the bottom of the table doesn't matter, it's all about the winners. I never saw that at any MLS game, to me it's soccer light, just not enough passion and rivalry.

That's all from me, I need to get some stronger sleeping pills cause I might not sleep again till the Barca game

[evisu 2000]

Money is not always everything, you can look at West Ham and Reading and where they are in the table.

another example would be everton, even though they got demolished in the champions league a couple of years ago!

[swisloc]

^^

first of all, i'm not comparing it to MLS. MLS is shit, and i never watch it. I'm comparing the money structure to american sports leagues, particularly the NBA and NFL. these leagues have cost structures that limit the amount that can be spent per team (in a complicated way that can't be explained quickly). this puts the oweness on the owner team and coaches to make the most out of usually one or two superstars and several role players and in general makes the level of play more even top to bottom (although the teams with better owners and coaches stay towards the top) and more unpredictable year to year.

Edit: this also allows basically every city with a team to have at least one star. this helps interest levels a lot in cities that aren't contenders every year.

you say you like the competitiveness at the top, which i agree with, but it's unfortunate that you can enter any given season knowing Chelsea, Man U, Liverpool, and Arsenal will likely be the top 4. I don't fault teams for trying to buy lots of stars, they have to compete as the current setup entitles them to. I just feel it would be a better product if you an up and comer could steal the title, in the current system this is virtually impossible.

That said, i love the relegation system. I wish american sports would incorporate this, it makes even games among the lower teams important.

[superdupersang]

the unpredictictability of most (all?) amerian leagues is something that is a lot healthier for competition than the big 3/4 we get in the european football leagues.

however, in the uk, and elsewhere, the grassroots clubs are completely separate and have no affiliation with other, more bigger clubs, as opposed to the US system, where each franchise has its feeder teams.

this means there is no scope for the drama or excitment of giant killing, where lower league minows get to play against some of the biggest clubs in thew world.

also, clubs can start from scratch and can progeresss up the leagues if there good enough, but this happens a lot less now.

one thing that would be impossible to emulate outside of the US is the draft system.

although its a great idea

[Tisswat]

1932/33 - Olympique Lillois

1933/34 - FC Sète

1934/35 - FC Sochaux-Montbéliard

1935/36 - Racing Club de Paris

1936/37 - Olympique de Marseille

1937/38 - FC Sochaux-Montbéliard

1938/39 - FC Sète

1939 - 1945 - league interrupted due to World War II

1945/46 - Lille OSC

1946/47 - CO Roubaix-Tourcoing

1947/48 - Olympique de Marseille

1948/49 - Stade de Reims

1949/50 - Girondins de Bordeaux

1950/51 - OGC Nice

1951/52 - OGC Nice

1952/53 - Stade de Reims

1953/54 - Lille OSC

1954/55 - Stade de Reims

1955/56 - OGC Nice

1956/57 - AS Saint-Étienne

1957/58 - Stade de Reims

1958/59 - OGC Nice

1959/60 - Stade de Reims

1960/61 - AS Monaco FC

1961/62 - Stade de Reims

1962/63 - AS Monaco FC

1963/64 - AS Saint-Étienne

1964/65 - FC Nantes

1965/66 - FC Nantes

1966/67 - AS Saint-Étienne

1967/68 - AS Saint-Étienne

1968/69 - AS Saint-Étienne

1969/70 - AS Saint-Étienne

1970/71 - Olympique de Marseille

1971/72 - Olympique de Marseille

1972/73 - FC Nantes

1973/74 - AS Saint-Étienne

1974/75 - AS Saint-Étienne

1975/76 - AS Saint-Étienne

1976/77 - FC Nantes

1977/78 - AS Monaco FC

1978/79 - RC Strasbourg

1979/80 - FC Nantes

1980/81 - AS Saint-Étienne

1981/82 - AS Monaco FC

1982/83 - FC Nantes

1983/84 - Girondins de Bordeaux

1984/85 - Girondins de Bordeaux

1985/86 - Paris Saint-Germain FC

1986/87 - Girondins de Bordeaux

1987/88 - AS Monaco FC

1988/89 - Olympique de Marseille

1989/90 - Olympique de Marseille

1990/91 - Olympique de Marseille

1991/92 - Olympique de Marseille

1992/93 - no champion Olympique de Marseille stripped of title due to a corruption scandal)

1993/94 - Paris Saint-Germain FC

1994/95 - FC Nantes

1995/96 - AJ Auxerre

1996/97 - AS Monaco FC

1997/98 - RC Lens

1998/99 - Girondins de Bordeaux

1999/00 - AS Monaco FC

2000/01 - FC Nantes

2001/02 - Olympique Lyonnais

2002/03 - Olympique Lyonnais

2003/04 - Olympique Lyonnais

2004/05 - Olympique Lyonnais

2005/06 - Olympique Lyonnais

[swisloc]

the unpredictictability of most (all?) amerian leagues is something that is a lot healthier for competition than the big 3/4 we get in the european football leagues.

however, in the uk, and elsewhere, the grassroots clubs are completely separate and have no affiliation with other, more bigger clubs, as opposed to the US system, where each franchise has its feeder teams.

actually, the only american sports that have minor league feeder franchises are baseball and hockey. neither the NFL or NBA have those, and these are the better corporate models anyway on league building. I think the biggest difference is that american sports operate like a corporation with franchises (teams) owned by indivual owners, but still controlled by the corporation (the league head office). The league makes it's own money through marketing and television contracts and is it's own entity. i don't think this really exists in soccer in europe. the league effectively organizes games and uefa and fifa issue fines and penalties to cheaters, but there is no central league in each country operating the league as a whole.

it funny, though, cause these days when there is hardly any turnover in the top teams in europe, the best teams are virtually treating the lesser teams as their minor league. they buy so many players they have to send them on loan to other teams! to me, this is further indicates how top heavy the sport has become.

[swisloc]

1932/33 - Olympique Lillois

1933/34 - FC Sète

1934/35 - FC Sochaux-Montbéliard

1935/36 - Racing Club de Paris

1936/37 - Olympique de Marseille

1937/38 - FC Sochaux-Montbéliard

1938/39 - FC Sète

1939 - 1945 - league interrupted due to World War II

1945/46 - Lille OSC

1946/47 - CO Roubaix-Tourcoing

1947/48 - Olympique de Marseille

1948/49 - Stade de Reims

1949/50 - Girondins de Bordeaux

1950/51 - OGC Nice

1951/52 - OGC Nice

1952/53 - Stade de Reims

1953/54 - Lille OSC

1954/55 - Stade de Reims

1955/56 - OGC Nice

1956/57 - AS Saint-Étienne

1957/58 - Stade de Reims

1958/59 - OGC Nice

1959/60 - Stade de Reims

1960/61 - AS Monaco FC

1961/62 - Stade de Reims

1962/63 - AS Monaco FC

1963/64 - AS Saint-Étienne

1964/65 - FC Nantes

1965/66 - FC Nantes

1966/67 - AS Saint-Étienne

1967/68 - AS Saint-Étienne

1968/69 - AS Saint-Étienne

1969/70 - AS Saint-Étienne

1970/71 - Olympique de Marseille

1971/72 - Olympique de Marseille

1972/73 - FC Nantes

1973/74 - AS Saint-Étienne

1974/75 - AS Saint-Étienne

1975/76 - AS Saint-Étienne

1976/77 - FC Nantes

1977/78 - AS Monaco FC

1978/79 - RC Strasbourg

1979/80 - FC Nantes

1980/81 - AS Saint-Étienne

1981/82 - AS Monaco FC

1982/83 - FC Nantes

1983/84 - Girondins de Bordeaux

1984/85 - Girondins de Bordeaux

1985/86 - Paris Saint-Germain FC

1986/87 - Girondins de Bordeaux

1987/88 - AS Monaco FC

1988/89 - Olympique de Marseille

1989/90 - Olympique de Marseille

1990/91 - Olympique de Marseille

1991/92 - Olympique de Marseille

1992/93 - no champion Olympique de Marseille stripped of title due to a corruption scandal)

1993/94 - Paris Saint-Germain FC

1994/95 - FC Nantes

1995/96 - AJ Auxerre

1996/97 - AS Monaco FC

1997/98 - RC Lens

1998/99 - Girondins de Bordeaux

1999/00 - AS Monaco FC

2000/01 - FC Nantes

2001/02 - Olympique Lyonnais

2002/03 - Olympique Lyonnais

2003/04 - Olympique Lyonnais

2004/05 - Olympique Lyonnais

2005/06 - Olympique Lyonnais

how is this NOT exactly what i said? Or did you just want to prove my point for me? If that's the case, thank you.

[Tisswat]

I don't see a traditional top three. Lyon has won what before 2001?

[superdupersang]

well, the bigger clubs have got chairmen and shareholders and need to be at the forefront of everything.

so they buy the best players, homegrown and overseas.

the smaller clubs nurture at the grassroots level.

its a vicious cycle and i cant see the balance of power shifting anytime soon.

the only chance is when a mega rich guy buys a club, like west ham.

[swisloc]

I don't see a traditional top three. Lyon has won what before 2001?

who's talking traditional? all i'm saying is that european soccer, right now and for the last decade has been extremely predictable. that's it.

for instance, if i ask everyone posting in this thread, "who will win the french league NEXT season," i bet 99% would say Lyon. this is a problem if you are looking for a competitive league.