Nas V Jay-Z

[Gouf]

Like all music, it comes down to preference.

Going back and forth like this isn't gonna change it. You got fodder for me and I got ammo for you. Ether was better. That chapter is done. Both guys are now very different representations of rap. I'm not gonna change you're mind about Jay and you're not gonna change mine about Nas. I will say this though: You might think calling dame dash a dummy isn't very clever, but it was his alliteration that was clever not necessarily the insult. Presentation is a big thing in rap. Many different sides of the spectrum you know.

Nuff said, I need to push out this lupe thread before someone else does.

[ktothe]

Like all music, it comes down to preference.

Going back and forth like this isn't gonna change it. You got fodder for me and I got ammo for you. Ether was better. That chapter is done. Both guys are now very different representations of rap. I'm not gonna change you're mind about Jay and you're not gonna change mine about Nas. I will say this though: You might think calling dame dash a dummy isn't very clever, but it was his alliteration that was clever not necessarily the insult. Presentation is a big thing in rap. Many different sides of the spectrum you know.

Nuff said, I need to push out this lupe thread before someone else does.

Im not trying to change your opinion. I pretty much said Ether was better. Im not writing of The Takeover though...

[Gouf]

^my bad, B. I was talkin to bonanz

[bonanz]

gouf, I never made a comment in this thread except in regard to ether v takeover (and that vol 3 and nastradamus were both terrible albums). I never stated an opinion about either rapper in general. you just assumed that I am a bigger Jay-z fan because I preferred takeover to ether and your nas stan-ism overcame your logic unit.

[ExileOnMainSt]

nas fans are always definitely more die-hard and "fuck jay-z".

I didn't like streets disciple, but I did like Black Album.

quoted for truth.

Goof your statements supporting Nas are valid, I disagree with some of them but you are really putting Jay down, saying hes commerical, a biter, this and that...

I love Nas, hes a nasty individual. When illmatic came out in 94, I listened to Represent on repeat for like 3 weeks. I was obsessed with any Nas AZ joint and all the unreleased Nas songs (theres tonnes of them, most better than the "filler" tracks he put out on I am, Nastradamus, Streets Disciple etc..) Blaze a 50, Poppa was a playa..

But reasonable doubt was the best hip hop cd ever made (IMO) and Jay-z is the best lyricist ever (IMO) and to get where Jay-z is at now, from what he started on Reasonable Doubt says alot about his abilities as a rapper.

Edit:

Oh yea, and SUPER UGLY was never offically released because JAY-Z's MOM told him she didn't want him to release something that harsh. Blueprint 2's Blueprint 2: "My momma cant save you this time, niggas is history".

Superugly was leaked via a Funk Flex mixtape.

[Gouf]

bonanz, I never said you were a bigger Jay-z fan. I simply defended my preference towards Nas. I don't know what a stan is, probably remnicent of the put down "herb", which was before my time. In anycase, I'm from the los angeles, we don't use that sort terminology within our slang. Sorry.

[bonanz]

I've wasted my time here

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=stan

_X6VoFBCE9k

[Gouf]

So am I supposed to know what a stan is because its in the urban dictionary?

The answer is no. Nobody cares about the urbandictionary. The urbandictionary defeats the purpose of slang. Thanks, go waste time somewhere else now.

[bonanz]

you are a fucking moron.

urban dictionary just saved me from typing it out you fucktard.

The term is even used by your beloved nas in your most treasured song...

fucking kids...

[ktothe]

One day, 5 years from now. Bonanz and Gouf will go on stage at Madison Square Gardens and hold hands in triumph, together, as friends and business partners.

[Gouf]

Oh, excuse me. This will save me time from typing it out:

I don't know what a stan is... In anycase, I'm from the los angeles, we don't use that sort terminology within our slang. Sorry.

[Spaghettini]

jay-z's a better business man, nas is a better MC. period. exclamation point.

[heBAY]

Ayooo... Gouf is buggin'...

The references or quoting is a thing in Hip Hop...has been since the jump...sounds like you keep that bullshit "Jay-Z steals everyone's lines" mp3 on loop before you post on here (obviously that mp3 was made by a Nas fanatic such as yourself).

I don't want to argue your opinion about Jay vs. Nas because:

a. it's YOUR opinion...

b. I don't know how old you are...and you could very well be a 16 ex-backpacker turned hypebeast...

c. (this is what makes me think you're a young kid who's on hypebeast way too much) YOU SAID JAY is on Lupe Fiasco's dick for bars...money...the first thing everyone said when they heard Fiasco is "he sounds like he took Jay-Z's flow and mannerisms and used it with a nerdier voice" (...with a little Kanye sprinkled on top...which is once again an ode to Jay-Z's style).

You played yourself with that one moneygrip. Eminem!??!?!?!?! Wow.

Oh...to answer the poll...I'd say Jay-Z over Nas just off of consistency. Battle-wise, I still say Jay-Z over Nas...especially now that Jay-Z OWNS Nas industry-wise. I liked "Takeover" way more than "Ether" (WAY more)...I thought "Ether" was kind of a juvenile, angry, name-calling event whereas Takeover was more on some "set the facts" straight...

Speakin' of facts...Nas saying "Rockefeller died of Aids" is probably the most retarded thing I've ever heard him say on record...MAYBE (he's said some pretty outlandish shit). It's my understanding that NO Rockefeller passed from the AIDS virus (how is that even possible with all of the money they had/have...this is America folks)...David Rockefeller, I think, started an AIDS charity-fund. I'm pretty sure about this, which makes me just shrug off a lot of Nas' antics as pseudo-intellect.

[ktothe]

Supposedly that line isnt pointed at the famous American family but rather the person that Jay and Dame supposedly named the company after Rocafella, who was a dboy that did die of aids.

Who knows....

[heBAY]

...all of that said...Illmatic and It Was Written are incredible albums...Lost Tapes (which was the first version of I AM with two new songs) is a great LP...loved a lot of Nas verses/cameos on other songs and mixtapes...and still think Nas is relevant and capable of making a good song today.

Unfortunately, I have been losing interest in Jay-Z...IMO, his last two albums were very sub-par for the standards he's set for himself...and I'm just getting tired of the dude...never thought I'd say that...plus I'm growing older and the whole "OH! This is SO incredible baby!" intro tlaking shit is dumb corny to me now...though I understand why he does it (it's his "thing"...he's a product and that's how people know him)... but all of that said, he's still nicer than most popular rappers out today.

Oh and IF I HEAR ANOTHER BIG OR PAC REFERENCE FROM EITHER ONE...I'MA THROW MYSELF IN FRONT OF A TRAIN.

[heBAY]

Supposedly that line isnt pointed at the famous American family but rather the person that Jay and Dame supposedly named the company after Rocafella, who was a dboy that did die of aids.

Who knows....

Iiiiiinteresting...shows what reading books does...it fucks up my facts...the HOOD FAXXTTSSSS!!

[heBAY]

not to be a post-whore...but Exile had a good point about Pac's "Me and My Girl..." and Nas' "I Gave You Power"...

what's great is that hardly anyone knows of or cites Organized Konfusion's "Stray Bullet"...which both of the aforementioned songs could be "stealing" from. It's rhyming as a bullet...but wtf, it's the same song principle-wise...touches on the same topics of gun violence in inner city neighborhoods and all of that good stuff.

Who's accusing who of stealing though...I thought No Idea's Original...right?

[penfold]

jayz is the best as an mc..he spits so many rhymes that go over the top of peoples heads with double/triple meanings and his volume of work and consitency makes him the best.

Nas is also very nice but Jay has the edge,,,he has done some interesting isht such as rewind but my vote is with jigga

[ktothe]

jayz is the best as an mc..he spits so many rhymes that go over the top of peoples heads with double/triple meanings

Niggas is dumb, i guess.

I can safely say he's never once gone over my head. However I can safely say I probably only recently have been able to fully understand and relate to Illmatic.

[brightbill]

Niggas is dumb, i guess.

I can safely say he's never once gone over my head. However I can safely say I probably only recently have been able to fully understand and relate to Illmatic.

Truth. Reasonable Doubt is amazing, I'm no Nas stan (I think), but Jay-Z operates on a much simpler level than Nas. Jay always has and always will be more commercially oriented - look at "Ain't No Nigga" on RD and "Izzo" & "Jigga That Nigga" & "Girls Girls Girls" on Blueprint and try to find their counterpoint among Illmatic and Stillmatic.

Jay makes simpler songs to sell records. Maybe that's why he owns a record label and dates Beyonce now. Nas, though is simply one of the best, most affecting rapper out there. I can play Jay and definitely appreciate his flow and beats, but Nas music represents sheer artistry.

[Carl]

such a tired arguement, but...

Has Nas ever done anything remotely near the level of Heart Of The City?

[cheep]

ny state of mind maybe.

besides illmatic i dont really like nas... you can tell he writes everything. i bet hed get his ass handed to him if he tried to freestyle, and that is a big part of being an mc to me.

[heBAY]

^true...he's okAY off the top...at least back in the Stretch & Bob days.

But seriously...cats act as if Jay-Z is on some "I feel the wind...5,6,7,8,9,10" shit. That whole "Jay-Z is more simple cause he's commercial" argument is retarded...Jay-Z is by no means simple...he's a MC who uses wit as a vehicle for his content...Nas is more of an abstract/"poetic" (in the cliche'ish sorta way..."cause it sounds pretty") type of MC...which is great for when he stays in his lane and does what he does best.

For anyone to claim that Jay is NOT witty at all...well, shit, you either just hate him that much not to recognize it for what it is...or you just don't know what real mc shit is. Lyrical doesn't have to be Rakim or KRS...it could also be Slick Rick.

[heBAY]

I really think the timing of the first impression had an effect on a lot of Jay-Z haters perceptions. Reasonable Doubt came at a time where shit started to get shakey with "cristal, coke, and cash (mafioso don)" rap...so it was easier to be like "oh wait...fuck this guy...he's on that crime and money rap shit..."...even though Jay had already BEEN known for being nice as shit with flow and clever lines. I don't know a soul who didn't think Jay was a stand-out performer when it came to his days with Original Flavor, The Originators, "Show & Prove" (the BDK single), and even the first version of "In My Lifetime" (which dropped a while before "Dead Presidents"...although the video for "Lifetime" had him at a mansion...but so did plenty of G Rap and Wu Tang and nobody said shit to that)...

This being said, most of these people heard Nas from Illmatic...an album that came out at an incredible time where the East Coast was really coming back on some potent lyrical shit...in response to all of the West Coast G-shit. To me, both are fuckin' classic albums...Jay's LP is longer by a few songs...and I can honestly do without "Ain't No Nigga"...but that doesn't mean it's less good than Illmatic, or that he was simple and corny on it...I've just been sick of hearing that song since '96.

P.S. I have no idea why people mention "Girls Girls Girls" as a sugar'y "commercial" single...it is actually a great fuckin' song...the beat and the verses are on point...especially when considering that this single came out at a time where Triton keyboard beats were the trademark for a club banger (usually the only type of single that could be made)...the Neptunes, Swizz (at the end of his 1st return), and Timbaland still ran shit at the time. That album was something that created the whole Just Blaze, Kanye West sped up soul sample shit in the mainstream market......it's a great angle at how to appeal to the masses and not be coonin' on some Diddy shit with dancey, no-content-having jingles (and I mean that literally...wasn't it like he just looped up popular songs from a decade or two before and threw bells over them).

[ExileOnMainSt]

this is sort of irrelevant to the topic, but besides Jay-z being better than Nas, if I were to name the top 5 dead or alive, Nas wouldnt even make the list

[ktothe]

Who would? Im genuinely interested.

[seemeugly]

???

[ktothe]

I for one dont think he is paying homage, he is biting. Clearly biting. If it was any other rapper you would agree. Most of his fans cant identify the orignals...

With that said, I dont care he still spits hot fire.

I heard Reasonable Doubt, you heard it too. The talent is there.

[seemeugly]

Nas vs. Jay raises interesting questions about the value of technical proficiency vs. creativity.

[NESK]

id say the best way to comapre them is to line up their hardest and weakest tracks.

money aint a thang - owe me back

99 problems - made you look

i cant call either. leaning toward made you look>99 problems, though.