yung_flynn

@chicote Thanks! @Double 0 Soul I really like the fit of these and I'm happy that I erred on the side of caution. I can wear a size 31 in modern day one-wash Sugar Cane 1947's, but it's a bit of a squeeze after a wash. I probably could have gotten into a size 32 for the M41001 without too much issue, but my waist is not getting any slimmer than it is today. I generally like to size on the conservative end anyway to get a little extra rise and thigh room since I'm pretty big for my waist size. I feel like the pattern is more balanced that way.

As promised, here are the waist measurements before and after shrinking. Here are the tabulated measurements for the M41001 before and after shrinking. I shrunk these by machine washing in warm water and line drying. Measurements given as before/after/% change in both centimeters and inches. Waist: 41.5 cm/38.5 cm/8% 16.5"/15.2"/8% Front Rise: 33 cm/30.5 cm/7.7% 13"/12"/7.7% Thigh at crotch:33 cm/32 cm/3% 13"/12.7"/3% Thigh @ 10 cm down: 32.5 cm/30.5 cm/4% 12.5"/12"/4% Leg Opening: 24 cm/22.5 cm/6.5% 9.5"/8.9"/6.5% Inseam: 91.5 cm/86.5 cm/5% 36"/34.25"/5% Also some post-shrinking fit pics are below.

@MJF9 I like the look of those S3100VX's. I kind of lost track of Samurai because they had too many models for me to remember and their limited editions did not really appeal to me, I had kind of forgotten that I have always liked their simpler models. I feel like they usually look good on most people too, including cuts that do not really appeal to me. @Geeman I also had a pair of S211VX briefly. I realized that they were far too tapered for my taste and to be practical for me because the leg opening circumference was smaller than my foot, which is a struggle as a big guy with a small waist. I got rid of mine when I decided that I couldn't and didn't want to struggle trying to pull my feet through, especially once we had a newborn. The fit was pretty well done though even if it was not my usual preference. It didn't really have the carrot look that I do not like for most tapered cuts. I don't remember anything like that pocket issue, but most of my attention was directed at the leg opening

I'm dropping a few more photos that I captured of the M41001, which I missed the first time. Jeans are now in process of being shrunk. I will show the before and after measuring tape photos of the waist along with fit once they've fully air dried (probably later in weekend or next week). The back of all the fly buttons are stamped with "S"

Back of top button has the S stamp

Denime/Vintage Frostproof/Hollows/Buzz/Franks My first photo attempt was in front of our cedar planks but sun flares creeped into frame at that time of day in that spot

My pair of cloth patched M41001's arrived this afternoon. They definitely seem rigid and deadstock from 1997 with the shrink-to-fit sticker still attached. There was no cardboard flasher though. Was there one at some point or did this model not have one? I was in a bit of a hurry, but I tried to snap a few detail shots for posterity's sake. I plan to shrink these when a get a chance (either this weekend or in a few weeks). Let me know if there are any others that you'd like me to snap beforehand or if there are any that you would like a more ca refully focused shot of. Photo resolution should be better if you click on the image. I have raw measurements as well and will post before and after fit photos and measurements once they're shrunk

For what it's worth, the No. 2 blouse is a really nice jacket for warmer weather. I find the huge and flapless pocket very handy as well. The No. 2 jeans are pretty great for hot weather too. Mine got a lot of mileage last summer, but much less so in the winter. I can see how the price differential for the No. 2 blouse compared to the 20s jacket isn't the most appealing though if all one wants is just a lighter weight Type 1 for summer. The details for the No. 2 are pretty fun at least

I have a few in WAYWT and a few others that I found. No back pics since the initial wear in the cross post above

@Broark My pair are tagged 32. They started at 16.75” laid flat. After one cold wash and hang dry they shrunk to 15.5”. With wear, another wash, and some more wear, they have equilibrated at 16.1”. They probably would have stretched a bit more if I sized for a tight initial fit but I sized conservatively. As they’ve stretched, the fit has relaxed a bit so that they hang from my hips. Kato-San was very helpful with sizing help. I was on the fence between 31 and 32. I told him that I generally prefer jeans that measure 41 cm laid flat and he said that either would work but recommended the 32 because they wouldn’t stretch much further than my waist and would have better balance. I just measured now and they’re 41 cm on the nose.

Cross-post of my chambray pocket bagged s0001xx before washing. Cross-post of that same pair (including measurements) after washing.

Some details from the Rockets site are pasted below. All taken from Rockets's site. Thorough dissection of original jeans. Ordering needs to be done by Instagram outside of Japan however (probably only thing that I've used IG for personally). Custom stamped and engraved hidden rivets: Twisted tab Front button Front rivets 1937 model cinch

I feel like enough people probably have pairs from Rockets now and that there is enough chatter about them in the Unknown Japanese Brands thread that they can get their own thread. There is also limited information on the brand that I could easily find, so it would be nice to have it documented as best as possible here. Most of the information below comes from their website and some chatting with Kato-san. Rockets have been around since 1994 (which is actually longer than Warehouse, the last of the Osaka 5) and were founded by Yasunobu Kato. However, it's unclear to me if they have been producing denim since the beginning. They've historically offered a 1937 cut (0003xx model) a WW2 cut (this s0001xx model), a 1947 (0002xx model), and a 1966 cut (SB-100). Kato-san can also customize a pair for you to cover some of the transitional early war models. WW2 models are offered with either olive HBT or chambray pocket bags. There are also several models of WW2 era jackets with various details, including with and without pocket flaps, although I do not know much about these since the sleeves are too short for me. The primary claim to fame and specialty of Rockets has been their WW2 models and their denim which is known for its heavy lap fades and whiskers. The phrase "Tiger Moustache" on their patches refers to the way in which these whiskers resemble those on a tiger. Kato-san has spent years analyzing vintage fabric from the era to best replicate it, matching the yarn count of the era. It's unclear where the denim is milled. According to the owner Kato-san, the yarns used in the denim have been dyed more than 12 times, so the denim is very dark and will be slow to fade compared to Warehouse or new Denime. After a wash, the denim is a very dark blue that is almost grey/black in appearance with a gritty and coarse handfeel. It creases easily and quickly gets some electric blue highlights, so I can see how these jeans get such pronounced whiskering. In talking with Kato-san, the 1937 model uses the same denim as the WW2 models sold by Rockets. I'm not sure about the 1947 model (although I would guess that it's also the same) and I'm very unclear what is used for the 1966 model (not sure if I've even seen a photo of a pair). Four types of cotton thread are used to sew the garments: No. 30, No. 20, No. 8, and No. 6. The waist is seen with thick No. 6 and No. 8 threads, while the selvedge is sewn with No. 6 thread, consistent with Kato-san's vintage models. The hem is wrapped in four pieces as was typical for vintage pairs prior to the 1960's. Threads are dyed orange and yellow based on estimates for the era. The dyes used on the threads are also selected for low fastness, so they will fade along with the denim. Rockets models also come with a red rayon tab labelled "Venus". The tab is designed to twist significantly after washing. Rockets also owns 3 Union Special sewing machines Rockets have also taken a lot of care to reproduce the style and character of buttons and rivets and buttons of the era. Laurel donut top buttons are used for the WW2 pairs, while iron body buttons are used on the 1937 and 1947 models. WW2 models with chambray pocket bags seem to use iron body buttons for the rest of the fly, while donut buttons are used for the fly of the HBT versions. All buttons are iron and are designed to rust. Front pocket rivets were designed to have a diameter of 10 mm, consistent with vintage rivets. According to the Rockets site, most front rivets used by other brands are 9 mm in diameter. Two types of front rivets are used - copper and iron plated. Hidden rivets are a non-standard shape to capture the shape of those seen on War models. Rockets hand stamps their hidden rivets into the desired shape and then hand engraves them. Rockets offers several versions of their models. There is a standard version where all hardware is new. There is also a "Craft" version, where you can select to use already oxidized hardware. Rockets also offers a "Tailor Made" line of models that are more expensive than their standard "Factory Made" models. Taylor Made models are about 15,000 yen more expensive. The 1937 model seems to be sold as Taylor Made with a claim of being sewn on a vintage machine. I chatted with Kato-san, but I wasn't quite able to learn what this meant in terms of final product, so I just went with a standard model for myself. I will try to add some more details and edit as I have time and learn more. I will also try to locate and cross-post some of the stray pairs found in the WW2 and Unknown Japanese Brands threads here too as I find the time

I find the fetishization of uncomfortable jeans fascinating. I can't imagine choosing to put on pants that are miserable to wear, much less paying exorbitant prices to do so.

I saw these and couldn't help but chuckle. Weird Guy - Super Heavyweight 40oz Selvedge | Naked & Famous Denim – Tate + Yoko Take a look at the patch (30 oz of cowhide): The owner gave them a ringing endorsement: "Naked & Famous Denim Owner, Brandon Svarc, likes to joke 'Guaranteed uncomfortable or your money back.'" They are also perversely shrink-to-fit with only the loosest of shrinkage estimates and in a slim tapered cut which feels like a recipe for fit disaster, especially at $2000.

Shh... Perplexity.ai is listening

Denime/Cushman/Rockets/Red Wing The Rockets are starting to show some highlights in the knees after a wash from crawling after my son. They really crease and crinkle in the lap too

I ended up winning the auction on the M41001s. They’re a bit more than I would have preferred to pay but there’s not too many ones with arcs in my size and that condition. I’m excited to see what they’re like once they arrive.

Thanks! This is helpful. I'm tall so inseam is always my biggest struggle. 33 - 34" should be great. I can wear either a 31 or 32 in modern 1947s, so I probably could get away with either a 32 or 33 here. For what it's worth, the 33 waist M-series has essentially the same raw measurements across the board as my size 32 Rockets, which I like the fit of plus an extra inch in the inseam (my main critique for the Rockets). I'm never going to get any slimmer either. The real question is whether to snag the sized 33 M41001 or size 32 M41027, but only I can answer that one

How much do these shrink in the waist and inseam from the tagged size? I would probably have snagged one by now but I can’t decide if a 32 or 33 would be better (ideally to equilibrate at 40 - 41 cm waist). Tagged 31 work pretty well in modern day one-wash Sugar Cane

Another arced version of the M41001 (cloth patch version) in a good size for a decent price - tagged 33/36. They look to be unwashed, unsoaked, and unworn too based off the measurements. SUGAR CANE M41001D ノンウォッシュ リジット W33 新品 デッドストック シュガーケーン スマイルステッチ セルビッチ ボタンフライ 90's item details | JDirectItems Auction | One Map by FROM JAPAN One day, I'll probably cave and grab one of these for myself.

One of the things that I miss about living in Evanston was being able to run next to the frozen Lake Michigan in winter with a view of the Chicago skyline In theory, we’re only 30 minutes from Lake Huron now but far from actual open water. Thankfully, the trade-off is that there are lots more forested areas here which are also beautiful in late winter

@ASTRO I have a well-worn pair of the Duck Digger 1947 version of the 1001xx in size 31, also in Banner Denim I believe. They've been through many machine washes and dries now. I took some measurements using the Bears method (except for thigh at crotch which they don't report). I feel like they fit slimmer through the thigh and slightly wider in the waist in my experience with them than usual. I'd say that the size 31 though is roughly in the same sizing ballpark as a size 31 from Sugar Cane or a 32 from TCB. Waist (laid flat): 16.2” Thigh at crotch: 11.75” Thigh 10 cm down from crotch: 10.5” Front Rise: 11.75” Knee (eyeballed based on knee bay): 9” Leg opening: 8.25” Inseam: 31” The inseam stayed at 32" for a long time as long as I was careful to hang dry and gently tug on the hems. Once I had a baby, I lost patience for that and they shrunk to their present length (sadly much shorter than I prefer since 32" was even pushing it). They're a great pair of jeans though in great denim. Pulling them out to measure them made me want to put them on again despite their length.

Channeling my best Kit Carruthers from Badlands on a beautiful spring day in Michigan Denime/Whitesville/TCB/Lucchese

TCB/Cushman/Buzz (wrinkly after crawling around after my tot)/Alden