wild_whiskey

Quote: wild_whiskey did you wash your APC? if you didn't, can you measure the waist of your unisex (size 29?). Probably, if I don't fit into a 30 then it will be a motivation to work out, loose weight and wear it.

I can but not for a good week, I'm at my parents for spring break and only brought one pair of jeans with me

Size 0 (XS) : 36

Size 1 (S) : 38

Size 2 (M) : 40

Size 3 (L) : 42

That basically sums it up.

Quote: I don't see how "the machines are so different that it will effect the denim", and nor does the mill that produces it.

I think he's referring to the fact that the shuttle looms are antique and have been used lots, while the newer looms are just that.. newer. So naturally, even if they are meant to make the exact same weave, they will produce a slightly different denim because of the nature of how the machines were created and how long they've been around. I would assume the shuttle looms would create a slightly more imperfect denim surface, as an evolution in technology generally means a step towards a more perfect/symmetrical/boring () product.

From what I gather, they are no longer being made as the factory that made them in San Fransisco was shut down. Most members here get them deadstock off of eBay or Aero.

http://www.ebay.com

http://www.aeroleatherclothing.com/

ROFL Serge.

Quote: thanks whiskey, 36 is the size that's already been shrunk... so the apc unisex feels pretty much similar to the shrink to fit right? or am i just wrong hahaha

They are a little slimmer, and much lower rise than shrink to fit. They are a little more stiff when you buy them, the color is a richer blue, and the stitching is superior in quality. They are *not* shrink to fit, however. They are cut a little oversized in the waist measurement, but not enough to justify going all the way down to size 34. Use your own disgression here - if you feel like you have more room in the waist of your Levi's STF than you need, and you want them to be a bit tighter, go down to the 35. If you like the way your Levi's STF fit at 36, go with the 36. In general though, they are fairly similar to the 501 in the legs, but less tapered. The butt is considerably more fitted (which is a very good thing, the 501 ass is saggy and shaped like a sail).

Quote: While we're on the topic of sizing...besides dry cleaning, what's the best way to minimize shrinkage, especially lengthwise? I was thinking washing them in very cold water and then letting them hang dry, but then again I've never done this before. Anyone?

This depends on what we're talking. Un-sanforized jeans (i.e. Denime, Levis STF) will shrink no matter how hard you try, and they are extra long to accomodate for that. Sanforized jeans like A.P.C. and Nudie will shrink 2-5% (that's max 1.6 inches on a 32 inseam), but you can pull on the legs while the jeans are still wet from washing. APC jeans are pretty long, I think 34" inseam, so shrinking won't be a problem for most people. ALWAYS hang dry your raw jeans.

Edited by wild_whiskey on Mar 27, 2005 at 01:38 PM

Oh, and they are very durable. Both APCs and Helmuts.

justaname - unisex is sanforized and will shrink 2% or so with washing, so if you buy them do not get your size in 501 shrink-to-fit, you should measure the waist of your shrink-to-fits after they have shrunk and fit well, and that should be the size you order. It sounds like a size 34 or 35 to me.

Helmut Lang jeans are very cool - however as I try to mention as often as possible, they are very tight. They are the tightest jeans I own (and I like to wear them fitted, so this says something). I do not actually consider them to be comfortable because of how fitted they are. The fabric's he uses are pretty soft though, but I cannot speak for unwashed jeans from HL as I don't own any.

The APC unisex jeans are about the same rise, with a looser, more 3-dimensional seat cut (if this makes sense) and looser legs all the way down. I do consider the APC unisex to be on the slimmer side in the legs and seat, so don't think that it's baggy or full cut - they're definitely a slim jean. Geowu, if you buy the Unisex, I advise one size down for a closer fit, but not 2 or 3 sizes down, unless your standard is 2-3 sizes too big. I have a very skinny waist, and a 29 is basically a perfect fit for me, 28 would be a little too uncomfortable. If you're willing to sacrifice comfort in the upper hip area (where the jeans sit), you could go two sizes down, as the denim will stretch over time if pulled harshly.

Serge, I'm pretty sure the Anglais rise is = to the New Standards (unisex) rise.

Edited by wild_whiskey on Mar 25, 2005 at 10:38 AM

The 103XX looks very, very nice. Cheaper than 5EP!

The Anglaise will *never* be a slim fit, unless you were to order 4 sizes down or so. Really. It's a full-cut jean. The New Standard jeans (unisex) have a low waist and a slim fit. Why is it that you want the Anglaise over the the unisex? The denim is the same - I think it's around 12.5oz.

United is so much better than Alphabetical.

get Unisex, and order it one size down from your Diesel size. And if they don't fit - RETURN THEM! A.P.C. is generally pretty cool about returns for internet orders, but not if you've worn them in.

Not everyone hates it, just those who do feel the necessity squeal about it like a castrated pig.

I like AA lots, and every fashion designer I know has only praise for them.

The 201 is a seperate jean from the 501. There is no mistake.

It looks like the one on the right *might* be fake, judging by what looks like subpar stitching and lower quality denim. did you get them off eBay?

Serge, what jeans is that picture in your sig from?

I keep re-reading your response, looking for some concrete reason as to why selvage denim is preferred aside from it being an historal attraction, as you put it, to the provenance and culture of quality jeans. I can understand this; it's comparable to horology, in which an aficianado would always prefer the refinement and precision of an automatic movement, despite it being less accurate than a simple quartz movement.

It looks like this whole time I've just been disillusioned into thinking that denim from a shuttle loom had better texture and quality than from a projectile loom, and that an attractive selvage end was just an extra touch to signify the extra work and resource consumption that goes into making the higher quality denim. It is more a lurking variable, that manufacturers of denim put in that extra touch, but it does not necessarily mean that the denim itself has superlative quality (at least compared to wide-loom denim).

I understand that much as it seems to fall into common sense that the edge finishing and fabric width really has nothing to do with denim quality... mainly what I am concerned with is knowing whether or not a yard of denim from a shuttle loom is different than a yard of denim from a projectile loom, presumably with the same base fabric.

Perhaps I'm misunderstanding what you're saying - are you saying that selvage denim is no different in wear than non-selvage? I could have sworn reading on the 45rpm website that denim made from the shuttle loom is a tighter, textured weave and thus creates a better palette for fading and wear.

Quote: Hey Wild_Whiskey, where are your 3?

Ahh the master himself wears Denime! This amounts to little shock

Nudie

APC

Kunna

raise your hand if youre waiting for RingRing to post on this one. mines up.

Agree with Serge. I too have a pair of the unisex jeans - they have a great shape. They are a little bit too big though on the waist.

kindofblue, you should call them and ask for a phone order. They have excellent customer service and will ship quickly.

edwin - I dont know about the RED jeans, I assume perhaps a less popular Levis store might have them in; the one in San Francisco did not when I was there.

The quantities that SF gets must be limited then, because they had practically nothing in their Vintage section: a couple pairs of ultra distressed repros, one distressed repro jacket, and some t-shirts if I can remember correctly. The workers really had no idea what I was talking about when I asked if they had "Deadstock repros," and I even put it into laymen's terms and just said "Do you have the rigid ones?" to no avail. I really wanted to come home with a deadstock repro jacket.

that is a beautiful effect.

Wow, thats a sweet idea. I may do that for my first wash.