Dr_Heech

1944's (..cont.)

Inside pockets: calico cotton on 2003, striped shirt material on '05. Check out the black bar-tack stitch vs yellow bar-tacking which attaches the belt loops.

Watch pocket position/shape. Rivets are plain on 2003.

Rivets on 2005 are a mix of plain and stamped.

V stitch 2003

2005

Both pairs are tagged 36/36, both measure 36 dead.

Last lot of comparisons then.

1944 S501xx, 2003 vs 2005.

2005 edition is darker. 2003 denim is identical to earlier, 555 repros

Back pocket shapes and arcs (left 2003, right 2005)

Leather patch 2003 (brownish tone to embossed print)

2005 (nice finish-off stitching, bottom right) Red tone embossed print

Inside leg stitch spacing: Left '03, right '05.

Crotch stitching '03

Crotch stitching '05

More to follow...

I like the 98 denim better, looks almost black and I also like the dullness of it.

To be honest, I've yet to try out the 2005 55's, but the 98's and 2003 both have a unique-ness to them when soaked + washed. The denim on the '05 looks more shiny, but I think they will dull a bit when put through their 1st soak+wash.

I will take one pair each in size 38. Thanks.

Funny you should say that.

I've also got a pair of the 2005 55's in a 38/36.

I'll add 'em to the list.

Comparisons of my 1955's as requested (I forget who originally asked).

1955 501xx's from1998, 2003 and 2005.

Apologies, but I've tried to compare the difference in denim, but my camera just really isn't up to the job.

Valencia Street, San Antonio and Taylor Toggs factories respectively.

The 1998 edition is darker than the 2003. The 2005 is as dark as the 98, but more shiny in appearance.

From left to right: 1998/2003/2005

Back pockets:1998

2003 (note: chalk mark on pocket stitch - a reoccurring theme throughout post 2002 jeans.

2005: wobbly stitching. colour is lighter yellow than previous models, and more noticably the yellow rows of top stitch on the outside (rather than on the inside of previous years)

1998 rivet and belt loop

2003

2005

Tagged waist sizes are 36, But measured waist sizes vary-

1998 = 36" dead, 2003 = 37" dead, and 2005 measure a hair under 38" !

(LoL) I also don't work for Levis and think they LVC do some things good and could imporve on others. I think there 1955s are one of their more accurate repros.

Amen to that!

Why are the 555s unquestionably better than the 2005 except for the single stitched arcuate? For example, how do you know that the denim on the 555s is more accurate? And how do you know which color stitching on the backpockets is more correct?

I have the 555 201s from 98 or 99, I forget, and I thought the bright orange on the backpockets made them look like Nudies.

Who said anything about accuracy?

I was giving my personal preferrence in relation to the two pairs of 201's compared to each other.

As I told you before, If I wanted accuracy, I would shell out for an original.

Levis Vintage clothing replicas IMO is the closest we mere working mortals can get (and afford..!) to the original historical garments.

But it is just that; A close replica (..and full of inaccuracies, but beautifull in it's own right). People are entitled to their own opinions and preferrences. Get used to it.

yes would be cool to see some fit pics of your lees.

This was one of two pairs I bought in 2002. I wore the shit out of them and sold them on ebay 2 years ago. This is the only photo I have.

I have still got the other pair BNWT. These Lees wear like iron!

Thanks guys,

yeah the 1999 version is unquestionably better, but the 2005 Arcs can be altered very easily - as this is the only 'stand out' difference. The denim on the 1999 201's is definately greener in cast, but unfortunately my simple camera cannot define this detail.

I've crossed-posted these to the 201 thread, also there's a pic of some original wartime 201's - check'em out!

201 comparisons cont...

Compare the watch pocket position:

And denim: 1999's

and 2005's

Front pocket stitching

and rivet colours

I know this is probably in the wrong thread, but it's just an extra added comparison.

Details of Levis 1929 201, from May 1999 vs

Levis 1920's 201, from S1 2005.

Firstly, inside tags:

Guess which has the correct Arcs? (no prizes)

Pocket shape is basically the same

Check the different colour inside stitching (white vs orange)

And lighter colour pocket stitch on the 2005's

Compared to the 555's

.

Havent checked this thread lately,lovely pics at the top,Dr. Heech! Dont know how much you care,but if you want traintracks I would iron the inseams with hot steam.I didnt with my daughters pair and one inseam is folded over.not that it bothers me much...

Ha Ha Ha, would +rep you again but cant !

Was discussing this with my wife earlier (to lots of eye rolling), as it's something I've ALWAYS done with my Lvc.

Cheers Almostnice.

201 comparisons cont...

Compare the watch pocket position:

And denim: 1999's

and 2005's

Front pocket stitching

and rivet colours

Please forgive my OCDD, I cant help myself...

Comparison of details of Levis 1929 201, from May 1999 vs

Levis 1920's 201, from S1 2005. Just because.

Firstly, inside tags:

Guess which has the correct Arcs? (no prizes)

Pocket shape is basically the same

Check the different colour inside stitching (white vs orange)

And lighter colour pocket stitch on the 2005's

Compared to the 555's

Pre-wash pics of my Son's H+M selvedge jean and the little bag, discussed earlier, which accompanies the jeans. Cant wait 'till He's old enough to wear 'em (probably have 8" bucket turn-ups due to little leggys though). Dont mind how much He wears the crap out of them, cheaper than vintage child-size Levis.

Beautifull print on the bag. Lvc take note!

For those of you who asked me to put further pics of my Lvc collection (all are BNWT), detailing comparisons of different years/models - I will try to get the photos done this weekend, and hopefully post them next week.

Requests were for:-

201's (555 vs 2005)

S501xx (554 vs 2005)

'55 501xx (555 vs 554 vs 2005)

If I've forgotten anything or anyone wants details of other models, look back in this thread or ask me, I'll see what I can do.

Thanks to both Patch and Fardin for those links.

Not a big fan of post-war Lee's myself as they're a bit too slim in the thighs. Prefer 1924-1942 period. I have the 1936 101 Lee 'hair-on-hides' from 2002, and Two pairs of 1930 101 Lee cowboy pants.

Maybe I'll get some pics soon.

Oh fardin, I had the 'Vintage Denim' book by david little, which had a better, more fuller photo of the transitional Riders jacket inside. But IMO the book is not worth the hype. I would have loved to have been alive during the '45-'47 period, just to see what was going on in the Kansas factories..

Thanks Fardin.

Interesting comparisons. Can you link me to the warehouse site again, just so I can have a quick scan?

BTW, I think we are both 100% in agreement of the Lee jacket history.

It's been a personal quest of mine for two decades. Did you read all the extra info I put into that post? What did you think of the Lee Riders jacket with the cowboy buttons on Amazon?

I nearly forgot, two contrasting ads from DUDE RANCHER (1941), showing that even though the "lazy S" stitching may not have actually appeared until 1944, it was already on the drawing board.

From PT's book (P43)

From Denim (lightining book)

very cool, thanks dr.

looks like the guy in the second pic is wearing some nice 30s lee cowboy jacket??

The film is from 1920 and He's wearing a Levis 213. Shame we cant see the jeans waistband (pre-belt-loop 501's or 201's!)

thanks , nice dr heech.

interestign i didnt know they also had the laurel leaf buttons. i only know the repros with the cowboy buttons. the prize is killer. but the description is wrong considering the dates ( lee riders 1931). i might buy one. is there any difference in the cut, comparing it to the 1930s version? i still like the 1930s more, for the cinch and the right hand denim and the tripple stitching . but the wartime pockets are nice. do you think those are shorter?

I've added the other info.

I used to have one in a sz 42 (large). They are the same, size wise, as my 1934 Lee Jacket and they are early repros, from 2002/3. Yellow stitch, cowboy buttons and the UFO rivets. The denim is OUTSTANDING ! Goes well with the 1944 101B's. They are identical, to my knowledge, as the 1934 version, in length and cut.

Fardin,

just photo'd these for your consideration.

More pics to back up/further the Lee cowboy/riders discussion. I know I'm repeating myself a bit, but bear with me.

We've seen the Lee 101J cowboy jacket. This is the 2nd cowboy version produced during the war years (note: no buckle on back) - www.aeroleatherclothing.com sell the Lee japan repro version of this, check out their discription. Some have the Lee cowboy buttons, some have the Laurel leaf buttons.

Then in 1946 the NEW Lee Riders jacket was introduced.

And two more showing the details mentioned in Paul's Ad

Everthing changed between 1944-1946, Lee Cowboy became Lee Riders (on advertising AND jeans/jacket buttons). This is obviously a well known fact. Paul's book states this on P63 (top right).

The jackets on P46 (IMO from 1945) and P55 (from 1960-62) are exactly the same, apart from the blanket lining (101-J - 101-LJ).

Remember the Housemark label was used up until 1946 (P46). Both jackets have LEE RIDERS on the buttons.

Sorry I dont know how to link properly, but if you go onto www.amazon.co.uk, go: books, go: vintage denim, You will see a copy of David little's: DENIM: an American story. On the cover is a photo of the Lee Riders jacket (circa 1945-46) but with Lee COWBOY buttons (you'll have to enlarge the image). I've only ever seen one of those. It's another overlapping Cowboy/Riders version. In David Little's 'vintage denim' book there is also the same pic(inside the book)

Sorry to waffle on, but to me it's more evidence to back up our earlier discussion on the 101J, which IMO was introduced in 1932

Early 101-J label on pleated jacket.

Hope it's all clear?

Dont know if this is the right thread. From my cowboy films book (I've watched more 5 reels from the 20's/30's than I can remember)

From the 2nd "lightining denim book".

Not from 2002 or 2007,but a pair of pre-war (1937-1941) 201's.

Hidden rivets + no suspender buttons and yellow stitching. Obviously, crotch rivet removed in 1941.

Hey guys,

Is this the jacket you're referring to?

I'm sure a found this picture from somewhere on this thread but when I looked again I couldn't find it. What is it? And does anyone know where I might be able to get one?

Thanks

Just thought I'd let you know that there are TWO for sale on Ebay, one in the UK (SZ large, deadstock) and one in the US (SZ X-large, one wash). Both with booklets - They're both early editions, made in 2000, and have the coverted middle back seam.

Dont know how to link, but just put in 'Lvc levis' in the search box.. and bingo!