428CJ

I, for one, like the look of the more-square-than-usual pockets on the LVC '66s.

Exactly. Different people, different factories, pockets made ahead of time en masse. They are all over the place in both depth, symmetry, and height on the pockets. I am sure LVC just based the design off of one particular pair, or noticed a trend among the jeans of that era, from their vault. They are obviously shallower than most, but they don't seem like an extreme aberration, or like they are trying hard to look "freehand" to me.

Huh? That first sentence is confusing. The spacing between the two arcuate lines is set by the spacing of the double needles on the sewing machine used. Not sure they are "trying" to achieve a freehand look so much as basing the arcs off of an example of the real deal in their archives. I'm also not sure where being washed or not comes into play.

LVC 1966s? Looks great to me. I like all kind and manner of Levi's arcs, and those are no exception. I love the big pockets of the '66s, and the interesting looking shallow dip on the arcs. My pair after their first wash (posted above on this page):

Also, jeans at $375, and simple/classic denim shirts at $395 does not compute to me. If it was a "fancy" western shirt, it might make more sense.

He started advertising $400 shirts today, with a promise that a pre-order batch of 10 will be done by New Year's Day, 2020. That's real classy, seeing how he has people out there waiting who paid over five years ago.

^ ^ ^ I don't have any of the Japanese denim versions, and I likely won't, unless I happen to fall in to them very cheap. Nothing against it, but I loaded up on Cone LVC in 2017 and 2018. It'll take me probably a decade or more before I might have it all broken in and be ready for more! Then I've got Wranglers, Lees, etc. to work on. Pretty sure I won't ever need to buy LVCs again.

Gave my LVC '66s their first dose of water today. LVC 1966 (Cone Mills denim), 36-34, purchased November, 2017. Worn 100 days raw and single cuffed. That is total wear, not consecutive wear. I did a 20 day stint, a 50 day stint, and a 30 day stint, over the space of about a year and 10 months. I don't keep anything in my back pockets, except the occasional piece of paper, and very rarely my phone (but only while standing). I keep my wallet in my front right pocket. I carry my keys on a carabiner clipped to my right belt loop. First wash/rinse details: Cold tub rinse (estimated 75-80 F "cold" tap water) with 4 cups of white vinegar. No soap. I just wanted to finally shrink them, cut the body oils and bacteria with the vinegar, and rinse out most of the dustiness so the fade lines would pop better. Alternated soaking and hand agitation, both inside out and right side out. Used wash cloth on interior only (and did not scrub very heavily). Approximately 45 minutes total time submerged. Air dried outside on clip hangars. Measurements (inches): New (never worn) – pre wash - post wash Waist (both halves held in alignment): 36 1/2 – 39 – 36 1/2 (7 percent stretch and shrink) Hips at halfway point of front rise: 46 – 46 – 44 1/2 (3 percent shrink) Thigh at crotch: 27 – 27 – 26 (4 percent shrink) Thigh 2 inches down: 26 – 26 – 24 1/2 (6 percent shrink) Front rise: 12 1/2 – 12 1/4 – 11 3/4 (2 percent shrink from raw to pre-wash – 6 percent shrink from raw to post-wash – 4 percent shrink from pre-wash to post-wash) Rear rise: XX – 16 – 15 1/2 (unknown shrink from raw – 3 percent shrink from pre-wash to post-wash) Knee 14 inches down: 20 – 20 – 19 (5 percent shrink) Hem: 17 1/2 – 17 1/2 – 16 3/4 (4 percent shrink) Inseam: 33 – 32 1/2 – 31 (1.5 percent shrink from raw to pre-wash – 6 percent shrink from raw to post wash – 4.5 percent shrink from pre-wash to post-wash) Pix: When new: Post wash (note that the slightly brown dusty spots you see are from the wooden fence, not stains): Pretty nice whiskers forming: The back: Honeycombs are very mild, but I really didn't want to wear these much longer before washing. Roping is mild too: Part of the reason I wanted to shrink them now. The front cuff creases were starting to abrade. I don't mind this so much how it is, though, and it hasn't actually broken all the way through the warp yarns yet : And the one fade mark that is perhaps a bit out of the ordinary. I am pretty sure this is from my keys hanging from my belt loop: Obligatory wash water shot. These left a rather turquoise dye in the water – quite a lot of green in these that I never really noticed when wearing them.

The cinch causing actual back problems? Ridiculous.

So, you have heard of an actual five year wait?

Those don't look like they were worn very long before the wash. How long did you break them in first?

The only ones that I might not actually wear are the 1880s. They were limited edition (a run of 300 pair), and originally priced at $600 per pair (while "normal" LVCs were $240 to $260). I got my two pair for about 70 percent off, straight from Levi's, after a series of markdowns stacked with sales. They have the single rear pocket, but are otherwise very similar to my 1915s. My '66s and TPBs were also insanely marked down. I think I paid $120 for the rinsed one, and $140 for the rigid one. I paid $72 for the '66s, which is $12 more than sticker price on a pair of standard STFs. Everything else I got for 25 to 50 percent off. Those 1880s I got just because the deal was crazy. I might wear one and keep the other in mothballs. Or I might simply be satisfied with the 1915s (which are close enough), and keep both 1880s in mothballs. Everything else, I got to wear, and to last me. I never bothered with everyone's go-to LVCs, the 1947s. For one, I prefer the other LVC cuts. For another, I decided I wanted the Sugar Canes instead, because the denim used on them is so incredible (I have it on a SC Type II).

^ Yeah. I'm not too interested without the White Oak denim. It's not that the jeans will "suck" or anything like that, but I really love most White Oak selvedge. It's almost like the Japanese denim is too good in some way; White Oak seems more like what I remember my old Levi's looking and feeling like. That's why I tried to stock up on a lifetime supply of LVCs before the switch. I managed to do it without paying full price on any of it too (and some of it was for a ridiculous bargain, like my '66s for $72 directly from Levi's, in my proper size). I ended up with 2x 1880s (one regular, one downsized), 2x 1915s, 1933s, 1944s, 2x 1955s (one regular and one downsized), 1966s, 1976s, Type I jacket, 2x TPB (one rigid, one single rinse, which I got solely to overdye black). I also have a Turkish-made LVC blanket lined rigid Type I that I got extremely oversized. I call that a lifetime supply, especially considering that my LVCs are not the only jeans I wear. My Freenotes use White Oak 14.75 oz. selvedge. It is some of the best looking and best feeling denim I have ever worn.

^ If that's addressed at me, it's not needed to do that at this point. I'm not after my money, or after frying anybody just yet. I am simply after information that might benefit everyone if pooled.

I have some questions, just to get some compiled information here. 1. Who here has ever placed order with Ryan? 2. If you have received the jeans, what were the order and completion dates? 3. Those who have an open order, what was/were your order date/s? 4. Those who have an open order, would you take a refund if you could get it, or do you just think, ah, what the hell at this point, and want to stick it out and wait for your jeans? 5. Have any of you requested a refund from Ryan? What was his response? 6. Have you requested a refund through PayPal or your credit or debit card companies? What was their response? 7. Have your e-mails to Ryan been responded to in a timely manner? And have the exchanges been cordial? 8. Would you want to involve his local authorities my making a group complaint as suggested above? 9. Did you ask for a written estimate of completion time from Ryan when you ordered your jeans? If so, what was his response, to the word (an actual quote)? ------------------------------------------------------------ A lot of this Internet unrest might go away or be quelled if Ryan simply published an online queue showing how many orders were already in line, what the order dates were, and what the shipping dates were. No customer info required, no order details required other than a list of orders, with order date and ship date on each one. If people see 200 orders ahead of them on the Website, and that he seems to be averaging three or four years for fulfillment, then at least they'll know what they're in for. The real problem here is not so much the lead time as it is the purposeful vaguery and finely crafted avoidances of explicitly stated commitments.