Paul T

I don't believe LVC are a real profit centre, i think they're produced primarily for prestige, and are expensive because they're produced in small quantities .OF course you can look at Uniqlo as a price comparison.

Makes sense. There might well be some difference in construction between 555 jeans and the current ones, because the factories are different, but I've not heard that Cone have made any changes to the denim. There are differences year-to-year in some of the early reissues - some, eg, 1880 reissues have used Cone, others have used Japanese denim.

Out of interest, Shorty,do you know where 554 were made? Is it the old Tennessee factory? My Levi's contact wouldnt' give me the factory info in the end, he believes if it gets out in the public domain that fakers will use it to improve their product!

Tell us more about what's wrong with them? I looks like they have the narrow selvage band, which my fall 05 have... I think the spring 06 are the same, I have a pair on the way. Apart from that, I didn't notice any difference between those and the previous ones, but I don't own any 555 '47s, would be interested to know the differences.

Those old ones are looking good. My 05 are now five months old, first wash is a month away.

They were a pair I bought when they stopped doing the selvage reissues, and kept for a few years. Flogged them on eBay, as I have another new pair without tags that I'm laying up, i think the word is, like a fine wine... they are exactly the same as the l/h ones in the pic, the two others were an earlier reissue. Incidentally, they're similar denim to a lot of the Edwin stuff.

all that said, I don't worry too much about my jeans, i just wear the things, that's what they're for.

Edited by Paul T on Mar 10, 2006 at 05:38 AM

You'd be surprised how good the fakes are getting. I posted a couple of weeks ago about Levi's fakes that were on sale at Urban Outfitters. THey came from a reputable source who'd previously delivered good shit, and they fooled the Urban Outfitters' buyer.

it's also a Catch 22 situation. Levi's don't want to tell too many people how to spot the fakes, because the fakers will then change the offending details, and fool even more people.

Sorry, i don't remember the campaign. Maybe it was a us one, I'm in the uk. Not sure what the jeans will be either, i don't think Levi's did any rigid ones apart from the stf in the 90s.

They started out like this.

Denim R has a good point. The less you obsess about your jeans and how quick they're wearing, the better they will look. My best jeans were the ones where I decided I liked them dark, so I washed occasionally, or dry cleaned. Ones where I tried to wear them in more quickly never looked as good. Learn to love them dark, and before you know it they will look great. It's a zen thing.

Great to have you back ringring!

The denim manufacturers developed the fabric right from the early days. Levi's used to boast about Amoskeag denim - but Amoskeag was just about the biggest denim supplier there was. Many people thought that 'Jelt' was a proprietary Lee fabric, yet in fact it was a Cone invention, other manufacturers used it, but Lee advertised the Jelt name so aggressively they gained a huge competitive advantage. Gap do much the same, letting everyone believe they've pioneered left hand denim. Of course, a lot of the time Cone will develop fabrics with people like Gap in mind.

Edited by Paul T on Mar 9, 2006 at 05:47 PM

PRactising...

Edited by Paul T on Mar 9, 2006 at 04:49 PM

Go to photobucket.com and download the pic to their site. It should resize it automatically. Once you've downloaded it, they give you a URL you can paste into your posts, post the line marked 'Tag'.

I just tried it with a pic of my new watch...

Edited by Paul T on Mar 9, 2006 at 05:45 PM

It does look like a Belstaff, but Belstaffs don't come in that sand colour or have epaulettes. It's possible it could be a Belstaff aviator, which means you run the risk of looking like Leonardo diCaprio.

Singlet, sorry, the ones I saw in Dec were spring 06 of course, I'm getting ahead of myself. And generally confused, maybe you should post a photo of your 47s so we get a better idea of what they look like.

Again, while there have been odd quirks/mistkaes in the spring 06 range that I've seen, I haven't noticed that the denim or finish on the dry jeans was any different from the autumn or spring 05 range. I did notice some differences on the 1890 jeans, which I believe might not use Cone denim, but that was it.

This is from an insane, but intriguing, article in a Japanese photo mag, which details how you can dress as your fave photographer.

Now, most of the ones they featured were frankly dressed like nerds, but Robert Capa - the dude who photoraphed the landings on Omaha and squired Ingrid Bergman - wore one tasty jacket. Any idea what the modern equivalent, being worn by 'the model', is??

http://kenshukan.net/john/archives/belikecapa.jpg

Yes, these look legit. I'm only guessing, but I think they might be from 2005, because I was told that this year's production was relatively undersized, as this pair seems to be.

It's hard to describe how they fit without comparing them to another 501! I've worn a distressed pair of these, and would very roughly descibe them as half way between the classic full 1933 shape, and the slimmer 1947 shape. Why don't you email the seller and ask him to send the the dimensions of the rise etc? Do you want them low-ish, or tight? pre-war Levi's tend to be baggier than postwar ones, with a looser leg, but a lot of that is definted by their actualt sizing - for instance, LVC sizes its 1947 501s smaller than its 1933 501.

Sadly shallow piece. Just a couple of phone calls would have revealed that most people in the denim industry agree that Adriano Goldschmied , in conjunction with Martelli, pioneered whiskers way before Seven. For instance, Diesel had them circa 1991.

I doubt they could be fakes. I think it's more likely that the cut-off date for different features isn't as consistent as we'd all like and that the S501 code hung over to some of the post-war features. the arcuate stitching is different from anything I've seen from that period, but they're known to vary.

Personally, I wouldn't bid a huge amount for them without seeing them in the flesh. Besides, the leg length is a couple of inches short for me.

The 201s have the wrong-size pockets, and 60s style arcuates done with the double needle. Hence they don;t look at all like 201s. They really suck. The 201s are perhaps my favourite LVC jeans so this is a particular travesty. It is possible the problem is just with one batch, but they still had the faulty ones at Cinch last time I checked.

Edited by Paul T on Mar 8, 2006 at 08:33 AM

They are terrific jeans. The people at Wrangler Europe made a real effort with them. It's very good denim, specially developed for the jeans at Orta Mills, a great example of how fabric doesn't have to be selvage to be good. I have the 27MW shirt (the Steve McQueen one) and it's one of my treasured possessions, much better, i gotta say, than the Levi's Sawtooth repro.

By the way, I'd describe the 11MW as close to a 1947 straight leg. The 13MWZ repro is more of a cowboy cut, slimming to the knees, then straightening again, like a very subtle bootcut (I think that's the one that was designed by Rodeo Ben).

There's info on the range at the wrangler site. You might have to select Wrangler EUrope, then look for the Blue Bell collection.

Edited by Paul T on Mar 7, 2006 at 12:16 PM

Don't think you can generalise too much. My 47s are Fall 06 and seem fine; right leg length, shrank from 34 to 33 with a short cold soak, and nicely made. The waist was slightly undersize, but this does happen with the 47. The 55s from spring 07 that I saw in December looked great too and there were no obvious errors.

I would be surprised if either range has consistent shrinkage problems - I thought the problem was that one batch was made with over-long legs, I'm prepared to stand corrected. But the 201s I saw were pitifullly bad - I expect to see a bunch going cheap at TK Max in the summer, but I wouldn't pay a tenner for them. Apparently there's no one person in Europe driving the LVC range any more, so I think there will be ongoing intermittent problems.

Only had quickest look, yes theyre a PIA to open, but they look exactly as they should, and I have seen them in the flesh. And yes, they should have shrunk.

I realise I just put the answer to your queriy in another thread. oh well. TO get you started:

Japan: Kurabo, Kaihara, Nisshinbo, Kempo - many have Chinese plants too.

Italy: Legler, Italdenim

Turkey: Orta

Spain: Tavex

US: Cone Mills (a huge variety, but selvage capacity is limited).

Google any of these and you should find distributors or contacts, or see below. Perhaps you should find a consultant who knows this area. I might be able to suggest someone who's been my pet expert in the past.

Honestly, though, every country has dozens of producers, many more, plus contacts for most of the above are listed here:

http://www.expo21xx.com/textile21xx/jeans-denim.htm

I believe ringring pointed out in another context that it's the chainstitching which influences the look of seams. Only chainstitched jeans have that crumpled effect - if you want to hem your jeans and get that look, have them shortened chainstitch (difficult, I know) and do it before the first wash.

All ring ring fabric tends to be more durable than OE fabric. All selvage is ring ring. That means that selvage tends to be stronger than average jeans, which might be ring/oe... but there's no reason why the presence of selvage on denim makes it stronger than similar spec ring ring denim which isn't selvage. Bear in mind that finishing makes a huge difference to the durability.

Hope I've explained with clarity, I'm sure I haven't...