denimotaku

heard the news a few hours ago. hope you're well and safe Ande. i also hope all your machines are fine as well.

yeah carpet machines sound like a good idea too. especially for overlocking or safety stitching the inseam at the crotch.

When i do alterations on heavier fabrics, especially chain-stitch hems, i have noticed that the inseam and outseam sections that are rolled into the hem have had some of the excess cut off to minimise the thickness.

Especially since the majority of machines that are sewing the hems are union special 43200's and are limited to a certain needle size, unless they have been modified to take a bigger needle in the shaft, feeders and needle plate.

In some instances you could use a heavier duty machine to do another task, like setting up a US waistband machine like the 51800 to do hems since the machine can take up to a 24 or 25 needle.

what problems have you come across? I think once denim fabrics go into that weight catergory, you will need to change the machinery you use. Just as there are specialised industrial machines made for denim fabrics between the 12 - 19 oz weights, i'd imagine the machines you would use for anything heavier would most likely be upholstery machines meant for medium to heavy leathers. Either that or changing needles sizes above the commonly used 18 - 22 size and using crap loads of silicone spray on the needle to eliminate the heat building up from the friction.

denim-less for the next few weeks is unacceptable, considering it's raining here every second day.

if it's still a while til japan i'd grab those Aika if you can find your size. After everyone talked about Enishi in this thread, all of the pairs we had in That Store sold out straight away.

When i went to Japan last year, i didn't see much stuff on sale at Americaya or the denim stores i visited, and i went during June/July sale season.

^^ hey rodeo, that blue hand of yours always freaks me out. i keep thinking it's an industrial strength glove.

despite his scary blue hand, he's spot on about it being a lot less time consuming. that's why most of the parts of a jean sewn with a chain-stitch is usually in a straight line, eg waistband, lapped seams, hems. it's rare to see a chain-stitch where the direction of the stitch changes like when sewing a back pocket onto the back panels. the machinists basically just want to put their foot down on the pedal and let the folder do all the work.

i always find it funny when i see a skipped stitch on a seat seam of some cheaper mass produced jean and the machinists have just sewn a lockstitch over it to secure it from unraveling.. lazy lazy lazy. then again, maybe some people will view that as an imperfection with a repair job and like it even more!!

hahaha mike, you're grabbing bargains left, right and centre. lucky for you Japanese denim is misunderstood in Australia. THAT STORE really wants to push the Japanese denim brands but they just dont do well down here.

Lucky you got them all at those prices, i bought a pair of Enishi and Aika from the Aika store in Paddington about 2 years ago when they were still open... at full price,$400 each.. i'm such a sucker.

The chain-stitch that everyone in this forum drools over is what's called a double lockstitch which basically comprises of two threads direct from the cone without the use of a bobbin for the lower thread. A chain-stitch can also refer to the stitch used for embroidery which uses only one thread. An example of this is what you see ROY do on the pocket bags on some of the custom jeans he makes.

If you are only using the top thread, you are sewing an embroidery chain-stitch. Also, all the double lockstitch machines i use do not have a reverse function like a regular lockstitch machine does, hence why most need brands either have to manually tie off a knot to prevent it from unraveling, or sew a bartack, like what Nudie does, to stop it from unraveling as well.

An embroidery chainstitch is used for more decorative purposes rather than piecing fabrics together. They used to use them back in the day for sewing names onto handkerchiefs and clothes, creating floral designs on western shirts or for filling in colour to designs on those varsity style jackets (sorry, from Australia, not sure if those jackets have a proper name!!).

Double lockstitches are what you see on the seat seam and on most waistbands of jeans.

...try rubbing I bet it comes off

lol..... i'll try that tonight

are they on both sides or just the one side of the hem?

i reckon it's just the marker they used to outline where they were going to cut the fabric when altering. Pink is a very common colour for tailors chalk. If it were caused by cutting, there wouldn't be that streak moving away from the cut edge.

If it's only marked on one side, it's most likely tailors chalk and when you first saw them, you saw the side that wasn't marked. If it's on both sides it could be a fabric marker pen. They have pens with ink that disappear after a wash and some that disappear over a short time.

If not, then it may be the Virgin Mary's tears of blood come to tell you that altering jeans is sacrilegious and against humanity. =)

hey mike, nice grab. i actually work for THAT store in sydney. The Enishi, Aika and Fullcount went for pretty cheap and were mainly scooped up by the denim nerds. Most people here in Australia don't understand the vintage and repro aesthetic. Tell them they're a shrink to fit and they freak out haha.

If i recall, there are a few pairs of the Fullcount 1105 natural indigo floating around as well as some Aika's and the 1880's Fullcount workwear reproductions on sale.

Good info, thanks.

Is it as easier to set upper and lower tension on the 56400P, compared to, say the 43200G, as far as you know?

What about setting the stitch length?

Unfortunately I've never had the opportunity to sit down and play with the 43200G for a few hours to check it out but from what i have read about it and from what i can see they both should be fairly easy. It would just be a matter of knowing what you are doing. The 56400P has the tension knob for the upper thread. If you need it to be extra tight in the event the lower thread is quite thick, you can wrap the upper thread around the tension knob twice, rather than the standard 75% of a revolution (not 100% of a revolution because the thread exits the tension knob before you make a full revolution).

The lower thread tension knob on most of the chain stitch machines i have at home are usually not as tight as the top thread tension knob for some reason. On the 56400P there is also a little tension nut on the inside of the machine where the lower thread runs that usually is better. However you don't really have to change the lower thread tension to balance the ratio. Balancing the thread tension can be done from using the top thread knob alone to achieve a 50/50% break up or 75/25% if you wanted more tension on the top thread.

I hope that answered your question.

As for stitch length, is it generally a lot more difficult on a chain stitch machine rather than a lockstitch. Lock stitch machines tend to have a turn knob with marked numbers showing either stitch size or stitches per inch. Chain stitch machines require you loosen nuts and bolts that attach to the looper and the main shaft. I usually find it quite frustrating on the 56400P because when you alter the stitch length, the timing of the needle drop and loopers need to be set again.. Believe me, this took a whole lot of practice to finally understand. Also because the 56400P was meant for shirts, it's maximum stitch length is shorter than the 43200G. It also helps when sewing to not pull too much on the fabric or else this will lessen the distance of fabric that is fed by the feed dogs resulting in smaller stitches. You may also help push the fabric to help it feed more distance through to obtain longer stitches if you do have a machine with a smaller stitch length. However this usually only makes a small difference.

When using a flatbed machine, you should remember that if you are rolling the hem by hand you need to also pull at the fabric while the machine is sewing to help offset the fabric to get the pronounced roped hem.

Also playing with the tension of the top thread will help create a pull when the jeans start to shrink. On different jeans it may look like there are different styles of chainstitches or double lockstitches however it just comes down to the tension of the top thread vs the lower thread as well as the sizes of the thread you use. Many of the japanese repro brands have a chain stitch that looks like three parallel lines due to a tight top thread tension. Other brands like the older lots of nudie had a chain stitch that looked chunky like the top thread was trying to hump the lower thread twice from both angles... (i dont know how else to explain that)

The following photos are alterations sewn on the same machine (Union Special 56400P) however some with different thread size ratios and varying tension.

Nudie alteration on a Slim Jim DBT

The 'humping' chainstitch.

Edwin Sen Skinny

When i first saw the chainstitch on the Sen Skinny jean i though Edwin used a completely different or modified chain stitch machine.. However i found out all you have to do is change the way the lower thread is threaded through the machine to lessen the tension dramatically. The selvage is fat because the customer asked me to taper from the selvage.

Flathead

The three parallel line looking chainstitch. Probably the stitch on the jeans you are wearing as you are reading this, if you are obsessed enough to have read this far into my post.

FullCount

They usually do the three parallel looking stitch however on this particular pair i was given it was similar to the nudie hump stitch.

Sorry, the point of my post was to show that generally, the majority of industrial chainstitch machines should be able to sew denim as long as the machine takes a needle size of minimum 18/110. The Union Special 56400P was originally meant for shirts; light to medium heavy weight fabrics. I was able to sew through a 17oz Samurai no problem as well as a 14oz Acne jean with a double lap felled inseam which would equal 12 layers of denim at the one time.

I envy all the denim nerds in the states.. There are heaps of machines there on sale. To even find a machine in Australia that does a chainstitch is hard enough.

Let me know if you want to me to list all the places i've seen that have stocked Union Special machines in the states.. i think i may have talked enough on this thread.

So is there any other machine in the world that will hem a jean correctly other than the 43200 g union special? I have looked flipping everywhere! I have contacted every industrial sewing machine company I can find! Someone please help me or I am going to lose my mind.

you'll be glad to know that it doesn't necessarily have to be a union special 43200G. I've searched everywhere for that machine and my girlfriend managed to find one for sale for $5000 in taiwan. and that's without a table and a motor.!!.

i offer a chainstitch service in Sydney, Australia that i am running with a Union Special 56400P. It is a flatbed twin needle chainstitch machine. i use the one needle and fold the hem by hand. i did manage to spend $500 on a custom made double downturn hemming folder that is attached to the machine however it is very tricky to work with especially because it required a knee lever. i find doing it by hand it just as good.

here's a some photo of the machine.

i'll also post some pics of the alterations

man huge props to you.. all handstitched... that's love

not that i remember. for one of the fabrics i did only order about 6 yards.

from previous experience with premium denim outlet i find they have cheaper prices but it just took forever for them to reply back to me and get totals and delivery prices. they didnt even finalise the sale and get back to me after a few emails.

i ordered about 50 yards from shuttle loom denim and the person i dealt with replied straight away, even during odd times in the morning when i thought he would be asleep. The fabric was sent out the next day. no worries and very easy to deal with.

then again im in sydney, australia, so not sure if that makes any difference.

i was very happy with the fabric i purchased from shuttleloom denim. however there wasnt much info provided in terms of shrinkage and maintenance. i had to figure it all out myself.

hope this helps

in terms of crotch tears, the fabric does play a part, but also keep in mind the fit of the jean, further overdyeing on the fabric, the construction as well as the body structure of the person wearing it. It usually cannot always be blamed on the fabric alone. Especially since nudie use different fabrics on different cuts

thanks for the rep =) you've popped my rep cherry.

i am thinking of creating a few of these jackets if people were keen.. i'm quite interested as to what sorts of fabric people would want. STF? sanforized, selvage?, slubby or more modern denim. i personally love looking at different fabric suppliers finding one off denim with characteristics you wouldn't find in your conventional stuff.. (i still love the classics though don't get me wrong)

for instance the denim on that jacket looks like it has a matte sort of finish in person. from different view and angles it will shine as well as appear dull and matte. hence why for the front pocket i ran the grain of the fabric the other way.. sort of hard to capture that effect on camera.

still interested to see how they fade though. will have to wear in after the parade.

thanks catchforusthefoxes.. so eager to get it over and done with. will have the freedom to start playing around with patterns and construction methods since i will have more time.

cheers for reading...

Curious, how long does it take you to make a single pair of jeans or jacket, excluding the pattern-making?

it usually depends how much sleep i've had.. a pair of jeans usually dont take longer than one day to complete from the cutting phase to the rivets. however sometimes i've dealt with very heavy fabrics that require a bit more attention when constructing.. the machines i bought were what i could afford on my salary.. so all are second hand. some can eat up the heavy stuff like the union specials.. while others need a bit more time to work with.

the jacket is a lot faster. maybe half the time of the jeans. it takes longer though when im using only a single needle for all the twin stitch details.. but i always prefer the end result.

haha sorry i can talk all day about this.. i'll probably end it here..

and no some of the jacket.. the jeans are a size 34 and im a 30.. they look like straight legs on me rather than slim..

the jacket is a medium... im a small.. again.. looking like a rapper.

here are some of the jacket

this is how i personally like to rock it.

back to sewing. have two more garments to make.. let me know what you guys think.. cheers

appreciate the kind words all.. thanks for taking the time to post up.

here are some fit pics of both garments and some detailed photos.. the lighting in my room is sort of yellow. so the lighting may be a bit weird.

the jeans... thought it'd get some fit pics with some machines in the photo.. these are the work horses that sew through this heavy stuff after all..

hope they're big enough =D

nice work, looks very neat and professionally done! nice to see a denim jacket with a contemporary fit, what have you lined the collar with?

cheers, the collar is actually just lined with the same denim fabric. in the photo it looks different but i think that's just the lighting.. the collar is fused with two different types of fusing. one heavier duty, the other regular. i needed it to stand up. its only 3.5cm high though. i was originally going to line the collar with a slubby striped cotton fabric that i used for one of my shirts. might be good to do one in the future...

a lot of my inspiration comes from vintage denim and the detailing that the Japanese are obsessed with. however im a small guy so lots of the vintage garments make me look like a rapper wannabe. i prefer more modern cuts and fits with vintage detailing.. hidden rivets, chainstitch, construction etc.

cheers, thanks for the replies.. i'll upload more pics later on this afternoon.. i have to head out to work.. the jeans are a size 34.. im a 30 =(.. i will be having my parade in 2 weeks and the model is a size 34.. so i can try them on.. but they would like baggy on me.. i will post more detailed.. and larger pics tonight.

in the mean time.. here are some photos of the jacket i made.. it's not selvage(crucify me) but the fabric itself had an interesting brown on the weft which i though once it fades will look wicked. It's a slim tailored cut with a stand up collar.. all stitching was done single needle.. i love the hand sewn imperfect finish this gives.. rather than doing twin needle..

these are bigger pics =)

Hey sufu junkies, just made my first pair of selvage jeans.. its a slim straight 14oz japanese black slevage . Fabric from Nihon Menpu.

These are my third jeans ever made, but first made from a pattern i created myself. These are actually for my student collection for my fashion design course.. I have since made a few other jeans, a jacket and some shirts. Let me know what you guys think or if you had any questions about the making of jeans.

here are some photos of the production process. i'll place up photos of the garment later.. sorry i think the photos are quite small

the hems are chainstitched =).. if any of you guys are from sydney and want anything chainstitched.. let me know, we can arrange something.. we've gone too long without someone to do it down here.

you mofos are too kind...i was with poopslush earlier today, and i am sad to inform all that the fullcount1310s(the black version of the 1108, i don't know if anyuone else has a pair going) he had been rocking for as far as i know about 9-10 months have been mangled due to him being mangled up under a car while he was riding his bike. he's okay, but he has the scars to show it. the FC had to be cut off of him by EMS, so they are hence retired. they are now in my possesion, as i very highly prize this rare sample of FC denim. slush is allowing me a generous portion of the right leg for scraps so the jeans will live on as from now on i will only use this black FC denim for patches on mine. i'll post pics of the jeans as soon as i

can...

sorry to hear about that man. all the best to poopslush..

about his jeans though, is it mangled beyond repair? or do you reckon it could still be sewn/patched/reinforced/resurrected? i could imagine it looking like a pair of jeans Frankenstein would wear... if he loved jeans..

Recently found these jeans in a vinnies store. they're not really vintage but they have some sweet evo going on