jeans with twisted seams?

[psyence]

a few years ago (around 2001-2002) i bought a pair of jeans from Gap and they had seams that "twisted" to the front of the pant leg. does any one know what model jeans these were? or perhaps any other jeans that incorporate this "twist"?

[darknworn]

rogan and levi's red both make twisted seams jeans. don't know what model gap that was.

"God is Dead" - Nietzsche

"Nietzsche is Dead" - God

[Guest Guy H]

blueblood do as well.

I spent a lot of of money on booze, birds and

fast cars. The rest I just squandered - George Best

[plat_overcast]

Volcom does (did) on a couple styles... The Ergos for sure and maybe the Really Eff'd Up?

[Paul T]

Teddy Smith in france produced some, that were pretty much a copy of LEiv's Engineered. and Michiko Koshino made some, which were pretty much a knock-off of Levi's Red.

[wild_whiskey]

So does True Religion.

[RustyRyan]

I have a pair of the Gap ones I think you're talking about, they were called the "torque". I got mine for on sale for $8.99. I also got a pair of Element "Curve" jeans(their term for twisted seams) a couple years ago, but haven't worn either in quite awhile.

[Geowu]

APC's seams twist too. I don't like twisted seams so much.

[Guest bed]

Quote:

APC's seams twist too. I don't like twisted seams so much.

--- Original message by Geowu on Aug 10, 2005 09:17 AM

I believe all selvage jeans do this to some degree when they are washed.

[giantreptile]

that is correct selvage does twist upon washing, hence the inspiration for making the twisted seams on modern jeans; rogan was first i believe when he worked for levi.

[Yakboy Equals Nurturer]

Quote: rogan was first i believe when he worked for levi

I'd heard that somewhere myself before (that he designed the Levi 'Engineered' jean), but haven't been able to verify...anyone know for sure?

[Brienneoftarth]

rogan designed for gap i think so its prob his piece.

[Paul T]

NO. It was a woman named Rikke Korff designed the Levi's Red, and Engineered. She also designed the Red range that became Type 1, with a guy called Z, I think.

[psyence]

Quote:

I have a pair of the Gap ones I think you're talking about, they were called the "torque". I got mine for on sale for $8.99. I also got a pair of Element "Curve" jeans(their term for twisted seams) a couple years ago, but haven't worn either in quite awhile.

--- Original message by RustyRyan on Aug 10, 2005 09:11 AM

Yup. The name torque sounds right. I'm looking for another pair of those.

[6MT]

Quote:

NO. It was a woman named Rikke Korff designed the Levi's Red, and Engineered. She also designed the Red range that became Type 1, with a guy called Z, I think.

--- Original message by Paul T on Aug 10, 2005 12:20 PM

I THINK YOU ARE RIGHT.

BUT THE REASON LEVI'S DID THE TWISTED SEMS WAS BECAUSE THEY DESIGN THE PATTERN ON A 3D MODEL AND THEY CAME UP WITH THE TWISTD SEAM. THE JEANS WAS SUPPOSEDLY TO FIT THE HUMAN BODY CONTOUR. AND I DONT THINK OTHER COMPANY REALISED THAT SO THEY FOLLOW ANY WAY.

AND THE REASON SELVAGE JEANS HAVE TWISTED SIDE SEAM IS BECAUSE WHEN YOU HAVE SELVAGE FOR SIDE SEAM YOU HAVE TO ADJUST THE PATTERN FOR THE SIDE SEAM TO BE CUT ON SELVAGE. SELVAGE DONT TWIST AFTER WASH AT ALL AT LEAST I NEVER HEARD OF SUCH THING. AND THE FACT ABOUT SELVAGE IS THAT THERE IS NOTHING SPECIAL ABOUT THEM EXCEPT THAT THE FACT ITS SELVAGE, THE MILLS I WORK WITH RIGHT NOW COULD PUT SELVAGE ON ANY DENIM I ASK FOR AND THEY COULD EVEN WEAVE WRITING IN TO THE SELVAGE..SO THERE GOES IT. THE PRICE MIGHT BE HIGHER IF THE DENIM COMES WITH SELVAGE, BUT THE PRICE DIFFERENCE IS WITH SINGLE DIGIT PER YARD.

[Paul T]

I spoke to Rikke about this. The idea for the twisted seams came from vintage jeans - she took that characteristic and exaggerated it. The idea fro the Type 1/RED came from much the same source - she was looking at old ads for jeans and realised how striking all the stitching and rivets would have looked in victorian times, so again she exaggerated it for the Red range.

I thought selvage denim DID twist after wash, in exactly the same way as non-selvage, but the difference is that older jeans weren't pre-skewed.

[hahnstch]

Quote:

Quote:

NO. It was a woman named Rikke Korff designed the Levi's Red, and Engineered. She also designed the Red range that became Type 1, with a guy called Z, I think.

--- Original message by Paul T on Aug 10, 2005 12:20 PM

I THINK YOU ARE RIGHT.

BUT THE REASON LEVI'S DID THE TWISTED SEMS WAS BECAUSE THEY DESIGN THE PATTERN ON A 3D MODEL AND THEY CAME UP WITH THE TWISTD SEAM. THE JEANS WAS SUPPOSEDLY TO FIT THE HUMAN BODY CONTOUR. AND I DONT THINK OTHER COMPANY REALISED THAT SO THEY FOLLOW ANY WAY.

AND THE REASON SELVAGE JEANS HAVE TWISTED SIDE SEAM IS BECAUSE WHEN YOU HAVE SELVAGE FOR SIDE SEAM YOU HAVE TO ADJUST THE PATTERN FOR THE SIDE SEAM TO BE CUT ON SELVAGE. SELVAGE DONT TWIST AFTER WASH AT ALL AT LEAST I NEVER HEARD OF SUCH THING. AND THE FACT ABOUT SELVAGE IS THAT THERE IS NOTHING SPECIAL ABOUT THEM EXCEPT THAT THE FACT ITS SELVAGE, THE MILLS I WORK WITH RIGHT NOW COULD PUT SELVAGE ON ANY DENIM I ASK FOR AND THEY COULD EVEN WEAVE WRITING IN TO THE SELVAGE..SO THERE GOES IT. THE PRICE MIGHT BE HIGHER IF THE DENIM COMES WITH SELVAGE, BUT THE PRICE DIFFERENCE IS WITH SINGLE DIGIT PER YARD.

--- Original message by 6MT on Aug 10, 2005 10:59 PM

but it's still true that you waste more yard to get the jeans to come with selvage right?

[jdavis]

denim milled with a selvage is half the width (at least) of denim produced without a selvage. the older narrower shuttle looms produced much less then contemporary pojectile looms, so its more a case of making every piece count - i believe - than more waste when selvage is used.

as for leg twist/torquing, denim is a twill, which is a diagonal weave - when it shrinks it twists with the diagonal weave. skewing, desizing and sanforization reduces twist... but so does wranglers broken twill.

[triniboy27]

C&P make a twisted seam jean as well...the tuck model..

[wild_whiskey]

It seems everyone has a different explanation. I was told since Levi's are RHT 3x1, when the threads shrink there is a bias toward the right. This causes the twist. The lame thing is that Rogan et al. are twisting both inseams toward the center, which is retarded, because both legs should twist towards the right, unless, of course, you had one leg as RHT and the other leg LHT. On the left leg, the seam will end on the center of the shin, and on the right leg, the seam will end on the back of the calf.

[Paul T]

Well yes, you're right, on old jeans which aren't pre-skewed, the fabric will try to follow the direction of the weave as it shrinks. That's why Levi's twist one way, and Lee the other, as lee is a l/h twill. But when the Red jeans (and Rogan, and teddy Smith, and Michiko Koshino) were designed, they made the leg twist symmetrical, ie one leg one way, the other leg the other way, simply cos it looks better like that. The Leiv's deisgners were inspried by the look of old jeans, but didn't copy them slavishly. Those first Red jeans - in an almost hemp-liek fabric - didn't look AT ALL like any old Levi's I've seen!

[6MT]

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

NO. It was a woman named Rikke Korff designed the Levi's Red, and Engineered. She also designed the Red range that became Type 1, with a guy called Z, I think.

--- Original message by Paul T on Aug 10, 2005 12:20 PM

I THINK YOU ARE RIGHT.

BUT THE REASON LEVI'S DID THE TWISTED SEMS WAS BECAUSE THEY DESIGN THE PATTERN ON A 3D MODEL AND THEY CAME UP WITH THE TWISTD SEAM. THE JEANS WAS SUPPOSEDLY TO FIT THE HUMAN BODY CONTOUR. AND I DONT THINK OTHER COMPANY REALISED THAT SO THEY FOLLOW ANY WAY.

AND THE REASON SELVAGE JEANS HAVE TWISTED SIDE SEAM IS BECAUSE WHEN YOU HAVE SELVAGE FOR SIDE SEAM YOU HAVE TO ADJUST THE PATTERN FOR THE SIDE SEAM TO BE CUT ON SELVAGE. SELVAGE DONT TWIST AFTER WASH AT ALL AT LEAST I NEVER HEARD OF SUCH THING. AND THE FACT ABOUT SELVAGE IS THAT THERE IS NOTHING SPECIAL ABOUT THEM EXCEPT THAT THE FACT ITS SELVAGE, THE MILLS I WORK WITH RIGHT NOW COULD PUT SELVAGE ON ANY DENIM I ASK FOR AND THEY COULD EVEN WEAVE WRITING IN TO THE SELVAGE..SO THERE GOES IT. THE PRICE MIGHT BE HIGHER IF THE DENIM COMES WITH SELVAGE, BUT THE PRICE DIFFERENCE IS WITH SINGLE DIGIT PER YARD.

--- Original message by 6MT on Aug 10, 2005 10:59 PM

but it's still true that you waste more yard to get the jeans to come with selvage right?

--- Original message by hahnstch on Aug 11, 2005 05:32 AM

not really, its just how good the person is at doing marker ( when they put all the pattern piece on when huge sheet for cutting), if a person is really good at it you won't waste much fabric at all...