1890's Levi's on Ebay

[Serge d Nimes]

there are many thigs wrong with this jean. with a cloth (1920's) tag you would have:

High Rise

Exposed back pocket rivets

crotch rivet

no big e tab

no belt loops

suspender buttons

buckle back

9 oz blue line selvage (or is it 11 oz?)

some might have selvage on the waistband.

flat alloy rivets

I think these jeans are trying to be sold as real vintage jeans to morons elsewhere and as repros on ebay. I'm pretty sure all the denim was lighter weight untill the 30's when they had competition with LEE. I will have to look that one up.

Carpe Denim!

[Serge d Nimes]

You know, he says that he had a chain of vintage denim stores, yet he washed them in detergent. Something is fishy here. No real collector/ dealer would wash those jeans.

Carpe Denim!

[Teddy Boy Rocker]

yea after looking at those 201s he bought, it is so blatant they are fakes for the reasons you listed. i just noticed the title being "Big E redtab" which seemed odd for those jeans

out of curiosity, there seems to be an underlying implication that they jeans he is selling are maybe NOT authentic? or that he is just a complete dummy selling real jeans, in which case i dont think there is a crime in that.

and did he say *he* washed those jeans? i would have assumed that the 4 guys who originally found them would have washed them, not knowing better.

Edited by Teddy Boy Rocker on May 17, 2005 at 08:21 PM

[XX]

on the auction for the 1890s jeans there appears to be a couple different versions of this pair anyway.. you think he would try and make each picture an acurate representation of shade? some of the pictures make the jeans look light green and others make them look paint splattered?!

[Serge d Nimes]

I think the splattered ones are from before they were washed

Carpe Denim!

[benzak]

Quote:

why are REPRO Levis LVC faked? i can understand selling fakes as real pre-60s vintage to get $$ but i dont get why someone would fake reproductions (as there apparently seems to be a lot of on ebay).....if you had the means to make a decent pair of selvage denim jeans why not start your own label and make Levis clones like Denime, Sugarcane, Dry Bones etc? and are the fakers making a pair here and there or are they mass-producing them by the 100s, 1000s?

now regarding this ebay seller with the $15,000+ 1890s jeans buying a fake pair of 201s in a previous auction, am i right in assuming their fake-ness comes from the presence of the red tab, which the white cloth patch 201s didnt have? (i have a pair of white cloth patch repro 201xx and they are blue line selvage, not redline....is that historically accurate or not?)

--- Original message by Teddy Boy Rocker on May 17, 2005 07:19 PM

if jeans are being faked, but still be a great pair of jeans of good quality, does it really matter? i mean, a lot of japanese brands are also copies of levis, which you all love. i think it doesn't matter at all except its not ethical, let me know what you guys all think.

first post btw

[darknworn]

i tend to agree with you benzak. the buyer from whom this person bought the fake 201's has some really decent "fakes" for sale. i am tempted to go for a pair of the less blatant fake, i.e. '47 or later fake. s/he tends to screw up on the earlier fakes, i.e. '29 201 w/o crotch and hidden rivets. if Levi's were to do this kind of distressing, they'd be asking for at least 3 times as much money. not for nothing, but even the "fake" jeans are selvage.

but, there's always a guilty feeling among the denim freaks of wearing something less than genuine. which i'm not too proud to admit!

one of the fake LEvi's. even the semi-blind can see that the tag is sewn on.

Edited by darknworn on May 18, 2005 at 04:38 AM

[Paul T]

re selvage: No early Levi's had red selvage. All the 501 denim up until 1915 came from Amoskeag, vegetable-dyed, plain selvage with no line. We don't know twere the 201 fabruic came from - it was unspeciified. From 1922 the 501 fabric was all from Cone, synthetic dye, darker blue. 501 denim had a red line. 201 denim had a blue line. The 201 was slightly cheaper, the same weight denim 9 oz, cotton rather than linen-sewn. MAny people think the 201 fabric is more beautiful - it's a little greener, more white slub lines as it fades, that fabric was used as a model for the Red Series, on which Type 1 was based

The most obvious tell-tale for repro gear is the 'R' symbol, which was added to LVC denim to avoid their being passed off as the real thing, plus all the things that Serge pointed out, although I would think it should have belt loops from the 20s. And of course those 201 shouldn't even have a tab at all. The arcuate shape would instqantly mark them out as a modern pair, not even a decent reissue (the little diamond at the bottom of the arcuate only appeared post-WW11, and the arcuate would be less symmetrical, because it was done freehand).

But I can't see why you would want a crappy repro like the ones posted, when you could probably get second hand LVC for the same price. I sold a pair of 1880 repros, natural indigo denim from Kurabo, made in SF, for around $100 on the 'Bay a couple off months ago, anything like that would be a much better deal; even the LVC 201 reissues would only be around $90-$150 and of course you woulnd't be supporting a scamster!

[Teddy Boy Rocker]

Quote:

Quote:

why are REPRO Levis LVC faked? i can understand selling fakes as real pre-60s vintage to get $$ but i dont get why someone would fake reproductions (as there apparently seems to be a lot of on ebay).....if you had the means to make a decent pair of selvage denim jeans why not start your own label and make Levis clones like Denime, Sugarcane, Dry Bones etc? and are the fakers making a pair here and there or are they mass-producing them by the 100s, 1000s?

now regarding this ebay seller with the $15,000+ 1890s jeans buying a fake pair of 201s in a previous auction, am i right in assuming their fake-ness comes from the presence of the red tab, which the white cloth patch 201s didnt have? (i have a pair of white cloth patch repro 201xx and they are blue line selvage, not redline....is that historically accurate or not?)

--- Original message by Teddy Boy Rocker on May 17, 2005 07:19 PM

if jeans are being faked, but still be a great pair of jeans of good quality, does it really matter? i mean, a lot of japanese brands are also copies of levis, which you all love. i think it doesn't matter at all except its not ethical, let me know what you guys all think.

first post btw

--- Original message by benzak on May 18, 2005 04:05 AM

*I* have no problem with 'fake' jeans if it is sold as a knockoff, like so many of the Japanese brands. but to sell fakes as authentic is a deliberate attempt to deceive which bugs me. this attitude goes beyond jeans, look at how much stuff is faked and tried to be passed off as authentic. put your own name on it and you might even get more $ and develop your own following. like you said, a great pair of jeans is still a great pair irregardless of the name on it.

[darknworn]

these jeans are gonna break $50k without even trying. the real question is what is the damn reserve??? for a buying idiot, i'd say the guy is astute when it comes to selling jeans.

[witts]

i sed on the first page i fink its a con... now whos' correct

ice cold vintage

[XX]

has anyone noticed this auction has been removed by ebay?

[script]

was still there last night...

bought by someone? or ebay decided to stop it

as it was getting out of hand with his stories and

the names dropping[w/o approval]

anyone?

write your own script

[XX]

maybe somebody made an offer outside of ebay he couldnt resist

i was looking forward to seeing the final bid on this thing....

[Teddy Boy Rocker]

last nite the auction said he was removing the listing since he used terms that were inaccurate like "world's oldest Levis" and dropping names of authorities who didn't give him permission to use. he indicated he would be re-listing the jeans at a lower reserve in a couple days, unless someone contacted him outside of ebay and made an offer. ultimately, it sounds like he is trying to sell something he doesnt fully understand or can handle.

[Serge d Nimes]

He told me that he is going to relist them

Carpe Denim!

[XX]

they've been relisted for a few days

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=209&item=3976424656&rd=1

[johnmc]

The seller ended this listing early because the item is no longer available for sale.