Jump to content

Acronym.


Westbrook

Recommended Posts

Thanks for the updates on the bags, everyone!

 

Interesting idea, we could probably get the majority of the spec sheets together between us if it was of use? We'd need a central repository for them though, if anyone's got any ideas?

 

 

Recently I've been using Airtable for stuff like this - the free tier includes 2GB storage and team editing, and it's convenient for spreadsheets that include images.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Interesting idea, we could probably get the majority of the spec sheets together between us if it was of use? We'd need a central repository for them though, if anyone's got any ideas?

 

Recently I've been using Airtable for stuff like this - the free tier includes 2GB storage and team editing, and it's convenient for spreadsheets that include images.

 

Well, if we'll find this idea worthy, I think that something like Airtable will be great! Unfortunately, I'm not good with it, so if someone can initiate, you are welcome! :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, if we'll find this idea worthy, I think that something like Airtable will be great! Unfortunately, I'm not good with it, so if someone can initiate, you are welcome! :)

I can take a crack at it, certainly. Although - does anyone know why Acrhive was shut down? Was Errolson uncomfortable with having a comprehensive public archive of his work available?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I can take a crack at it, certainly. Although - does anyone know why Acrhive was shut down? Was Errolson uncomfortable with having a comprehensive public archive of his work available?

 

Probably.  It's basically a gold mine for other, larger design houses to copy (paging Gucci).  If you decide to pursue this, it should be private (i.e. PW-locked), IMO.  But that raises the issue of who is the gatekeeper? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What I have coded is a static website and the specsheets are added manually.

-I guess there will huge administration with the launch and every season drop.

-there needs to be some quality control

-there also needs to be some sort of invisible mark, only the person owning the specsheet and page admin will notice so we avoid fake activity - simple swapping two images so the order is wrong but unnoticable (legit check of the specsheet service included)

 

 

I will get free hosting on local server  (there is transfer cap but whatever)

working prototype looks like this: (second dropdown are models)

acr-ss-db.png

Edited by danii
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I doubt anyone is able to create a gravity pocket from just seeing pics of:

-zipper on sleeve

-phone sticking out of sleeve, held in palm

 

aka I don't find it a goldmine forr counterfeits, but it's important topic

Edited by danii
Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

aka I don't find it a goldmine forr counterfeits, but it's important topic

 

i don't think PK was referencing straight up counterfeiting but rather other large labels using it as "inspiration". at any rate i think it's a really cool idea. i'd offer help in the graphic design department, but i'm pretty sure that's in good hands with you already.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

i don't think PK was referencing straight up counterfeiting but rather other large labels using it as "inspiration". at any rate i think it's a really cool idea. i'd offer help in the graphic design department, but i'm pretty sure that's in good hands with you already.

 

Yes, exactly.  Errolson has also explicitly stated in an interview that the whole reason for subnet is not for any sort of faux-secrecy, fun, or branding, rather out of need to keep their pieces "underground" until production is actually done and the pieces are ready for sale because they are competing with houses with huge coffers (and infrastructure to match) that can easily take a design that ACR will release in a few months' time and push it out before ACR does, effectively usurping ACR's releases. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, exactly.  Errolson has also explicitly stated in an interview that the whole reason for subnet is not for any sort of faux-secrecy, fun, or branding, rather out of need to keep their pieces "underground" until production is actually done and the pieces are ready for sale because they are competing with houses with huge coffers (and infrastructure to match) that can easily take a design that ACR will release in a few months' time and push it out before ACR does, effectively usurping ACR's releases. 

 

78nnVdW.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites

78nnVdW.png

 

Yup, knew someone would ask that :P  It was The Collective podcast interview, which I'm listening to again now to find the timestamp. 

 

*Edit: Here we go, the discussion starts around ~43 min to ~55 min (tried my best to transcribe the relevant part):

 

Errolson: It [our brand image] can be misleading because people don't realize that when we decide to release 14 products, those were the 14 products we could make.  That is it.  There is nothing else that could've happened at that time.  And it's like every one of the products that we make and goes out the door that ships is a victory.  It's a battle that was fought and it's never clear that it's actually going to happen until it leaves the door.  It's a crazy way to make things because nothing is business as usual with Acronym.  It's always, we're always pushing the limits so far and so hard all the time that at any point, one of a thousand things can go wrong and a product will not be completed or will not ship or will not pass quality control.  And so when you're working like that all the time, you really have to be sure you want to do something because there's no other way to get it done.  Yeah, I think that comes through at some subconscious level.

 

Ash: You guys have a really interesting Willy Wonka approach too, which I love too.  You guys have this, you both keep this secret and then you drop it.  And the way you drop it is a very unique thing as well.  And if you're not ready for it...Andrew was mentioning what you had something about, they won't show a preview or something for the collections, right?

 

Andrew: Oh yeah, one of the questions from the Facebook people, from the community asked why there was so much secrecy in showing previews of the collections.

 

Errolson: Oh right, yeah.  There's very practical realities to that.  I mean, one of the things when I look at your world and the way concept art gets done and what I find so fascinating is there's just so much exchange as far as tutorials, and you can buy reference libraries of parts for 3D things that artists have created and put them together and make something new yourself.  You know, there's so many places to learn.  Artists seem to be so willing to exchange, "this how I did this, this is how I did that."  In fashion, none of that happens and those are closely guarded secrets.  I was thinking about well, why is that?  I think really it comes down to the fact that the infrastructure for fashion is so so critical.  No matter how good your product is or the design, if you don't have the pipeline to get that thing onto the street, it's basically no one's going to see it.  And another company can come along, absorb what you've done, basically instantaneously and drop it out at thousands of locations in a matter weeks or months.  And that idea is gone, and there is no way to get it back.  That kind of thing is the reason that Acronym is the way it is.  There's no...it's such a cost-, labor-, resource-intensive industry that and it's so cutthroat, and the pace is so fast; the way we sell Acronym and the way we develop and promote it has all evolved.  It was never really like...there was no strategic branding decision like, "we're going secretive and we're going to have this website where you need a password to get on and login."  That was never a plan, and those were just hard realities of, "God, how do we actually show this to people, show this to the right people so that they can buy it, but then not have to travel around the world or not have to make 15 sample collections and all of that kind of thing."

Edited by piece keeper
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Little late to the party but just got J1a-GT last night and excited to test it today.

It's perfect for the shitty rain weather in San Francisco.

Hopefully there will be inner layer attachment to maker it warmer, would love to

take this to Yosemite.

IMG_8773.png

J1A-GT

P10-CH

Visvim 20L

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Probably.  It's basically a gold mine for other, larger design houses to copy (paging Gucci).  If you decide to pursue this, it should be private (i.e. PW-locked), IMO.  But that raises the issue of who is the gatekeeper?

 

 

 

I doubt anyone is able to create a gravity pocket from just seeing pics of:

-zipper on sleeve

-phone sticking out of sleeve, held in palm

 

aka I don't find it a goldmine forr counterfeits, but it's important topic

 

 

Yes, exactly.  Errolson has also explicitly stated in an interview that the whole reason for subnet is not for any sort of faux-secrecy, fun, or branding, rather out of need to keep their pieces "underground" until production is actually done and the pieces are ready for sale because they are competing with houses with huge coffers (and infrastructure to match) that can easily take a design that ACR will release in a few months' time and push it out before ACR does, effectively usurping ACR's releases.

 

 

I just want to throw a little bit of logic here to douse this fire of misinformation before it gets out of hand and people get worried.

 

subnet is to protect Acronym's future seasons from being counterfeited.

 

This should really really go without saying but once Acronym releases a product it's not a secret anymore. If Guici or anyone else wants to know "how gravity pockets work" they're not going to be thwarted by a lack of online pictures. They can just buy one of these things like the rest of us.

 

I don't think anyone here is proposing creating an acrhive website which includes next-season's pieces in it, this is solely to capture information about past-seasons which has previously been publicly accessible anyway.

 

I can't believe I've never bothered doing this but look, here it is, an archived snapshot of ACR-SS-11 from the official source

https://web.archive.org/web/20120126075825/http://www.acronym.de/collection.php?id=11

And finally, Acronym does reserve intellectual property rights to all the imagery they produce. However, I would not think they have a legal precedence to claim infringement on what we're proposing to assemble (fair use). 

 

I already have a ACR-SS-DB website coded:)

I'm curious Danii, what does that stand for? Acronym-SpringSummer-Database? I was thinking of calling it acropedia actually...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I just want to throw a little bit of logic here to douse this fire of misinformation before it gets out of hand and people get worried.

 

subnet is to protect Acronym's future seasons from being counterfeited.

 

This should really really go without saying but once Acronym releases a product it's not a secret anymore. If Guici or anyone else wants to know "how gravity pockets work" they're not going to be thwarted by a lack of online pictures. They can just buy one of these things like the rest of us.

 

I don't think anyone here is proposing creating an acrhive website which includes next-season's pieces in it, this is solely to capture information about past-seasons which has previously been publicly accessible anyway.

 

I can't believe I've never bothered doing this but look, here it is, an archived snapshot of ACR-SS-11 from the official source

https://web.archive.org/web/20120126075825/http://www.acronym.de/collection.php?id=11

And finally, Acronym does reserve intellectual property rights to all the imagery they produce. However, I would not think they have a legal precedence to claim infringement on what we're proposing to assemble (fair use). 

 

I'm curious Danii, what does that stand for? Acronym-SpringSummer-Database? I was thinking of calling it acropedia actually...

 

 

Yes, of course.  That subnet example was offered purely for context and to inform us of Errolson's stance when it comes to competition/secrecy.  

 

Tracking down a piece to purchase and inspect it with the intention of copying it is harder than it sounds (I mean, we've all had our troubles getting our hands on certain pieces).  "Just buy one" is obviously easier said than done with ACR  :P

 

And it's also a different thing to use archive.org, etc. to manually look up previous items (I've done it a lot, it's tedious) versus having a central repository of all previous pictures/spec-sheets to download/peruse.  The former can take lots of time, the latter could be done by a monkey.  It eases the access and therefore makes it more appealing and convenient to "draw inspiration from."  I agree, lack of online pictures won't thwart a devoted designer, but it at least goes a long way to filter out the lazy ones that aren't willing to go through that tedium.

 

In the Gucci example, it took them about 4-5 years to bring it out.  Who knows how or why it took that long, but the fact of the matter is that it was still done much after ACR, so there is some value in "protecting" previous collections.  I'm not saying don't do it, because in the end the product is ours once we buy it.  But what I am saying is exercise discretion, and try to help out Errolson and co. so they can keep doing what they're doing.

 

And I assume the "SS" is Spec Sheet.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

SS=Spec Sheet, correct guess

 

Anyone knows how the ACR vs. Gucci ended up?

 

Yes it's hard for us to get pieces we want but if you are for example trying to copy gravity pocket (and ignore the pat.pending) you don't have to buy exact piece in exact size, exact colour, exact material/season. They can just go online and buy jacket with that technology.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Acronym's patents and designs are protected, but it's not our responsibility to stop people from infringing upon them.

 

Acronym doesn't protect their intellectual property by hiding their products from the world. They protect their property by filing lawsuits against people who do infringe their IP if and when they produce something (like Guici).

 

If showing someone a copyrighted design was the same as reproducing a copyrighted design then none of use would be allowed to talk about acronym, or post pictures of it to places like this, or even wear it in public.

Edited by Sypron
Link to comment
Share on other sites

you guys are talking past eachother.

 

the acrhive was apparently taken down on request from acr. acr's request to take down the acrhive stems from an apparent unease on their part regarding the existence of an extensive third party database of acr designs. whether this unease is fueled by a fear of facilitating design infringement, or embarrassment on erlsn's part to see his old haircuts propagated into eternity, we can't tell. however, acr's tendency towards secrecy is mentioned, and illustrated with examples, as a possible explanation. that's all there is to it. 

Edited by Inkinsurgent
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just a legal aside, patents pending does not mean that their IP is protected.  Competitors can still copy, and Acrnm has no legal options until their patents are official.  A patent is just the legal right to sue someone for infringing on IP.

 

This is a moot point, because we are talking about one or two jackets at most, but sometimes larger companies will still copy regardless of a patent because the profits they generate outweigh any legal costs they incur.  Why do you think Apple and Samsung are perenially in court; they make more money in revenues of "copied" goods than it costs than in legal fees.  Financially, Acrnm knows that Gucci can easily bully them legally.

 

Finally, patents are not clear cut.  There is no universal patent office. You can file in Europe and North American, but it may not be recognized elsewhere.  Most of the modern world cooperates with each other but suing someone internationally is stupidly hard.  (Once again using Apple and Samsung as examples, why do you think they keep suing each other in different countries' courts?)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Little late to the party but just got J1a-GT last night and excited to test it today.

It's perfect for the shitty rain weather in San Francisco.

Hopefully there will be inner layer attachment to maker it warmer, would love to

take this to Yosemite.

IMG_8773.png

J1A-GT

P10-CH

Visvim 20L

 

Congrats! Love that jacket.

 

Out of curiosity, what size did you get for the J1A-GT? And how tall are you? I'm thinking of getting a pair but on the fence on whether I should get a small or a medium. I currently own an NIKE lab ACG 2-in-1 in a size S and it fits great. I'm wondering if the fit of the J1A-GT will be similar. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...