Acronym.

[TaoSpace]

Hi Shadows,

 

Thoughtful post, thanks! Not sure we disagree all that much.

I started on ACR around 2010 so for me fit-wise things have always been good. Someone new looking to get in to it, would get something that has a great fit. Haven't had problems with XPac myself but I agree on the Epic and it seems so does ACR, as they moved over to heavyweight Stotz altogether it seems.

 

I love SISP and Veilance but have never seen Herno Laminar in person. SISP and Veilance are of course in the same bracket but to me their aesthetics are very different. SISP is clearly more experimental in terms of materials, and as a result, not as "clean". Veilance is ultra-clean, much more urban and blends better with more traditional wear than ACR's more prominent military look does.

From the looks of it Laminar is the most traditional and mainly just shares the technical fabrics and of course the designer .

They are all "compatible", yes or as Errolson might say "different parts of the same house" (that was SISP vs. ACR btw). But still different enough that you cannot really replace the one with the other IMHO. But you are right that my "even remotely close" was a bit over the top.

 

Forgot about Tilak, but that too seems to have been more so in the past, than today. Today's Stinger (as seen on the Tilak homepage) seems like a very different jacket than the GT-J20 was. Ditto for the Ogre (check out the difference in the back for instance)

No doubt both are good quality jackets but very different aesthetics.

 

Again, unless you're buying dead-stock or 2nd hand, a new ACR buyer would get a piece that is well made, has a great fit and is pretty unique.

 

Since we're fans, I agree that we have a tendency to get carried away. That said though, we're not rubes that are getting fleeced by a greedy mega-corp based out of Germany either. Or are we....?

Edited August 8, 2013 by TaoSpace

[shadows]

On my phone now so excuse the short post, I agree with your post when it comes down to it we're not far from each other.

I enjoy paying extra for Acronym to fund Errolson and Michaela. They are good and nice people and put a great amount of effort in the brand for a very small turnover. Thats one factor I always keep in mind.

[Brainboy]

ACRNM is worth it but you have to be a fan. 

 

 

Made by people earning a real wage? - Not bloody likely.

 

From what I know, workers there are paid more than a minimum wage even though the factory is in the region with high unemployment.

[TaoSpace]

Hi Brainboy,

 

Maybe you misunderstand: I was asking my question in relation to an imagined brand with styling, fit and quality like ACR. It was a follow up to the "Can you get something even remotely similar elsewhere?" question. If you answered yes, then chances are that this imagined brand would likely be made in a sweatshop somewhere in Asia, rather than in a factory in C.R. where people are paid a reasonable wage like ACR is.

 

Sorry for the confusion.

Edited August 8, 2013 by TaoSpace

[Brainboy]

Tao

I see... It's true and I would hate to see this niche urban techwear to be made in Asian sweatshops one day, mass produced, watered down and lacking in quality.

[readytoignite]

i'd guess that the use of a factory in the czech republic has to do with technical capability and proximity to berlin for oversight (treatment of workers would be corollary to this).

 

it's kind of retarded to debate value but here's my two cents based on what i've been able to wear:

 

2 jackets are some of the greatest jackets i've ever seen and would be hard pressed to find anywhere else - e-j21 and hy-j3.  i've worn the e-j21 throughout the summer

 

ds-j5 is a great idea but fits weirdly as a blazer - it may be more successful on a more meso/endomorphic body types... i don't love it but am not looking to get rid of it

 

gt-j22 is cool and all but there's probably enough other options that i'm not sure it justifies the premium (even at the sale price i got it for)

 

ds-la3 benefits from a pricing distortion of seeming inexpensive next to $1k jackets.  it's fine and all but not a must.  although i am a sucker for an overshirt

 

i should note that you don't have to love or buy everything a brand does to appreciate it - that said i'm happy to pony up for the handful of special pieces that i have a chance to snag

 

i don't even think of sisp, acronym or laminar to be overlapping so have no comment there.  the laminar stuff is great btw.

 

veilance is well done but sort of boring; the one benefit is it seems to be heavily discounted during sale time.  though i suppose that means it needs to rethink its retail channels

[TaoSpace]

Good overview readytoignite.

 

See your point with Veilance. Its well made but I'd never pick one of their jackets over an ACR or even SISP. Too much "gray man" for me. Their LS and SS shirts and the Blazer LT are really great though. If you're unsure of the DS-J5, try finding the Blazer LT (not the windshell one!). It's really nice and meshes with everything from more traditional stuff with jeans to tech stuff like ACR and SISP. One of my go-to pieces. And if you ever change your mind on the DS-J5 and its medium, I'll really make it worth your while.  

Edited August 9, 2013 by TaoSpace

[danii]

minimum wage in cz: 328eur / month
acr worker wage: 387-464eur / month (src: ad seeking worker)

it might seem underpaid compared to foreign countries, but with 10% unemployment in the district of sumperk it's not really bad. you can buy 60m² flat in sumperk for 19000eur and whole pizza for less than 3eur. what matters most (unfortunatelly) for czech people is the price of beer which is below 1eur for 0.5l (in a pub).

found an ad seeking same person for tilak offering minimum wage.

 

i am sure that acr did not pick czech republic because of the relatively cheap workers, michaela already complained about some issues that were caused in sumperk that made them consider relocation. so the reason is mainly the existance of tilak factory and errolson working for them. now acr factory is no longer part of tilak factory.

another fact that supports it is that they are sewing just the technical clothes there. t-shirts and knits are japanmade and bags berlinmade.

Edited August 9, 2013 by danii

[zeusneckone]

Great convo. Sincerely diggin' people's opinions & reasoning.

Hope everyone's well.

[greencarman]

Wanted - gt-j5a size large

Will pay top dollar

[flu]

Alright, so to be honest I don't know much about Acronym, but reading all your replies and insights I feel I learned a little bit of what they are about. I was looking for something like that, so thanks guys.

 

Now I just have to stack to buy a piece

[cmdR]

Sorry Thijs but I beg to differ on this.

 

 

Is ACR some of the most well made fashion around? - The X-Pac tears pretty easily, zippers are not that great, Epic rips and fades really fast etc. But it's above reasonable.

Does it fit exceptionally well? - Mwah...the last few seasons since 2009 it's really getting there (before that it was ultra baggy).

Does it look totally bad-ass? - Yes.

Can you get anything even remotely approaching it anywhere else? - SISP, Herno and Veilance.

Made by people earning a real wage? - Made in CR, in the Tilak factory so yes they do get a decent minimum wage.

For less money? - Depends on the piece, the GT-J20 for example is the Tilak Stinger....

Is that level of fit, finish, looks and/or brand-ethos important to you? - You decide.

 

Yes Acronym is a great brand, but sometimes we do get a little carried away and praise it a bit too much imo.

But the overall feeling that acronym gives you is worth the extra money and yup I believe it's worth it.

It's a little late but there are a few things I wanted to say in response:

No, in my experience my X-Pac pieces don't tear easily, it doesn't tear at all.

I have quite a few Epic pieces and none have ripped. It does fade after a wash (so does Stotz/Ventile because the fibres are so thick the dyes can't fully penetrate or so I read) and it does wear in and develop a patina, once set in some creases on Epic are impossible to remove. However this is really more a matter of a limitation of the fabrics than anything to do with Acronym's QC. Zippers are great too. Acronym uses quality YKK stuff. Also I much prefer the (mostly) plastic zippers than metal ones that SISP and other brands use. They are lighter, smoother and less stiff.

Fit exceptionally well? It really depends from piece to piece but it's unfair to say that the older pieces don't fit well. Yes the sizing of the older pieces can be punishing if you aren't in shape/thin and indeed a lot of pieces are baggier and looser, but that can be considered the aesthetic of the time as well as a key Acronym manifesto; everything is designed with ease of movement and articulation in mind. The least restrictive gear are labelled DFMA (Designed For Martial Arts), so if you can do splits with those you can do just about anything in them. It's only recently that the know how has caught up to the ideal and we are seeing pieces that appear fitting yet allow full freedom of movement by tactical implementation of gussets in strategic areas (without resorting to stretch fabrics). Also, it may not be to everyone's taste but there's something to be said about the baggy look, my fave pant of all time is the SP12TS, I'm hoping a long pant version will be made in the future.

But yeah good discussion, cheers!

[Sypron]

Aren't 80% of the world's zippers YKK anyway?

[TEKsevenZERO]

I Crave the looser stuff, I can never be thin !! If I excercise heavily I tend to broaden !

Acronym sits in a place that VERY few other brands do, the fact that they are a tiny artisan company, with the freedom to allow that rare  mix of leftfield protoytpe makes it to full production.

The interaction between customer & design team and producers is two way and not shielded by an impenetrable layer of corporate BS and marketing bureaucrats.

The prices may be higher than other 'street or outdoor brands'- but construction and aesthetics far surpass AND lest we forget that it is not in the giddy price realms of of shitty high fashion house stuff ! 

Most of the latest seasons do not fit me - I am too large but it doesn't stop me wanting it!

I think I may have said before, but it is not the individual detail but the WHOLE 9 yards, everything that sits together across all layers from garment to marketing to location of design and manufacture to colour to feel even down to the music and design of the video showcasing the collections to the fonts used.....you get the idea.

 

Gestalt

 

 I do not go around complaining that I cannot afford an Aston Martin or Koenigsegg, they are just cars after all that drive on the same street as the (affordable) others. (I drive Saab by the way !)

[pun05]

This is a great forum topic of acronym discourse!

 

I am looking for a 3A-L1-13 13" Laptop Sleeve & 3A-MTS1 USB Stick Pocket and will appreciate if anyone knows where or willing to sell. Thanks!

Edited August 12, 2013 by pun05

[TEKsevenZERO]

3A-12TS and ACR x Uslu Airlines Nail Polish Now Available online.

ACRONYM®_Update: 0812
3A-12TS and ACR x Uslu Airlines nail polish now available online.



ACR x Uslu Airlines Nail Polish Pack (Black & Olive)







3A-12TS

Thank you for your interest.
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Edited August 12, 2013 by TEKsevenZERO

[proteus]

Impulse copped the 3A-12TS. Hope it can fit my kindle it there (read: not as limited by its size as it seems).

[pompadork]

12TS looks slick but I don't know what I'd use it for. It's really small. 

 

Also a video:

 

Edited August 12, 2013 by pompadork

[shoreman]

12TS looks slick but I don't know what I'd use it for. It's really small. 

 

Also a video:

 

 

Well, it's been accessorized for women in the web shop, but it could make for a nice, small bag to carry your keys, wallet and phone during the summer if it's too humid for a jacket and you don't like stuffing your pant pockets with bulky items. 

[pompadork]

^ Impulse bought (._.  ) 

 

I think it's really small and its use for me will be limited. I'm thinking when I don't want to carry my backpack because it's either too big for a short walk / it's too hot and I just want to bring around keys and so on. I wish there were more photos of it slung / worn though. 

[danii]

i heard it's kindle compatible

[WillKhitie]

^ on the verge of doing the same thing. Wished the strapped could've been better. Can't imagine how it's exactly worn but WTH. Fills in such a weird void that I want it.  

[cmdR]

Here's a pic I took early last year (!!)
 

 

The Kindle fits but fills it out oddly. 

[drgitlin]

Ordered one as a present for the wife. And no, I'm not the dude who then also spent $2k on stuff for himself.

[flu]

12TS looks slick but I don't know what I'd use it for. It's really small. 

 

Also a video:

 

Looks like a good camera bag. Video was funny to me, FLOCKA!

[Yardsale]

 

Can be slung low

[proteus]

Good to hear!  Currently have a Cordura 3A-1, 3A-2, a 3A-5TS and a 3A-9TS in Xpac. Still eyeing that Ipad bag. If Xpac is strong enough to propel an entire sailboat forward, it's probably good enough to carry a laptop and some other random stuff.

 

Still, would like to hear about why the poster who said Xpac tears easily thinks that way though, anecdotal evidence always helps.

 

Cmdr/Danii, thanks for the headsup about the kindle. This would at least make it an ideal low profile bag for me.

[shadows]

I don't have pictures right now but will tell you the story.

 

My friend had a 3A-1 in X-pac (first batch), within 6 months of daily use a couple of the corners had holes in them. The fabric was just worn through. 

 

In my other post I also said Epic, my bad I meant Stotz Etaproof. My S-J4 had considerable wear at area's with friction, the fabric was becoming extremely thin (see-through thin). And the S-J11 of a friend had a hole near the shoulder were a seam ripped and 2 holes near the gravity pockets were the fabric had ripped. Also considerable wear on friction area's. All within 1 year of daily use.

 

I've also seen 2 jackets with zipper defaults, one where the zipper itself broke and one where the stiching of the zipper ripped. All in the same season though so could have been a bad batch.

 

I'm not saying the quality is shit or anything, but you can't expect a jacket (certainly the stotz) to last a lifetime.

Which is perfectly normal, for a lifetime jacket you should use some super teflon thread for you stiching etc.

Defects just happen, even with acronym

[Sypron]

My friend had a 3A-1 in X-pac (first batch), within 6 months of daily use a couple of the corners had holes in them. The fabric was just worn through. 

 

In my other post I also said Epic, my bad I meant Stotz Etaproof. My S-J4 had considerable wear at area's with friction, the fabric was becoming extremely thin (see-through thin). And the S-J11 of a friend had a hole near the shoulder were a seam ripped and 2 holes near the gravity pockets were the fabric had ripped. Also considerable wear on friction area's. All within 1 year of daily use.

 

I've also seen 2 jackets with zipper defaults, one where the zipper itself broke and one where the stiching of the zipper ripped. All in the same season though so could have been a bad batch.

 

This doesn't fill me with confidence. I'm looking to buy a few new items to pad out my currently small collection. Next season is just around the corner and I want to work out in advance what the best option is for a pant material and jacket material (no choice for 3A stuff either way). 

 

I'm hearing all sorts of things like Epic fading, Stotz wearing, GT ripping and now general faults. 

 

How are the DRYSKIN items? Do they stand up to the claims of toughness and 'indestructibility'?

 

I'm undecided between WB-400 and Stotz for a pant (full length, not shorts). I've had brief exposure to WB-400 and it makes a lot of noise, but it's less prone to fading than Stotz (and unlike with jackets, I was pants frequently). 

[cmdR]

Cmdr/Danii, thanks for the headsup about the kindle. This would at least make it an ideal low profile bag for me.

 

Just be aware that even though it fits, it's not ideal; not designed for carrying Kindles. 

 

This doesn't fill me with confidence. I'm looking to buy a few new items to pad out my currently small collection. Next season is just around the corner and I want to work out in advance what the best option is for a pant material and jacket material (no choice for 3A stuff either way). 

 

I'm hearing all sorts of things like Epic fading, Stotz wearing, GT ripping and now general faults. 

 

How are the DRYSKIN items? Do they stand up to the claims of toughness and 'indestructibility'?

 

I'm undecided between WB-400 and Stotz for a pant (full length, not shorts). I've had brief exposure to WB-400 and it makes a lot of noise, but it's less prone to fading than Stotz (and unlike with jackets, I was pants frequently). 

 

Sypron, there may have been some bad batches here and there but I don't think it's a cause for concern. 

I discovered Acronym in 2009 (or was it the other way around?) and I've been wearing/using their pieces everyday since then, in my experience their quality control and workmanship are exceptional, better than a lot of big name brands that costs much more. In the rare case that you do encounter a problem, it gets sorted out quickly and efficiently. 

 

Regarding the new WB-400 fabric, it is thinner and softer than before, doesn't hold a crease, resist stains and is quieter and falls better than Stotz. It's a pretty cool next gen fabric. But I still prefer Stotz though, it's just too warm for WB-400 where I live.