Freewheelers, Bootleggers Reunion, Bubo, etc.

[Ar_thor]

4 hours ago, CSL said:

It's been a while since I was seriously tempted by anything from Freewheelers but I recently found a couple of items I couldn't do without. First class service from John Lofgren & Speedway. Unfortunately it's 85 degrees in the house today so  it'll be a while before I can wear them.

 

The shirt is great, I've ordered it as well 

Edited August 17, 2020 by Ar_thor

[Dr_Heech]

@Duke Mantee Any chance of some pics of your 1922 tux this weekend?

[Duke Mantee]

1 minute ago, Dr_Heech said:

@Duke Mantee Any chance of some pics of your 1922 tux this weekend?

Seiichiro just got the jeans in Doc so it’ll be a few days or more (depending on post) before I can oblige - but I’ve asked him to send me a pic in the meantime. I’ll post that up when it arrives

[Broark]

@Dr_Heech here’s some photos to hold you over. Look very nice!

 

[Dr_Heech]

@Broark thank you. Just saw some similar pics on lg from another poster.

They do look promising; the light weight  belt loops are a nice touch. They look a mix of early 20's and latter 20's but will wait til old Duke gets his hands on his for a full detailed analysis on the 1927 tux, as he's my chosen influencer.

[Broark]

@Dr_Heech agreed, I’ll rely on Duke’s influencer powers to be fully swayed. 20’s style jeans aren’t represented in my collection (contest TCB 20’s got returned due to the arc debacle, sold the LB / YM Factory 20’s as they were too small). These do look nice but I need to sell some stuff off first before making any more purchases...

[MJF9]

^ spotted any size charts online yet?  

[Broark]

@MJF9 Mirror Ball has raw and OW product pages with measurements, here’s the raw page: http://the-rising.co.jp/?action=item_detail&id=5186

[MJF9]

Thanks mate - apologies for coming across lazy there - I looked recently on the rounds and couldn't see anything hence the quick question

That 1927 jacket remains tempting too!  If CSF did one, it'd be a 12 month wait most probably

[shredwin_206]

What’s the price on the 20s one wash jeans? 
Ive never had any 20s cut jeans....

[beautiful_FrEaK]

39,600¥ as per the link with the measurements above

 

Edit: sorry those are the non-wash jeans but one-wash will probably cost the same

Edited August 22, 2020 by beautiful_FrEaK

[shredwin_206]

Thanks @beautiful_FrEaK wondering why the big price difference? I think I paid $300 shipped for my 47 one wash 

[Duke Mantee]

43 minutes ago, Dr_Heech said:

@Broark thank you. Just saw some similar pics on lg from another poster.

They do look promising; the light weight  belt loops are a nice touch. They look a mix of early 20's and latter 20's but will wait til old Duke gets his hands on his for a full detailed analysis on the 1927 tux, as he's my chosen influencer.

30 minutes ago, Broark said:

@Dr_Heech agreed, I’ll rely on Duke’s influencer powers to be fully swayed. 20’s style jeans aren’t represented in my collection (contest TCB 20’s got returned due to the arc debacle, sold the LB / YM Factory 20’s as they were too small). These do look nice but I need to sell some stuff off first before making any more purchases...

Couple of old charmers 

It’s neither my job or my desire to influence anyone on the merits of FW - and it’s not my fault they are better than anyone else ...

Anyway, as I said earlier, I asked Seiichiro to ping me a couple of snaps before he posted them - he sent me 40 pics, so if there’s any influencing that should be noted it’s that Hoosier is your best FW bar none! So here are some of them:

[Broark]

Seiichiro is the man, hands down. Those are some top quality 20’s jeans and great photos. I like the plain buckle on those. Only problem is I have quite a full stable at the moment. I think my goal today is to go through some stuff and decide on what to sell.

[Duke Mantee]

20 minutes ago, shredwin_206 said:

Thanks @beautiful_FrEaK wondering why the big price difference? I think I paid $300 shipped for my 47 one wash 

I asked that question as soon as I found out they were in the pipeline

Two things:

1. Longer production 

2. Extra hardware

[shredwin_206]

Thanks for the info King  @Duke Mantee

[Dr_Heech]

Just realised the jeans are labelled 1922 and the jacket a 1927, so a 1920's tux then.

@Duke Mantee Is their a photo of the inside back pocket rivet amongst the others? Want to know if their is no bartack under the rivet, or if their is...

[Duke Mantee]

35 minutes ago, Dr_Heech said:

Just realised the jeans are labelled 1922 and the jacket a 1927, so a 1920's tux then.

@Duke Mantee Is their a photo of the inside back pocket rivet amongst the others? Want to know if their is no bartack under the rivet, or if their is...

 

[Dr_Heech]

Thanks @Duke Mantee

So l stand by my original statement, they are definately a mix of early 1920's and latter 1920's details.

One thing is nagging me though, the back panels look to be right over left, which is incorrect if so, as the original garment (Levis 501XX) wouldn't have had this feature until sometime in the mid to late 1930's. 

[Duke Mantee]

34 minutes ago, Dr_Heech said:

Thanks @Duke Mantee

So l stand by my original statement, they are definately a mix of early 1920's and latter 1920's details.

One thing is nagging me though, the back panels look to be right over left, which is incorrect if so, as the original garment (Levis 501XX) wouldn't have had this feature until sometime in the mid to late 1930's. 

You’re right that the bartack or lack thereof better identifies the date Doc - although I’m not sure of the exact date of the bartack feature - do you know?

Right over left back panels actually featured on 1922 models AFAIK so I think this actually correct 

Edited August 22, 2020 by Duke Mantee

[Dr_Heech]

1 hour ago, Duke Mantee said:

You’re right that the bartack or lack thereof better identifies the date Doc - although I’m not sure of the exact date of the bartack feature - do you know?

Right over left back panels actually featured on 1922 models AFAIK so I think this actually correct 

^l swear lt was left over right on the early models, or am l loosing it? 

[Edit] obviously l am as after a quick squiz l realise you're right. Apologies, probably just tired.

Anyway the bartack was a feature that appeared with other changes, around 1926 or 1927. Other changes include different tooled rivets, non branded fly buttons (like the 1927 blouse) and concave suspender buttons. Around 1927, the hem of the jean was chainstitched; Cone made the redline selvedge especially for Levis that year as well.

Alot of the changes were due to the Stern brothers bringing in their nephew, Walter Hass, who during the mid 1920's, brought Levis up to date with the modern idea of a factory production line, hence all the different changes, especially 1926-28.  

Edited August 22, 2020 by Dr_Heech
You know ...

[Duke Mantee]

15 minutes ago, Dr_Heech said:

^l swear lt was left over right on the early models, or am l loosing it? 

[Edit] obviously l am as after a quick squiz l realise you're right. Apologies, probably just tired.

Anyway the bartack was a feature that appeared with other changes, around 1926 or 1927. Other changes include different tooled rivets, non branded fly buttons (like the 1927 blouse) and concave suspender buttons. Around 1927, the hem of the jean was chainstitched; Cone made the redline selvedge especially for Levis that year as well.

Alot of the changes were due to the Stern brothers bringing in their nephew, Walter Hass, who during the mid 1920's, brought Levis up to date with the modern idea of a factory production line, hence all the different changes, especially 1926-28.  

Thanks for that Doc - I really didn’t know the bartack date, rivets and buttons and all that yes, but not the stitching. It seems then these FW 601XX are (generally) accurate to the earlier 1920s - I’m quite happy to see non chain stitched jeans for a change. Of course they’ve stuck to their own denim, but in a way I’m pleased about that; it’s been developed over years and although it’s not perhaps period correct, I know it and it’s as good as it gets.

[Dr_Heech]

I am definitely impressed with them, as l have been with all the Freewheelers denim l've owned.

I would say however, that they are (generally) more accurate to the latter 1920's, but it's all tomate-oes/tomart-toes at this time of night.

Looking forward to shrinkage info too when they arrive and have been tested 

[JDelage]

@Duke Mantee Hoosier is shipping them to you with EMS?

[Duke Mantee]

5 minutes ago, JDelage said:

@Duke Mantee Hoosier is shipping them to you with EMS?

Yep - 3 days for my last parcel (about a month ago)

[Duke Mantee]

10 minutes ago, Dr_Heech said:

I am definitely impressed with them, as l have been with all the Freewheelers denim l've owned.

I would say however, that they are (generally) more accurate to the latter 1920's, but it's all tomate-oes/tomart-toes at this time of night.

Looking forward to shrinkage info too when they arrive and have been tested 

We can compromise at 1925 - given the hem, right over left, lightweight belt loops, side stitching etc 

[MJF9]

They look really good - looking forward to hearing your verdict and the seeing the fit pics 

Now back to shrinkage  the Mirror Ball charts show difference on thigh measurements between wash and non wash for 36 inch as 34.5cm to 34cm (i.e. 0.5cm) and for 34 inch as 32.5cm to 30.5cm (i.e. 2cm)... MB have presumably made a typo... needs validating another day 

[Duke Mantee]

34 minutes ago, MJF9 said:

They look really good - looking forward to hearing your verdict and the seeing the fit pics 

Now back to shrinkage  the Mirror Ball charts show difference on thigh measurements between wash and non wash for 36 inch as 34.5cm to 34cm (i.e. 0.5cm) and for 34 inch as 32.5cm to 30.5cm (i.e. 2cm)... MB have presumably made a typo... needs validating another day 

That’ll be a typo as you say - but anyway other than one particular pair that is now with Doc, I only ever buy FW one wash now, I can never shrink non-wash to the same measurements so I just don’t bother (The Driver is a particular lesson ). It’s not that important now I guess.

[Dr_Heech]

8 hours ago, Duke Mantee said:

We can compromise at 1925 - given the hem, right over left, lightweight belt loops, side stitching etc 

We are in no way compromising matey, the lack of chainstitching at the hem may have not happened until c.1927, but the selvedge did. Also the flat (rather than concave) suspender buttons combined with branded fly buttons happened in c.1927.

At 1925, the belt loops would've been shorter (1924-25), the rivets were flat topped with dimple until at leat 1926, then the introduction of the more modern rivet was introduced (after another flat topped type rivet was briefly used). Side stitching was introduced around 1922 and the right over left was 1873- 1937ish.

So more '27 than '22, which makes little difference to anyone bar probably me(?) But saying all this, they are still a beautiful jean. The suspender button placement at the top of the waistband, rather than placed more centrally, is spot on, as is the spacing between the button pairs.

They have the little twist in the parallel stitching on the pocket corners (seen on og jackets and jeans, 1922 onwards) and those wonderfully accurate lightweight belt loops. 

Love the use of yellow (must be cotton?) thread against that dark 14oz denim. Freewheelers always have a way of making their denim jeans look more organically/naturally made, and not forced/too clean a finish. Hey not quite CSF but certainly head and shoulders above the rest.

 

[Duke Mantee]

1 hour ago, Dr_Heech said:

We are in no way compromising matey, the lack of chainstitching at the hem may have not happened until c.1927, but the selvedge did. Also the flat (rather than concave) suspender buttons combined with branded fly buttons happened in c.1927.

At 1925, the belt loops would've been shorter (1924-25), the rivets were flat topped with dimple until at leat 1926, then the introduction of the more modern rivet was introduced (after another flat topped type rivet was briefly used). Side stitching was introduced around 1922 and the right over left was 1873- 1937ish.

So more '27 than '22, which makes little difference to anyone bar probably me(?) But saying all this, they are still a beautiful jean. The suspender button placement at the top of the waistband, rather than placed more centrally, is spot on, as is the spacing between the button pairs.

They have the little twist in the parallel stitching on the pocket corners (seen on og jackets and jeans, 1922 onwards) and those wonderfully accurate lightweight belt loops. 

Love the use of yellow (must be cotton?) thread against that dark 14oz denim. Freewheelers always have a way of making their denim jeans look more organically/naturally made, and not forced/too clean a finish. Hey not quite CSF but certainly head and shoulders above the rest.

 

Lol - I love to get you started ...