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Freewheelers, Bootleggers Reunion, Bubo, etc.


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2 hours ago, Duke Mantee said:

Most of the shops like McFly and Genco put fairly copious descriptions on each product page - in fact the detail on those goes far beyond the descriptions I’ve seen for most other similar Japanese brands. That’s a pretty good starting point.

Compare and contrast:

https://www.genco-clothing.com/item/2232012-DMOW/

v.

https://www.realmccoys-nagoya.co.jp/?pid=144514688
https://www.barnstormer.jp/view/item/000000000386

Regards the custom yarn, in honesty, it’s not often mentioned because it’s a standard for FW. Most jeans makers will specify the colour, material and sewing pitch, and the factory being employed will select what they think is best suited to the process - saves a bit of time and money for the designer, and with the factory being able to use their own stocks (or buy from their own suppliers) saves a bit of time and money for them too. FW on the other hand dictate precisely what they want by having the threads made up to their spec.

Buttons are different on each significant cut - this is to make them accurate/authentic to the period of those particular jeans. Some are steel and copper, some are just steel, some have an anti-rust coating and so on.

Even the laurel wreath buttons which can be bought everywhere were deemed unsatisfactory by FW for the war denim and so they had their own make specifically. Personally I found it difficult to see the difference and as I said to others at the time, it didn’t make the jeans better, just more ‘Freewheelers’.

I made this graphic to compare the different cuts and posted it here previously - you should read this thread anyway:

 

33374644-219D-4AFD-B528-DC764DAF3AD0.jpeg
I’m not entirely sure what you are asking by way of rivets - this?

 

A66C13E6-FFCB-4808-A2CB-1C214928132F.jpeg
 

Let me ask you a couple questions:

1.   Does historical accuracy play a part in your selection of raw denim?

2.  If you are about to start wearing your third pair of raw denims what details (buttons, rivets, threads etc) led you to choose the pairs you have?

Wow thanks for all that info. 
1. Historical accuracy doesn’t play a big part but it’s an interesting and welcome extra. 
 

2. I’m planning to start the 601RB in spring. Bought them now because I noticed they sell out and don’t necessary come back in stock when I need it. I picked the lot 004 because I wasn’t happy with my Oni 246. The rise was too low for a “straight cut”. They faded ultra fast and developed blowouts everywhere.  I really don’t like plastic and wanted a jean with all cotton Stiches. Oni is all poly cotton. The more I read about Oni, the more I felt the story they are pushing is BS. Old Japanese guys dont do monthly “drops”, dont do collaborations etc. it felt more like a street fashion brand than classic denim. That all kind of turned me off and I started looking for something more classic. The lot 004 from RMC just fit so well when I tried them on. Thats mostly why I got them. They fit well and looker pretty simply. 
 

I wanted to try an all black jean next and something more classic. That kind of got me interested in FW. 

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2 hours ago, Talan said:

Rivets on the same pair of 51s can be both clean and with chunks of fabric.

51.jpg.60a5873c2307ea6da9245c21e69defbd.jpg

So the same jean is sold with two types of rivets? Wash and non wash I saw they have options. I didn’t know you can chose the rivets too. 

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16 minutes ago, vlad_III said:

Wow thanks for all that info. 
1. Historical accuracy doesn’t play a big part but it’s an interesting and welcome extra. 
 

2. I’m planning to start the 601RB in spring. Bought them now because I noticed they sell out and don’t necessary come back in stock when I need it. I picked the lot 004 because I wasn’t happy with my Oni 246. The rise was too low for a “straight cut”. They faded ultra fast and developed blowouts everywhere.  I really don’t like plastic and wanted a jean with all cotton Stiches. Oni is all poly cotton. The more I read about Oni, the more I felt the story they are pushing is BS. Old Japanese guys dont do monthly “drops”, dont do collaborations etc. it felt more like a street fashion brand than classic denim. That all kind of turned me off and I started looking for something more classic. The lot 004 from RMC just fit so well when I tried them on. Thats mostly why I got them. They fit well and looker pretty simply. 
 

I wanted to try an all black jean next and something more classic. That kind of got me interested in FW. 

No problem

1. Then I might suggest that button types, rivets, custom thread shouldn’t really matter to you (your aversion to plastic excepted)

2. I’d suggest RMC are as much street fashion brand as any you’ll find on this forum … that’s 100% what Tsujimoto wants

Edited by Duke Mantee
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I guess RMC has its fanboys. So far they are holding up better than my Oni. 
can’t wait to start the 601RB. Received them today in the one washed version. Pretty amazing how much puckering is going on there from just one wash. I don’t see anything like that on my RMC after almost 8 months. 
 

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1 hour ago, vlad_III said:

1. Historical accuracy doesn’t play a big part but it’s an interesting and welcome extra. 

Historical accuracy can hardly be considered an extra. Jeans are either a loose interpretation of examples from the past (like Oni, or Samurai, or IH, etc.), or a more or less accurate replica of a certain era products (Freewheelers, Warehouse, etc.). Either one approach or the other, but not both at the same time.

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43 minutes ago, Talan said:

Historical accuracy can hardly be considered an extra. Jeans are either a loose interpretation of examples from the past (like Oni, or Samurai, or IH, etc.), or a more or less accurate replica of a certain era products (Freewheelers, Warehouse, etc.). Either one approach or the other, but not both at the same time.

Hmmm. Not sure what to say. I guess I find the accuracy interesting but don’t know much about it. 

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1 hour ago, vlad_III said:

Hmmm. Not sure what to say. I guess I find the accuracy interesting but don’t know much about it. 

There are knowledgeable people on this forum (not me). You can ask questions, or just browse the various threads. Lots of useful information. Sooner or later it is worth deciding for yourself what you like better, a variety of fantasy thematics, or a faithful reproduction of the classics. This is by no means advice, who am I to give advices? B)

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1 minute ago, ken1123 said:

No, they are the same

Quite disappointed especially I had good experience with Freewheelers

Do not look at both legs selvege simultaneously. Seriously, isn't some irregularities a part of the fun?

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8 minutes ago, Talan said:

Do not look at both legs selvege simultaneously. Seriously, isn't some irregularities a part of the fun?

 

3 minutes ago, Maynard Friedman said:

Exactly, wabi-sabi. Besides, you’d pay £500 for that on a pair of CSF so think of it as a bargain.

You know you would get it from CSF, but I just didn't expect it from Freewheelers  :D

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5 minutes ago, ken1123 said:

Yeah, I have just sent an email to them.

I had the jeans hemmed by them too, so I am sure they know it before they ship the jeans.

Tell what they'll answer. 

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16 hours ago, ken1123 said:

I got them from a Japan retailer Mirror Ball

Ok - I mean if this is a problem it’s not their fault per se, someone at the factory was clearly asleep, but I’d also expect the retailer to be checking this stuff

Edited by Duke Mantee
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5 hours ago, Talan said:

Historical accuracy can hardly be considered an extra. Jeans are either a loose interpretation of examples from the past (like Oni, or Samurai, or IH, etc.), or a more or less accurate replica of a certain era products (Freewheelers, Warehouse, etc.). Either one approach or the other, but not both at the same time.

I think this is just an overly rigid way of looking at it. Historical accuracy is most certainly a few notches down on my list of priorities (the pattern is always first - interestingly this varies a good bit on jeans of the same year from different repro makers) but at the same time a nice feature to dig in to, and all other things being equal, may tip my preference.  

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44 minutes ago, AlientoyWorkmachine said:

I think this is just an overly rigid way of looking at it. Historical accuracy is most certainly a few notches down on my list of priorities (the pattern is always first - interestingly this varies a good bit on jeans of the same year from different repro makers) but at the same time a nice feature to dig in to, and all other things being equal, may tip my preference.  

I can dig both. Although I definitely prefer the repro approach at the moment, today I am happily wearing the Iron Heart 634 21oz, perfect for cold, chilly weather. I only think it makes sense to differentiate and be aware of these two aesthetics.

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2 hours ago, AlientoyWorkmachine said:

I think this is just an overly rigid way of looking at it. Historical accuracy is most certainly a few notches down on my list of priorities (the pattern is always first - interestingly this varies a good bit on jeans of the same year from different repro makers) but at the same time a nice feature to dig in to, and all other things being equal, may tip my preference.  

I think the context has been lost here - I originally asked if @vlad_III  was interested in historical accuracy because of his interest in rivets, buttons and threads. It seems to me these things have little relevance in choosing jeans unless he did indeed have that interest.

In any event if this historical accuracy was relevant then the pattern would be derived from from period of the jeans in question.

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2 hours ago, Duke Mantee said:

I think the context has been lost here - I originally asked if @vlad_III  was interested in historical accuracy because of his interest in rivets, buttons and threads. It seems to me these things have little relevance in choosing jeans unless he did indeed have that interest.

In any event if this historical accuracy was relevant then the pattern would be derived from from period of the jeans in question.

something drew me to Freewheelers, Warehouse, TCB for my next pair. I didn't like the modern low rise and tight cuts of other brands.

I like vinyl, I shoot film and print B&W in my darkroom, I guess I like old things that work. I assume that made me interested in more classical jeans than what I could find in One and Momotaro etc. I like things that are made well. That being said, what @ken1123 posted above is scary. I've sen that with Real McCoy's but not to that extend. If Freewheeler is really that detailed and dictates all the construction details, how could this happen or how did this ever pass quality control?

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10 minutes ago, vlad_III said:

If Freewheeler is really that detailed and dictates all the construction details, how could this happen or how did this ever pass quality control?

@Duke Mantee must have fallen asleep at his post!

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