My name is Electrum and I used to like LVC but now I don't really like it anymore...

[electrum]

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[roy6]

electrum- really good description and pics for the 201s. The closeups are particularly nice.

[airfrogusmc]

Here're my 201s just got from Cultizm--super jeans! Colour is dark phthalocyanine blue(blue/green). Close up, the indigo is very dry w/ a dull chalky appearance yet shows a faint rich luster from a distance. Inside-out the denim has a rustic unbleached grey mossy green tint. The denim has a series of well defined asymmetrical diagonal and horizontal threads throughout creating a plane of complex textural variations -- I can gaze at it all day. Needle work is very crude adding much detail and character. Back pockets are huge w/ a whopping 7.5'' opening. Construction is crude yet solid and flawless. Completely blown away by the quality and the sinister almost spooky appearance-- they look and feel like a relic. They're so phenominal they make my '33s hang their head in shame, have my '37 '555' begging for attention and caused me to cancel my search for the '555' 20 201 version. Price $220 is a bargain -- even w/ the added 19% VAT taht EU customers have to pay they're still a bargain.

Pockets are big enough for a cold one and a pack of smokes. The arc cuts across the pocket serving more as an added reinforcement rather than just decoration. I can picture a '20/'30s steel worker, coal miner, tobacco cutter or share cropper using those giant pockets to hold tools -- they really give these jeans an authentic historic vibe.

Details like this crude needle work in the arc are all over the jeans.

Patch graphics are dark, but detailed. Note it's trimmed back to the stitching like some original samplesI've seen pics of @ Marvins-JP.com.

Note the well defined series of threads shown running diagonally in this pic and how the back pocket stitching runs perfectly parallel with those streaking threads. The denim is absolutely incredible!

Same thread lines opposing side, but shown here running horizontally.

Selvage seam is narrow measuring just a hair over 1/2'' @ exactly 17/32'' width.

They look great. Nice photos too Can't rep ya would if I could.

[Sympathy-For-The-Denim]

@electrum: those look killer but what about those antique brass-bronze rivets they look a bid weired... i recognized those rivets on several other pairs from last years on...

[electrum]

...Great shots eletrum, good to see they're keeping the quality up on these. Did you get actual size?

Yeah I got my actual waist size and they fit perfect, dead on the way you described they would fit in your 501Visual Guide. Got a bit carried away with my praise of the jean, but they are very impressive jeans -- I guess positive rants are better than my negative rants. Anyway, what I don't understand Paul, is where did these come from, what yr. issue are they? I mean these been sold out now for over a yr. then suddenly Cultizm and Silvetto have a whole new inventory in sizes not offered b'fore. Plus they seem different than last issue in that the denim looks unbleached, patch is trimmed, Sympathy mentioned different rivets plus pockets might be a bit bigger than past issues(?) .Could these be some of the first creations from some of those hipsters you know who are now managing the new XX division? If they are then those dudes know what they're doing -- "labor of love", as you said, exemplified. Followinf are tag shots that might help determine production info. Any insight will be greatly appreciated, thanks again PaulT...

@Sympathy: Dunno about rivets, you're asking the wrong person, maybe PaulT can weigh in. I can say they're pretty cool though.

[Paul T]

I agree, they are terrific jeans. On first look, they seem to be new production, because they have the Japanese script. I'd be pretty certain it's still Kurabo fabric, though. I didn't look at Cinch, Ithink the had the 201 but assumed they were old stock - I know the pre-1901 jeans were. I would be interested to know if the future 201 will use Cone or Kurabo, but in any case these look great. Be prepared to wear them for a long time - people moan about the natural indigo SDA, these are at least as slow to fade (and have a similar, subtle look to them).

I don't know about the rivets, I was told by Lynn that some at least of the 200 series had alloy, not copper rivets, altho of course I've seen copper ones on the real thing too.

Not sure about the pockets, they do look the same to me - originals are v large. But overall the details on these do look great.

[electrum]

Many thanks Paul. Now that I have these, I'll soon retire my 37 555s and the 201s will become my new work jeans so I'll be wearing the hell out of em. Since the cut is so full, I'll have to pre soak to get some shrinkage out of the way. Weather right now is too cold and damp to line dry so I'll have to wait till spring before I can start breaking them in. Stay tuned.

[electrum]

...electrum: i wonder if the cut of the 201s had change a bit from the 555 version for i never loved the extreme tapered waist, since i have no ass those look strange at me...

I'm not certain since I've never seen the 555 in hand, but I'd wager to say that the cut is the same because the cut on mine looks just as it's described in the 501 Visual Guide. They're very roomy and fan out fron the waist especially along the sides. I'd decribe them as denim chinos with a baggy rear. The rear end is a bit baggy and droopy, but not too bad -- should be perfect after soak/shrinkage I think. Raw fit pics:

Since I've got the excess length folded under, it's hard to tell in my pics that the leg opening measures 10''.

Also you mentioned that the rivets on these seem strange, here is a close up. They look like most of the 201 rivets I've seen in most other fotos:

[Sympathy-For-The-Denim]

thanks, they seem to fit little less bulky... would lve to see a nice broken in pair, since those are still quite rare... i love the arcuates really on those here... i hope that levis will do 201xx from other years aswell, remembering the great 201 that on ebay for many months;)

from this close view the rivets look better to me for you can see the copper shinin through the oxdation layer...

[electrum]

Hey guys, picked up my first pair of Levis LVC's this past Sunday. Gave them a hot soak and wore them for 2 days straight. What do you guys think?

Judging from your fotos, the denim appears high quality, indigo is solid, patch looks like quality leather and they have beefy selvedge with a broad seam. My '44s were total crap with thin coarse denim that you could actually see through (no shit), pencil thin crimped selvedge seam, leather patch that looked like melted wax after soak, all topped off with putrid violet colour arcs. Mine were LVC Japan -- it's no wonder LS&Co shut them down. Super looking jeans and great fotos too. Where'd you get them and were they raw/rigid?

[thomass]

thanks electrum. sorry to hear about your LVC 44s though. I purchased them at the flea market and got rather lucky on the purchase. They were a bit raw and wwere practically new but i believe they were washed once. since they weren't really THAT raw. felt washed.

[RRLselvageDenim]

@ Electrum - my LVC 1944 Japan was really high quality and on par with my 1999 (555) 1944 - I'm a little surprised about your Japan 44 LVC - will put up comparison photos soon.

[electrum]

Seriously, don't take that from this board. Wear your jeans, pick a different pair in 6 months... take your time, don't just become another consumer.

THere's no reason the next, more expensive, pair will be better than your 47. Put the time into them and they will look excellent.

I doubt that anyone here takes that away from this board. That's what I like about this thread you guys have a genuine passion for the history, quality and unique design surrounding LVC jeans. Whether it's cars, bikes, coins, art, etc., everyone has an appreciation for something that takes them back to another time, another place. Hell if some dude wants to spend his hard-earned disposable income on expensive vintage jeans and it makes him happy then more power to him, that's not consumerism it's a diversion from consumerism.

Unlike other pricey designer jeans, LVC;s are practical and functional -- more utilitarian than simply fashion. I can put them on w/out worrying about getting them dirty or having them fall apart after 12 mos. I'm the only one who knows they cost me 200 bucks, so I don't feel like some pretty boy flaunting some pricey pussy pants that everyone else has because Brat Pitt was seen wearing them. That's what differentiates LVC from the rest -- you're not paying for a trendy fashion statement, you're paying for historic functional quality blue jeans. Foe me that's not consumerism, but rather pragmatism.

[electrum]

..... really like your 201's, they are the new batch(?) - especially like the R/H drop on the pocket arcs. The ones at cinch are 2007 stock, or at least the few pairs I've looked at. Do they have two colours of thread on the back pockets as I couldn't tell from the pics you posted a while back??

.

Whataya say Doc Heech, welcome back.

I tossed the same question out here as did a couple other guys, but no one seems to know. I can tell you this, based on info. posted on the 201 555vs2007 thread mine are different than the 2007 .Mine have mossy green/gray denim inside-out, the patch is trimmed back to the stitch line(which neither 555 nor 2007 have), thread appears to be one colour (if there's a variation it's too faint for me to notice) and there's no code on back button. Also, sizes being offered @ Cultizm & Silvetto (only retailers offering these that I'm aware of) are different than what was offered for 2007 run. Where they came from -- or any other details about them -- seems to be a complete mystery. If I had to guess, I'd say these are 2010 creations from the new XX deal, but if that were the case then the denim would have to be from Cone (right?), yet Paul T seems to think the denim is Karuba sp?...I just don't know. One thing I do know is that they are wonderful jeans full of super cool old world detailed denim and craftsmanship...hats off to whoever produced them.

[Dr_Heech]

Whataya say Doc Heech, welcome back.

I tossed the same question out here as did a couple other guys, but no one seems to know. I can tell you this, based on info. posted on the 201 555vs2007 thread mine are different than the 2007 .Mine have mossy green/gray denim inside-out, the patch is trimmed back to the stitch line(which neither 555 nor 2007 have), thread appears to be one colour (if there's a variation it's too faint for me to notice) and there's no code on back button. Also, sizes being offered @ Cultizm & Silvetto (only retailers offering these that I'm aware of) are different than what was offered for 2007 run. Where they came from -- or any other details about them -- seems to be a complete mystery. If I had to guess, I'd say these are 2010 creations from the new XX deal, but if that were the case then the denim would have to be from Cone (right?), yet Paul T seems to think the denim is Karuba sp?...I just don't know. One thing I do know is that they are wonderful jeans full of super cool old world detailed denim and craftsmanship...hats off to whoever produced them.

Thanks for the info Electrum,

maybe it's time to update the 201 thread? They must be from the 2010 (new XX team) editions, as all other seasons' models are well documented. I'm not sure what the purpose of the trimmed patch is, but when I was in Cinch, I lined all the patches up on the 501 models from 1890-1933, and the patches on the 1890's and 1915's are trimmer than other models. The chap I spoke to couldn't explain why this was, but it could be a cost-cutting exercise?

I bought one of the last pairs of 201's (2007) from oki-ni in the sale, and the denim is different than my 555 201's - not quite as green/blue (maybe more dye in them??)

From what I've seen from the new stuff, since XX took over the helm, is better attention to detail overall.

This seasons' 1944's were amazing! May have to pick up a pair.

.

[electrum]

What;s the point of $500+ for "distressed" jean OR people who destroy their $200+ raw jeans to get a similar effect? I thought that blue jeans are supposed to be practical work wear and/or casual everyday clothing that are meant to last. I never paid any attention to the normal wear that develops on my jeans before I found this blog. Here I find terms like "honeycombs, stacking, whiskers, roping," etc. Those are all neat details that are worth appreciation, but $500+ for distressed or people taking short cuts by tearing up their perfectly fine new $200+ raw jeans with boiling water, sand paper, rasps, coffee grinds so they look "cool" that's ridiculous. I thought the whole point of paying so much money for selvedge jeans is for quality that will last a lifetime. If I want a pair of jeans that shred to pieces after a few washes I'll buy a pair of Levi's Signature from WalMart for under 20 bucks, sure beats the hell out of paying $ 200 then tear them up with tools or spend $500+ for distressed.

[k449]

Electrum,

500+ professionally fucked up jeans are a mystery to me, other than the fact that they are usually marked down pretty significantly in most online shops when they end up on sale. I worked construction for years when I was younger. Not electrical work or residential work-I worked on a grading crew as a laborer, then operator for a huge heavy highway company, and when my jeans got that bad, they went in the trash, and I bought new ones-Carharrts.

Clerk,

I wouldn't be surprised if they were worth double to some idiot. Give them a wash, post them on EBay as "distressed", sit back and watch the auction. I'm betting you have a good chance of at least getting back what you paid for them.

[electrum]

Electrum,

500+ professionally fucked up jeans are a mystery to me,

I'm just sayin, it's hypocrisy to romanticize the bygone era of jeans, then turn around pay $500 for a prefabricated worn out rag OR worse yet take short cuts by deliberately destroying your own jeans by using artificial means. A while back someone posted a pic of jeans with no wear except for a well defined guitar pick impression on the coin pocket. They obviously used sand paper to wear away the denim til it left an impression of the pick. To each their own, but for me that's just pretentious commercialized instant gratification, rather than valuing unique historic functional quality garments that are meant to last and be appreciated for many years.

[electrum]

Answer this question:

If you could make three suggestions to the "brass" at LVC, what would they be?

They should describe in detail how their products are made vs the original. Sugar Cane/Buzz Rickson does it, just go to History Preservation site there you'll see each item described in full detail from what materials are used to how the tailoring compares to the original. Instead LVC gives you the same ol' history lesson about tabs and rivets along with instructions about how to jump in a bath tub to shrink their jeans, I don't care about all that bs, I want to know what I'm paying $200+ for and Levi's aint sayin. What's more, a lot of SC and BR products cost less than LVC especially their shirts and they tell you what you're getting for the money. What makes LVC so special that they can jack their price on similar product w/out tellin you what their's is made of?

[electrum]

Following are fit pics of my 201s after 3 hr hot soak and line dry. Damn things only shrank 1 inch in length, yet lost the full 1/2 inch waist. (??) Only pair of stf jeans I've had that did not shrink 3 or more inches in length in 1st soak. Instead of calling their raw jeans, shrink to fit, LVC should call them, might shrink to fit. Much too long for my liking, otherwise fit great in waist and thighs. Super comfortable too, much like my '33s but much roomier...Should wear well, I;ll just have to gather them more @ bottom which will likely create that "stacking" action that you guys seem to appreciate:

Comparison shot of '37s(left) that shrank 3'' length after quick cold soak, whereas the 201s (right) lost only 1'' after 3hr hot soak. 2 inch difference in shrinkage doesn't seem like much, but makes a huge difference when up agaist the shorter '37. btw, those '37s are coming up on 1 yr w/out wash since initial soak.

[electrum]

Has anyone had problems with the 2010 LVC 201 rigid not shrinking? The pair I have did NOT shrink at all after 3 washes and to add insult to injury they actually gained 1 inch in waist!!! They;ve lost most of the dark indigo, all of their crispness and are too large to wear -- another $220 added to my LVC crapshoot loss column -- what A G'DAMN WASTE! I'm fed up with never knowing what to expect whenever I buy LVC jeans. If I'm going to spend a bundle on jeans I shouldn't have to wonder if or worry about whether they're going to shrink-to-fit, be the right measured size, be the right cut, have quality denim, and so on and so on.... So far I've lost just about $600 because of one LVC f**k up or another. I've been an idiot for throwing good money after bad for LVC rags hoping that maybe one will come along that's at least ok. LVC is like a gambling addiction, you keep betting but you keep losing. I've had all the punishment I can take from this LVC crapshoot game -- it's robbed me of my patience, my time and above all a lot of my money -- F*CK THAT!!

[ChuckO]

The problems are outrageous. The increase in prices is ill advised to me especially with those sorts of problems.

[chris_n]

To the guy who bought stf jeans that didn't shrink: were they stf to begin with?

I find it hard to believe that a pair of cotton jeans wouldn't shrink in the least after even just one wash. Hell, even sanforized jeans do.

[Paul T]

To the guy who bought stf jeans that didn't shrink: were they stf to begin with?

I find it hard to believe that a pair of cotton jeans wouldn't shrink in the least after even just one wash. Hell, even sanforized jeans do.

201 are notorious for not shrinking. It's definitely best to buy your actual waist size in these - shops like Farinelli should change their advice to size up in them, it doesn't work.

[chris_n]

201 are notorious for not shrinking. It's definitely best to buy your actual waist size in these - shops like Farinelli should change their advice to size up in them, it doesn't work.

thanks for dropping the knowledge. i had no idea that 201s were like that.

[electrum]

Someone needs to start a new thread: LVC: A Buyer Beware Guide for Newbies.

Topics could include: denim that never shrink-to-fit according to LVC estimates and sometimes actually gain a size or two after several washes; Paint that washes off of suspender buttons after first rinse, full frontal leg seam twist, crotch blowouts and other quality problems; Models that are always different from one season to the nxt, but that are never true to the original i.e. '47; Tag sizes that never match the true measurements and vary by as much as 3-4 inches for the same model year after year; What constitutes "quality" denim to justify a $200-$350 price tag; Models that transform from good looking raw hefty denim into flimsy dish towels after one rinse; Denim weight arbitrarily listed as 9, 10, 10.5, 11, 12, 12.5, 14 or 14.5 oz. at any given time by any given vendor for the same model when actual weight is unknown; Tips on how to avoid starting with a $1000 budget then ending with a loss of $600-$800, before ending up with maybe 1-2 average pair of LVC that you can actually wear after 3-4 yrs of trial and error.

I think such a thread would be a very useful guide for helping newbies navigate through so much LVC bs thereby minimizing significant financial loss. However, such a thread would likely be impossible since there are so many problems encountered in addition to the few listed above when buying LVC jeans.

Thoughts?

[sayocean]

dude, i understand there are faults with LVC items but for real, it seems like every time you post, it is to complain.. i'm just saying, no hate

i mean some of gripes you have (ie full frontal leg twist) are innate properties of denim and others like you blowing 1K and STILL coming back for more (shouldn't you have moved on after the first 500 blown?) is something most people dont really do. You could call up a retailer and ask them to measure a pair for you before you order (as opposed to just going by generic measurements provided on a retailer's website). If I was going to spend 200+ on a jean and I know there's a chance it won't fit, I'm gonna make damn sure that I know what I'm buying before dropping the 200..

[chris_n]

boom, enough with the bitchfest, electrum.

[beautiful_FrEaK]

why not just buy another brand then?!

[electrum]

dude, i understand there are faults with LVC items but for real, it seems like every time you post, it is to complain.. i'm just saying, no hate

i mean some of gripes you have (ie full frontal leg twist) are innate properties of denim and others like you blowing 1K and STILL coming back for more (shouldn't you have moved on after the first 500 blown?) is something most people dont really do. You could call up a retailer and ask them to measure a pair for you before you order (as opposed to just going by generic measurements provided on a retailer's website). If I was going to spend 200+ on a jean and I know there's a chance it won't fit, I'm gonna make damn sure that I know what I'm buying before dropping the 200..

The only time you ever respond to anything I say is when you decide to tell me what you think I should say, do or just put words in my mouth. Well as it is dude, I do have my LVC's pre measured by whomever I purchase them from (what makes you think that I don't?) Unlike many on this board I've never had problems with fitting LVC's. However, when I got my last pair they measured my actual size (the size I always get which happen to fit me perfect) but they gained an inch in the waist after 4 washes -- I guess that's my point, even when you do everything right sometimes LVC still manages to screw you...no big deal. Now if that's something that you obviously think I shouldn't complain about, then too bad that's your problem, I'll always complain whenever I have something to complain about. Nxt time you have a problem with my legit complaints don't badger me with some fabricated off topic bs about what you think I should or shouldn't post. Cool?