mrman

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Well, I could argue further that it isn't that simple any way you look at it; ethics vs cost, ethics vs quality, cost vs quality,... There may be a correlation but just as well there might not be one

I don't think that it's that simple, ethics vs cost

I like my moleskin french work wear jacket by Arpenteur very much. Similar to chore coats, durable and stylish, just look at late Bill Cunningham.

I've got the IH indigo colored duck type 3 also, it's very rigid fabric, capable of standing on it's own, recommended to spineless politicians.

12 hours ago, Maynard Friedman said:

In some respects, the member states are similar to your own states I suppose, so outsourcing to Portugal from Sweden isn't entirely dissimilar to a California-based company manufacturing its products in Texas, for example.

I just hope the UK can still find a good, mutually acceptable deal with the EU post-Brexit.

 

Yup, that's what I was saying, the similarities are obvious.

I'm with @Niro, hopefully the brexit will be reversed entirely, even though it's not very likely. There is no opposing force to the conservatives to challenge the process. Labour is weak with an even weaker leader and liberals too small. But you can always hope.

Of the four EFTA countries three, Norway included, are part of EEA. But EEA is not a customs union.

15 minutes ago, ColonelAngus said:

https://www.lividjeans.com/pages/our-story

 

 

you guys probably know about Livid Jeans, who are another Scandinavian brand from Norway that happens to make their stuff in Norway. I only perused their site so don't know with 100% certainty that all of their stuff is made there, but this just shows that it can be done.

Maybe you should get your facts straight. Yes, Norway, Sweden and Portugal are in Europe but only the latter two are within EU common market. It would not be smart to outsource anything behind a customs border, so a norwegian company is better off producing their stuff in Norway. For a swedish company they have more sound choices.

Great news, volvo! Bit confusing that from the outside the chest measurements is 107cm laid flat and from the inside (shouldn't be much bigger as measured from inside) it's 118cm, even though measured with 360 method. If that is how these are sized, have to look elsewhere as I'd need p2p 59cmx2=118cm and with 360 method something like 128-130. Biggest size is 124cm, damn.

@Iron Horse Where did you pick up those Lofgrens? I'd like to get them in size US11, JPN29, but can't seem to find them anywhere.

Just to make sure, I'm all for it that the labor force should get their fair share of the profits through decent wages. It's just that decent wages are not the same everywhere as living costs (food, housing etc) differ greatly. And as @JDelage mentioned costs are always a part of the equation. Companies are always balancing costs against the volume produced, otherwise it would be just a hobby. Many decide to lower the quality to cut the costs, but I doubt that is the case in this niche hobby of ours.

20 minutes ago, ShootThePier said:

I can't speak to Portugal's garment industry standards, quality control or observance of ethical labor practices. It sounds like lower wages in Portugal is a given. Lower wage = lower quality is not a forgone conclusion, but in many other industries it is a strong indicator.

You say that you can't speak of these things and still think that it's a given that the quality in lower. Lower wages do not equate lower quality, necessarily. It might be that the labor force is skilled but the local living costs are lower and thus you get the skilled labor force for less. Of course, it might be the opposite, too. But I doubt that it's the case with Portugal.

Another interesting observation, how many of you have been to Portugal and really know something of the country? Or are your sentiments built on supposition?

6 hours ago, garden gnomes in space said:

I think it makes perfect sense.  A Swedish brand making stuff in Portugal is doing it for one reason:  labor costs. I seriously doubt they could not do it locally, the price would just probably be more than most would be willing to pay.   Im not knocking IF, they are a small brand and have to do what they have to do.  For me, knowing that manufacturing got farmed out to a cheaper source would be and is enough to put me off.

...

Made in Italy means made by Eastern Europeans and Africans who get paid a lot less, not some grizzled old Italian who has been a shoemaker for 100 years.    As recent as 2 years ago NGO's found EU labor laws not being followed or enforced.  Its the same here in USA, just substitute Chinese and Mexicans

 

 

I'd like to remind you that Sweden and Portugal, even though they are independent, are working in the same common market, EU. So outsourcing to Portugal is 'local' in the way that encourages commerce within the common market. It's analogous in a sense that a company from California would outsource something to Texas, same common market, different states.

If I get it right, you are against outsourcing in general? Or just from USA to another country? When you buy something, do you personally check the working conditions or how do you choose what to buy, even MiUSA stuff? Or just believe that your favorite brands are doing the right thing? As you said, there are sweatshops in USA, too.

I'd like to remind that Portugal is in EU and that already is a guarantee that the working conditions and wages are not what they might be in an Indian sweatshop. The wages are not as high as in Sweden and probably somewhat lower than in the US but still decent when compared to prices of goods there.

I already commented on the fact of buying only locally (where ever that is) made stuff. Of course it's up to the individual if they want to limit their choices.

49 minutes ago, ColonelAngus said:

I don't own jeans from either brand because their fits are too skinny. I'm sure PBJ denim is more interesting but I think this is why you see brands like Rgt and 3sixteen using Japanese denim milled exclusively for them rather than Cone Mills denim.

I wouldn't call xx-003 skinny, it's regular staight and strider has a slight taper. Of course fit is subjective but after decades of squatting my thighs are not the smallest and neither fit pantyhoselike.

Haven't handled their exclusive denim so can't comment on that.

1 hour ago, ColonelAngus said:

To me fit reigns supreme and I don't care how cool the fabric is for any given piece of clothing....if it doesn't fit me then i'm wasting my money.

 

It goes without saying that they should fit. With japanese makers it is a bit risky but because the fabrics are so much more interesting than with the western counterparts I'm still inclined to try. When you compare eg PBJ denim to, say, RgT, the difference in staggering.

Interesting topic. I've got a few things from both RgT and 3sixteen, mainly because they are made to fit western body types, not because I think that they are superior. At 6'3" it is quite difficult at times to find fitting Japanese clothing but still I've been moving steadily in that direction.

What's interesting is that I've noticed a trend on ig that many buy only US-made stuff and swear that you could not find anything better. I get it that you'd like to support your local industry but overlooking everything that is made elsewhere is kind of weird, imho.  Besides making claims like that when you have only experience on US made clothes is plain stupid.

Interesting to see how this turns out as it's supposed to shrink 7cm/2.8" to match tcb measurements. I'm inclined to say that widthwise the jacket is spot on now, hopefully it won't shrink too much.

@dudewuttheheck Thanks, would you say that you wear D width in other shoes/boots? Or C <--> E? 

Great news volvo, interested in the measurements, both pre and post wash

If it's of any interest I've got the similar f-ds001 in size 42wide with the following measurements: shoulders: 20.5, p2p: 23.7, waist: 20.8, opening: 21.7, length: 28, sleeve: 25.6. The shirt is one-washed, haven't washed/soaked it yet to see, if there's more shrinkage to be had.

Edit: added a pic, sorry for the shitty pic quality

Thanks! Btw, where/how did you pick up the Clinch? Seems that they are very hard to find. Pancho and Lefty have some but my sizes are always out of stock...

@dudewuttheheck As you have both Lofgrens and Clinch, how would you compare them fitwise? Do you wear same size on both? Which last are those Clinch engineers in? Do you have experience comparing their other lasts? Thanks!

No one is trying to bully you. But you do not seem to get it that you should not feel obliged to post in every thread if you have nothing meaningful to say. That kind of behavior is called thread-shitting. And I feel that most of your posts have no relevance to the rest of us. Now it seems that you're having mostly a discussion with yourself.

This is a clothing forum and posts should reflect that. This is not a relationship forum, so posts about a boyfriend, who is useless, who is a millionaire, who you chose not to marry, who you have an on/off relationship with etc, are not what this forum is about. Neither are posts about illness, terminal or otherwise, weight loss etc, there are other forums for that, too.

Maybe you could take a while to observe what/how others post and after a while gradually start posting something the rest of us can relate to.

@Mojique I was afraid that you might not understand. My intention was not to come across as a bully or that you would feel unwelcome. @propellerbeanie summed it up nicely. And I didn't get the 'trust fund baby' reference, either.

There was some talk in another thread that as this is a clothing forum the posts should focus on just that. I feel bad for your health but maybe you should talk of health issues on another forum?

Totally off topic, but here goes.... I don't know how to put this and probably will sound rude even though I do not wish to. I just went through new posts from the last couple of days and it seems that @Mojique has posted at least half of the total with very little generally useable info on any of them and the same or at least very similar fit pics coming up in almost every thread. Any chance of cutting back just a little?